Hunting the Wild Caribou of Erebus

[Rystic]

So I've been keeping myself busy this last week tinkering with FfH's code. I'm making a mod that doesn't add anything substantial, but addresses annoying problems (like Ice not getting +1 near rivers, etc). I'm also trying to liven up teams that are boring. Today, I turned my attention to the Doviello, trying to fix their greatest flaw: the map generator loves putting them on Ice terrain, but they get no benefits from it.

Now, one solution would be to give them +2 food from Ice. But that'd be cheating. Illians already do that. Repeating mechanics is bad! Honestly, though, this is more of a situation of having your cake and eating it too. We want to make the Doviello function on Ice, but we don't want them to be overpowered when they're not on Ice. I tried working around that. The Doviello are a society of cave-man-like hunters. So I added a tech called 'Feral' that they start with, and does three things. First, it lets them build camps. Second, it gives camps +2 , -1 . Finally, it allows the 'Feral' promotion, which let's them capture animals after combat.

The result was greater than I expected. I played a Doviello game, on Erebus, with Cold temperature. It was a blast. Since deer/fur can normalize start locations, my capital was able to grow and function. I spent the first part of the game hunting animals for city locations. But I think the best part was that I really felt that I was playing what the Doviello were. My empire was a few scattered cities nested around some food resources. I really felt the nature of their team; like I was hunting the Caribou of Erebus.

And the best part? The AI gets it! I tried a game with AI Caradon, and he didn't just sit on his ass and freeze. The Doviello on Erebus functioned! It's a miracle!

Anyway, just thought I'd bring this up. I enjoyed my game so much it inspired me to post this. Hopefully, I'll have the TweakMod this Friday or Saturday. In the meantime, for anyone interested, this is the changelog. I'd actually like feedback on some of the ideas, or any suggestions to the list. I'm trying to figure out which ones I should keep/drop.

Download works now; my bad earlier.
Download:http://forums.civfanatics.com/downlo...=file&id=12369
Just copy the FFH folder, then go to FFH-->Assets and overwrite the folders XML and Python. Thread to come later today.

Spoiler:

1)Obsidian Plains are back.
2)Host of the Einherjar have Guardsman
3)+1 commerce on snow next to rivers
4)Great Commanders can build Code of Junil.
5)Cult of the Dragon reintroduced-ish. The Kuriotates and the Sheaim now have a building called Shrine. It's a UB for Pagan Temple that gives a bonus off gems and gold, and gives living units a chance to be born Cult of the Dragon.
6)The Kuriotate worldspell 'Legends' converts 25% of units in the world to Cult of the Dragon.
7)Roar will not fear a CotD unit. Instead, the unit will convert to the dragon's team.
8)Wyrmhold added; Great Prophet GPP; increased chance for CotD; free Chaos mana; only buildable by Kuriotates and Sheaim.
9)Demagogs born on a tile connected to a city with metal get that grade of weapon.
10)Demagogs will spawn from Enclaves.
11)Cathedral becomes Bannor UB for Pagan Temple. Gives all the normal bonuses, -20% maintenance, and gives a chance that Demagogs will be born with the State Religion.
12)Rally gives Demagogs weapons/religion.
13)Nomad gives +20% fire resistance. If you want to do Malakim-Veil in a desert area, go nuts.
14)Burning sands give +1 commerce to the Malakim.
15)Basium is now <bImmortal>1</bImmortal>, like Brigit. This really is mostly for the AI.
16)Sidar workers start with Hidden.
17)Hidden doesn't interfere with graphics.
18)Doviello start with Feral tech. Feral lets them build camps, gives camps +2 food and -1 commerce, and allows the Feral promotion, which lets them capture animals.
19)Dragon Slayers can upgrade to Luonnotar.
20)Grigori Museum becomes a UB for Pagan Temple. It gives +10% :culture, +1 happiness with marble, +1 GPP (Adventurer)
21)Diverse trait for the Grigori.
22)Stir from Slumber now costs 1200 hammers and has no tech prereq.
23)Priests of Winter become the Illian UU for Great Prophets.
24)The Deepening now converts 35% of the world to ice (up from 25%).
25)The Deepening (in Illian borders) does reverse Genesis.
26)Samhain now gives a temporary happiness in Illian cities.
27)Temples of the Hand have a small chance of producing Blizzards.
28)Auric Ascended's Snowfall has a small chance of producing Blizzards.
29)Amurite adepts are gifted spells for one node less than they would normally need
30)Amurite starter scout, warrior, and settler have Channeling I, Fire I, Body I, and Metamagic I.
31)If your state religion is Council of Esus, all heroes are born with Council of Esus.
32)Increased chance for units to start with CoE if it is the state religion. Units can be born with it even if they aren't created in a city with CoE.
33)Gambling House, Market, and Tavern get +1 Happiness from Esus.
34)Gibbon Geotia gets +2 Poison Combat, +1 movement and steals promotions.
35)All buildings that produce only food/healthiness removed from the Infernal.
36)Sect of Flies becomes Axeman UU for Infernals. The AC increases whenever it gets a kill.
37)Lowered the cost of Paramanders and removed copper requirement.
38)Hell Terrain recedes faster.
39)Mimics no longer steal Rusted.
40)Loki's sound is removed.
41)Dragons get bonus exp when a CotD unit dies.
42)When Calabim raze cities, Vampires on the tile act as if they feasted it to death.
43)The Defensive Trait now gives a free Palisade in every city founded by the leader.
44)The Loyalty Spell removes Enraged (not the promotion). You have to cast Loyalty again to remove Enraged.
45)Asylums remove Enraged.

Also, things I want to do/I'm considering/I'm trying to figure out:

Spoiler:

Some way to dispell blizzards?
Remove costs from units gained from Doviello and Clan of Embers' world spells.
Give double cottage growth from Sprawling.
Mary Morbus now spawns for barbarians. Killing her captures her, and other players may capture her from you the same way.
New features on Hell Terrain to make it more interesting.
If a unit is killed by an Elohim Monk, it won't be reborn as an Angel or Demon.
The Beckoning new ritual for the Infernals. Requires AC70. Reduces population in all AV cities, creates half as many manes. Teams who lose population get a research boost ((100+lostpopulation)*lostpopulation).
Infernal no longer affected by River of Blood (they're not alive).
Non-hero units buildable at Fanaticism are immune to fear.
If Orthus, Archeron, and TumTum are killed, the Barbarian Leader gets the "Weak" trait.
New Events added.
Make the Apocolypse more devestating.

[Fafnir13]

Nice mod. I will definitely be grabbing this once you make it available. I am much more a fan of little tweaks in a game then major overhauls(well...I guess FFH counts as an overhaul of Civ, but it's a special case ).

Originally Posted by Rystic

2)Host of the Einherjar have Guardsman

Nice. A lot of summons fail to distinguish themselves. Also, given the rather situational nature of loyalty, a little buff to the second tier of law mana is not hard to justify.

Originally Posted by Rystic

4)Great Commanders can build Code of Junil.

Nice tie in with the militaristic theme.

Originally Posted by Rystic

5)Cult of the Dragon reintroduced-ish. The Kuriotates and the Sheaim now have a building called Shrine. It's a UB for Pagan Temple that gives a bonus off gems and gold, and gives living units a chance to be born Cult of the Dragon.
6)The Kuriotate worldspell 'Legends' converts 25% of units in the world to Cult of the Dragon.
7)Roar will not fear a CotD unit. Instead, the unit will convert to the dragon's team.
8)Wyrmhold added; Great Prophet GPP; increased chance for CotD; free Chaos mana; only buildable by Kuriotates and Sheaim.

Interesting way of managing it. Does being popped with CotD give units any bonuses? If you're fighting against Sheaim as Kuriotates (or Kuriotates as Sheaim) you're just giving their dragon more chances to grab your units. Perhaps something like fear resistence and/or a 10% increase in strength would make it more desirable. Hmm...better yet, can you apply a buff to your own units with Roar? Would make for interesting gameplay and also allow your dragon to be a little more integrated with the rest of your army.
Also, does Legend still give a cultural bonus as well? I play with cultural victory turned off, but I imagine some people would miss it.

Originally Posted by Rystic

41)Dragons get bonus exp when a CotD unit dies.

Oh. Well that answers one question. Does it only grant it to dragons on your team?

Originally Posted by Rystic

9)Demagogs born on a tile connected to a city with metal get that grade of weapon.
10)Demagogs will spawn from Enclaves.

These should be basic to FFH2. Fixes an annoying bit of micro and something I would classify as an oversight.

Originally Posted by Rystic

11)Cathedral becomes Bannor UB for Pagan Temple. Gives all the normal bonuses, -20% maintenance, and gives a chance that Demagogs will be born with the State Religion.

Seems overpowered. The Bannor already have some bonuses in the direction of conquest. Now they would get a bonus in maintaining a large empire as well. They get the same thing following Order (nice synergy) but giving it to them for free seems a littler much.

Originally Posted by Rystic

15)Basium is now <bImmortal>1</bImmortal>, like Brigit. This really is mostly for the AI.

Lore says no. Gameplay definitely says yes.
Having not had Brigit very often, is her immortality the same as Hyborem or is of the Immortal variety?

Originally Posted by Rystic

17)Hidden doesn't interfere with graphics.

Nice fix. It bugged me to no end losing the unique look of my Sidar units.

Originally Posted by Rystic

18)Doviello start with Feral tech. Feral lets them build camps, gives camps +2 food and -1 commerce, and allows the Feral promotion, which lets them capture animals.

Doviello could use a little flavor boost. It also allows them to ignore hunting for a while, making it easier to focus on their conquest techs. Nicely done.

Originally Posted by Rystic

20)Grigori Museum becomes a UB for Pagan Temple. It gives +10% :culture, +1 happiness with marble, +1 GPP (Adventurer)
21)Diverse trait for the Grigori.

They could certainly use a few more adventurer points early on. I've always found it annoyingly difficult to get adventurers out in significant enough number to really make a difference.
What exactly is the Diverse trait?

Originally Posted by Rystic

22)Stir from Slumber now costs 1200 hammers and has no tech prereq.

Scary...if this means what I think it does...

Originally Posted by Rystic

25)The Deepening (in Illian borders) does reverse Genesis.

Reverse Genesis as in a snowy genesis? Is it permanent?

Originally Posted by Rystic

29)Amurite adepts are gifted spells for one node less than they would normally need
30)Amurite starter scout, warrior, and settler have Channeling I, Fire I, Body I, and Metamagic I.

Fun. I like how the Amurites get to play with magic right from the get go.

Originally Posted by Rystic

31)If your state religion is Council of Esus, all heroes are born with Council of Esus.
32)Increased chance for units to start with CoE if it is the state religion. Units can be born with it even if they aren't created in a city with CoE.

What does having CoE on a unit give you?

Originally Posted by Rystic

44)Loyalty removes Enraged.
45)Asylums remove Enraged.

Nice. Allows for garrisons of Lunatics without losing their general craziness. Not that I'm much of a fan of the new craziness, but that was another thread.

Side note: I don't suppose you like the old Rantine graphics enough to reimplement them? Just one of my pet peeves.

[Avahz Darkwood]

Originally Posted by Rystic

36)Sect of Flies becomes Axeman UU for Infernals. The AC increases whenever it gets a kill.
45)Asylums remove Enraged.

These are the only two I have any real issue with:

36: The AC increase may be WAY too much considering the number of units that can be killed with the Sect of Flies. It can get to the point that it is almost impossible to stop AC 100. Maybe if Hyborem increases it (and gets his fat ass out of his cities, I mean he IS immortal) that would be a good way to balance it out. Did you use the original Sect of Flies Graphics?

45: From what I understand Asylums are not quite the same in Erebus - strange experiments go on in there that can/will cause people to go insane. If Kael ever sets enraged to be "Always Hostile", then having a bunch of crazies running around attacking friend and foe alike without causing war may actually be fun. This is my BIGGEST complaint about AC 90 the AIs don't have to suffer from it and our units just wonder their happy way. If there are no war or enemies to attack they are just a waste of time and units. BUT if ALL empires have a bunch of crazies going around attaching willy nilly that can be fun. My suggestion was to just grant hidden nationally to each unit affected with enraged. That way the AI units will go around attacking and your units will do the same (of course without you controlling them)...


About Brigit and her immortality - Kael mentioned in the Lore thread (IIRC) that she has lost the Aura(?) of her god and in lore terms should NOT be immortal, but for gaming purposes she is. So your reasoning behind Basium is valid in this sense.

[Rystic]

Interesting way of managing it. Does being popped with CotD give units any bonuses? If you're fighting against Sheaim as Kuriotates (or Kuriotates as Sheaim) you're just giving their dragon more chances to grab your units. Perhaps something like fear resistence and/or a 10% increase in strength would make it more desirable. Hmm...better yet, can you apply a buff to your own units with Roar? Would make for interesting gameplay and also allow your dragon to be a little more integrated with the rest of your army.
Also, does Legend still give a cultural bonus as well? I play with cultural victory turned off, but I imagine some people would miss it.

I'm implementing Roar like it used to be. Also, yes, the Kuriotate worldspell still gives a culture boost.

Oh. Well that answers one question. Does it only grant it to dragons on your team?

It only works for the Kuriotates, Sheaim, and Illians, and only for their respective dragons. If you capture Acheron, for instance, there will be no experience gain.

These should be basic to FFH2. Fixes an annoying bit of micro and something I would classify as an oversight.

It makes Crusading so much easier. It eliminates the annoying micromanagement blocking my awesome super war!

Lore says no. Gameplay definitely says yes.
Having not had Brigit very often, is her immortality the same as Hyborem or is of the Immortal variety?

The reason for this is that Basium dies so freaking much. It's much easier to kill Basium than Hyborem. This hopefully will make him more of a challenge.

Doviello could use a little flavor boost. It also allows them to ignore hunting for a while, making it easier to focus on their conquest techs. Nicely done.

It's a lot of fun!

What exactly is the Diverse trait?

The Diverse trait makes it so units are born with a random race, either Orc, Dwarf, Elf, Dark Elf, or Human. It's pretty cool.

Scary...if this means what I think it does...

It's not as scary as you think. Because it's 1200 hammers, even if the Illians wipe out another civ early, it'll take them awhile to build it.

Reverse Genesis as in a snowy genesis? Is it permanent?

Yea, so you can get rid of those annoying spots your Temples of the Hand missed.

What does having CoE on a unit give you?

As far as CoE goes, I'm still playing with it. I have an idea for a new mechanic that I'll implement after my finals.

Side note: I don't suppose you like the old Rantine graphics enough to reimplement them? Just one of my pet peeves.

If I had them, I would.

[Rystic]

Originally Posted by Avahz Darkwood

These are the only two I have any real issue with:

36: The AC increase may be WAY too much considering the number of units that can be killed with the Sect of Flies. It can get to the point that it is almost impossible to stop AC 100. Maybe if Hyborem increases it (and gets his fat ass out of his cities, I mean he IS immortal) that would be a good way to balance it out. Did you use the original Sect of Flies Graphics?

I was thinking of making it so there's a chance for an increase on a kill. The problem I'm addressing is that the Infernals have no natural way to increase the AC.

45: From what I understand Asylums are not quite the same in Erebus - strange experiments go on in there that can/will cause people to go insane. If Kael ever sets enraged to be "Always Hostile", then having a bunch of crazies running around attacking friend and foe alike without causing war may actually be fun. This is my BIGGEST complaint about AC 90 the AIs don't have to suffer from it and our units just wonder their happy way. If there are no war or enemies to attack they are just a waste of time and units. BUT if ALL empires have a bunch of crazies going around attaching willy nilly that can be fun. My suggestion was to just grant hidden nationally to each unit affected with enraged. That way the AI units will go around attacking and your units will do the same (of course without you controlling them)...

It really addresses the problem with Lunatics. It makes them usable as garrison, and you can have a stack of them without fear they'll run off into the wild blue yonder.

Having a way to remove Enraged should have always been included somehow. If you're trapped on an island alone, your Enraged unit is lost forever.

[cabbagemeister]

A very nice looking set of tweaks. I'm especially enthusiastic about the Feral tech, which really does sound like it'll make playing the Doviello a blast. Finally those 4-beaver sites can be worth something! Just to clarify: is the Feral promotion bestowed automatically, or does it have to be purchased?

My only two concerns are with the sect of flies (though a fairly low % chance to increase the AC would be fine with me) and with Hosts getting guardsman. While hosts having guardsman sounds cool and is nicely thematic, I'd worry that it would make it far too easy to defend your mage stacks. The current implementation of Guardsman makes it so that one weak guardsman unit can neutralize all marksman attacks. So a stack of mages could have just one LawII mage and one very strong defender, and the Law mage could summon a Host every turn, which would force all assassins to attack the strong defender. I think this is going too far in neutralizing assassins, which currently can only be done by the bannor or by devoting a level 5 unit to the purpose of getting guardsman.

[Darksaber1]

With asylums, I see them providing "handelers", so the unit is still crazy, but not "visible".

[Valkrionn]

I used some of the same basic ideas for my Doviello+ mod... I DID grant them 1 on ice, so it's at least farmable, and 1 on tundra. I made them more animalistic, but you can't do that in FfH...

[FireBlaze]

Sounds like a pretty cool mod. Dunno why the crazy house makes people sane (Asylum has a negative connotation, its usually not a place of happiness, or any insane curing). Although I have to say, the best part of all of this was the thread title. Really got my attention

[Rystic]

Originally Posted by FireBlaze

Sounds like a pretty cool mod. Dunno why the crazy house makes people sane (Asylum has a negative connotation, its usually not a place of happiness, or any insane curing). Although I have to say, the best part of all of this was the thread title. Really got my attention

It doesn't make them sane, it just keeps the crazies from running everywhere

[Rystic]

Originally Posted by cabbagemeister

A very nice looking set of tweaks. I'm especially enthusiastic about the Feral tech, which really does sound like it'll make playing the Doviello a blast. Finally those 4-beaver sites can be worth something! Just to clarify: is the Feral promotion bestowed automatically, or does it have to be purchased?

Purchased, but it has no requirements.

My only two concerns are with the sect of flies (though a fairly low % chance to increase the AC would be fine with me) and with Hosts getting guardsman. While hosts having guardsman sounds cool and is nicely thematic, I'd worry that it would make it far too easy to defend your mage stacks. The current implementation of Guardsman makes it so that one weak guardsman unit can neutralize all marksman attacks. So a stack of mages could have just one LawII mage and one very strong defender, and the Law mage could summon a Host every turn, which would force all assassins to attack the strong defender. I think this is going too far in neutralizing assassins, which currently can only be done by the bannor or by devoting a level 5 unit to the purpose of getting guardsman.

I'm still field testing both the ideas. The Sect of Flies thing might be a bit much, but I have to try it first. I was considering a Sheaim hero that increases the AC on a kill, and maybe grabbing the graphics from Redactor in FF for it.

[Avahz Darkwood]

Originally Posted by FireBlaze

Sounds like a pretty cool mod. Dunno why the crazy house makes people sane (Asylum has a negative connotation, its usually not a place of happiness, or any insane curing). Although I have to say, the best part of all of this was the thread title. Really got my attention

Heh me too...


To Rystic:

....

When I think Asylum I think of Lobotomies, etc and the varied issues that causes. Even with handlers a armed up Lunatic would kill them. That is unless powerful magics are used and as such I agree with the loyalty part. Kael didn't though so until what I mentioned is done (as per Kael in the bug threads to do list), loyalty will be one of the most useless spells in the game - that is until that crown of command wielding beast starts marching. Yes I also agree with you about Hyborem not having a direct way to increase the AC,but he does have a powerful semi direct way in spreading the AV religion and directly smashing non AV cities. Where the Sheaim raise it by rituals and religion, the AV raise it by smashing the world to bits..., so all that to say a small percent with the sect of fries would be fine...

I will be checking the modmod out as most of those changes sound really fun and smartly implamented. I really like the feral tech and the Diverse trait, and at the risk of sounding like our local sage MC, I suggest a trait just like that a good few months ago for the base mod

[Rystic]

When I think Asylum I think of Lobotomies, etc and the varied issues that causes. Even with handlers a armed up Lunatic would kill them.

I imagine an Asylum more like a prison. Experiments, lobotomies, but at the very least cages, pits, anything to hold the Lunatics. My reasoning is that the Speakers would have a method of controlling their creations. If anyone knows how to properly handle insanity, it'd be the Overlords.

Yes I also agree with you about Hyborem not having a direct way to increase the AC,but he does have a powerful semi direct way in spreading the AV religion and directly smashing non AV cities. Where the Sheaim raise it by rituals and religion, the AV raise it by smashing the world to bits..., so all that to say a small percent with the sect of fries would be fine...

I expect people to assume the worst-case scenario with Sect of Flies. I still need to test it more.

I will be checking the modmod out as most of those changes sound really fun and smartly implamented. I really like the feral tech and the Diverse trait, and at the risk of sounding like our local sage MC, I suggest a trait just like that a good few months ago for the base mod

The first time I ran Diverse was the most fun warrior-spamming I've ever had. "Look, a dwarf!", "look, an elf!". Every time I built a worker, I hoped it would be dwarven.

Diverse also replaces racial UUs (eg, you won't get Orc Hunters, you'll get Lizardmen). The only units that can't be born with racial promotions are Dragon Slayers and heroes, although I'm thinking I should let heroes have random races.

[ICanHasName?]

42)When Calabim raze cities, Vampires on the tile act as if they feasted it to death.

FINALLY I can pretend to feast cities into oblivion

I especially like the Grigori stuff and the stir from slumber thing.

[cabbagemeister]

Commenting on the ideas you're considering:

Things I like:

Originally Posted by Rystic

Mary Morbus now spawns for barbarians. Killing her captures her, and other players may capture her from you the same way.
If a unit is killed by an Elohim Monk, it won't be reborn as an Angel or Demon.
Make the Apocolypse more devestating.

PLEASE do the Mary Morbus idea. I've never actually seen her in a game.

I also like

The Beckoning new ritual for the Infernals. Requires AC70. Reduces population in all AV cities, creates half as many manes. Teams who lose population get a research boost ((100+lostpopulation)*lostpopulation).

Though the research granted will need to be balanced. Also, you'd need to make sure the computer actually did it. But if it did, this would be cool for AV players and cool (read: more challenging) for everyone else trying to kill Hyborem. Er, that is, assuming Hybo ever gets taught to actually settle his manes.

Things I dislike:

Some way to dispell blizzards? No--blizzards should suck.
Remove costs from units gained from Doviello and Clan of Embers' world spells. Maybe for Doviello, but I think the Clan's need to run around frantically grabbing huts to pay for their new units is cool
Give double cottage growth from Sprawling. Would be way overpowered for Cardith--he'd be a research monster to rival Hannah, I think. What if you just reduce the Town->Enclave time?
If Orthus, Archeron, and TumTum are killed, the Barbarian Leader gets the "Weak" trait. Seems pointless. By the time these guys are all killed, the barbs aren't a threat any more anyway.

[Emptiness]

Originally Posted by Rystic

The Diverse trait makes it so units are born with a random race, either Orc, Dwarf, Elf, Dark Elf, or Human.

?

Originally Posted by Rystic

It's not as scary as you think. Because it's 1200 hammers, even if the Illians wipe out another civ early, it'll take them awhile to build it.

...but not nearly as long as if it had the current research requirement.

-------------

There's a lot of nice ideas here, but I think a number of them qualify as "substantial".

[Rystic]

Originally Posted by Emptiness

?

Svartalfar elves are dark elves. It's actually a separate promotion, but they use the same text tag.

...but not nearly as long as if it had the current research requirement.

Yea, but Stir from Slumber right now is pretty useless. It's cost is ridiculous compared to Eurabrates and Abashi, and you have to wipe out another civ. Most of the time, I end up getting Drifa after I get Auric Ascended.

[Rystic]

Originally Posted by cabbagemeister

Commenting on the ideas you're considering:

PLEASE do the Mary Morbus idea. I've never actually seen her in a game.

Since she's not very powerful, I'm considering having her spawn at Blight (AC30).

EDIT: I might spawn her at the same time as Yersirina.

If a unit is killed by an Elohim Monk, it won't be reborn as an Angel or Demon.

This is going to be tricky. The python doesn't tell you who the attacking unit is when a unit dies, so I have to be crafty about this if I want it in. I'm still mulling it over.

Make the Apocolypse more devestating.

I've actually already done this and posted it in another thread. Still, I'm going to add it in when I get the chance.

[loffenx]

31)If your state religion is Council of Esus, all heroes are born with Council of Esus.
32)Increased chance for units to start with CoE if it is the state religion. Units can be born with it even if they aren't created in a city with CoE.
33)Gambling House, Market, and Tavern get +1 Happiness from Esus.
34)Gibbon Goetia gets +2 Poison Combat, +1 movement and steals promotions.

As an CoE-fan I find these extremely interesting! How hard are they to implement, or rather, how hard would it be to mod )32 myself? I don't really see why units would get CoE unless built in a CoE-city though? Anyways, would be nice to have it near 100% for CoE-cities.

Finally my Svartalfar will be played as the sneaky bastards they were meant to be The changes address concerns many have spoken of, yet seem balanced and reasonable for the CoE-theme. Good work!

What does having CoE on a unit give you?

It gives recon units the mask ability, that enables them to switch in and out of hidden nationality.

[Etzel on Toad]

ok, so I'm fairly new at this game, but here are my twopence (you asked for it, dude!):

Originally Posted by Rystic

[...]
3)+1 commerce on snow next to rivers
4)Great Commanders can build Code of Junil.
[...]

3: dunno. what trade would you generate on snow? Icecubes? Snowballs?
4: seems fitting

Originally Posted by Rystic

[...]
7)Roar will not fear a CotD unit. Instead, the unit will convert to the dragon's team.
8)Wyrmhold added; Great Prophet GPP; increased chance for CotD; free Chaos mana; only buildable by Kuriotates and Sheaim.
[...]

7: Dunno. As you clarified this would only be working with the Sheain / Kurio Dragon. So there would be quite a bit of unit swapping as their units - if I got that right - would be the only ones to be born with CotD. Now those Dragons seem to me to be directly opposed to each other, so converting the followers of your respective opponent does not strike me as very flavourfull. Maybe give the CotD units a general immunity to the fear of the dragon? Maybe even a smallish bonus against the respective opponent?
8: Free chaos? For Kurios? Maybe...how about body?

Originally Posted by Rystic

[...]
9)Demagogs born on a tile connected to a city with metal get that grade of weapon.
10)Demagogs will spawn from Enclaves.
11)Cathedral becomes Bannor UB for Pagan Temple. Gives all the normal bonuses, -20% maintenance, and gives a chance that Demagogs will be born with the State Religion.
12)Rally gives Demagogs weapons/religion.
[...]

9:removes annoying micro-management
10: demoting them to towns? or rather to villages?
11: seems overpowered. Don't get me wrong, I play Bannor a lot and like them, but that early another -20 % to citiy costs sound very powerfull.
12: see 9

Originally Posted by Rystic

13)Nomad gives +20% fire resistance. If you want to do Malakim-Veil in a desert area, go nuts.
14)Burning sands give +1 commerce to the Malakim.
15)Basium is now Immortal, like Brigit. This really is mostly for the AI.
[...]

13: that would make them akin to Orks in one aspect. And could they thus enter burning sands? my normal, non-fire resistant units can't.
14: what would you export there? blisters?
15: dunno about Brigit (never had her), but a immortality like Hyborem would definitly fit

Originally Posted by Rystic

[...]
18)Doviello start with Feral tech. Feral lets them build camps, gives camps +2 food and -1 commerce, and allows the Feral promotion, which lets them capture animals.
[...]

I can't wait to try that out. Seems very promising and fitting!

Originally Posted by Rystic

[...]
21)Diverse trait for the Grigori.
[...]

cool idea! would theit elven workers finally be able to build on top of forests? To me as a non-elven civ they never are, no matter if captured, taken as slaves or WBed.

Originally Posted by Rystic

22)Stir from Slumber now costs 1200 hammers and has no tech prereq.
23)Priests of Winter become the Illian UU for Great Prophets.
[...]

22: shudder...I'm scared, now
23: as in flavour? Or just generated like GPP and then spawns a unit?

Originally Posted by Rystic

[...]
29)Amurite adepts are gifted spells for one node less than they would normally need
30)Amurite starter scout, warrior, and settler have Channeling I, Fire I, Body I, and Metamagic I.
[...]

29: so adepts basicly start with the tier one spell for every manatype you own? That seems way overpowered. The Cave of Ancestors allready gives you 1xp / manatype. Combine this and the Amurite player will start chucking out mages with combat three, mobility and all tier one spells, for the mere production time of an adept and some gold.
30: I'd remove body...otherwise they are way too fast. It seems to add flavour but to me it just adds power where none is needed.
Again, don't get me wrong, I like to play Amurites quite a bit, but that seem just too unbalanced.

Originally Posted by Rystic

[...]
35)All buildings that produce only food/healthiness removed from the Infernal.
[...]
37)Lowered the cost of Paramanders and removed copper requirement.
38)Hell Terrain recedes faster.
39)Mimics no longer steal Rusted.
40)Loki's sound is removed.
[...]

35: Can only help the AI
37: Why? How about not obsoleting SoK (and RadGuard btw.? Would give these Religions all the edge they need.
38: good idea
39: That always struck me as dumb anyways
40: Thank You! That alone will make it worthwhile! Once it was funny, but now I hate that guy.

Originally Posted by Rystic

41)Dragons get bonus exp when a CotD unit dies.
42)When Calabim raze cities, Vampires on the tile act as if they feasted it to death.
43)The Defensive Trait now gives a free Palisade in every city founded by the leader.
[snip!]

41: As in spirit guide xp (Your own CotD-units die)?
42: Yay for Vampires!
43: I like it the way it is

All in all I'm looking forward to this.
Etzel