[BTS] Better BUG AI

[Fuyu]

Yes, very soon, it was just delayed by a busy week. I plan (hope) to get it out this week-end.

[keldath]

awesome,

i hope maybe you can use revdcm ai autoplay - since that one works on mp, rather then the last version of this mod.

anyway, im looking forward for the update, thank you very much.

[Fuyu]

No, there will be no multiplayer AIAutoplay. That would require python and multiplayer knowlegde, or at least a way to test in multiplayer mode; and I unfortunately fulfill none of these requirements.

[keldath]

i see, oh well, it was worth a try

[Todd Hawks]

Quick question: When we play BAT + this mod in multiplayer (direct ip or whatever it's called), we always get OOS errors after a few hundred turns. And as soon as they start, we are unable to get rid of them again. We can reload the last autosave and continue one more turn and then we immediately get another OOS error.

The mod folders are identical (copied them from one PC to the other) and the second number of the OOS error (the one about used options) is also identical.

Any ideas on how to get rid of this error? It makes multiplayer impossible for us.

[keldath]

Todd Hawks,

hi, can you tell me if you are chaging something in bug options during the game? and maybe what options are you playing with?

[EmperorFool]

Originally Posted by Todd Hawks

And the second number of the OOS error (the one about used options) is also identical.

Are you talking here about the Pre-Chop and Sentry Actions options that must have the same setting for every player?

[Todd Hawks]

Originally Posted by EmperorFool

Are you talking here about the Pre-Chop and Sentry Actions options that must have the same setting for every player?

Exactly. All our BUG options are set the same way, not just the Pre-Chop and Sentry ones.

Originally Posted by keldath

Todd Hawks,

hi, can you tell me if you are chaging something in bug options during the game? and maybe what options are you playing with?

We didn't change any options during the game. Which options are you interested in, specifically? There are too many to list them all, I'm afraid.

[EmperorFool]

In the readme.txt for BUG you'll find the four options that you must have set the same for all players in the game. All other options don't matter. Two are for Pre-Chop, and I think the other two are about Sentry Actions or Governors Build Workers/Boats. if you have all six of those set the same, you're fine.

That means it must be something else going on. Unfortunately, OOS are extremely tough to isolate, and I don't know the Better AI code base at all to know if they do anything that might cause one.

[Fuyu]

You could try older versions, everything based on Better AI 0.90 or greater should be able to load your savegames. If you still get the same OOS even with the oldest versions then there's nothing I can do, however of there is a certain release that introduced that I could try to look at it. No promises though, that OOS part is in the exe and I don't have a multiplayer-debugging capable pc, and I am without any useful debugging tools and could only wildly guess.
If the error msg says something about options that would imply that you are not running the game with the same global or player options. Globals never change during the game and player options get synched reliably, even if you did change them.
Either I don't understand the error message or something is very very wrong. But I have absolutely no clue what that could be.

[Todd Hawks]

Thank you.

The error message is not about options. I just wanted to stress that the options are the same for both of us... just so I don't get the "make sure your options are the same" reply. Sorry if that led to confusion.

It's a standard out of sync error where it says that the person with the differing number should reconnect. Which works. But as I mentioned, only for one turn, then the OOS error comes back.

Trying older versions doesn't really work since we have to play a few hours for the error to happen. Hmm, maybe switching the version after the error is there? Maybe we'll try that, I'm not very optimistic, though.

[Fuyu]

I might have misunderstood you, but you could have avoided any confusion by just posting a screenshot.

Originally Posted by Todd Hawks

The mod folders are identical (copied them from one PC to the other) and the second number of the OOS error (the one about used options) is also identical.

This is why people think something about options is wrong. If I am was guessing correctly, your hash number, created from game/player options, differs from the hash created on the system of the other play. Even if you aren't using the same options, that shouldn't happen, and after a reconnect the error must be gone for good. Since you experience something different, I must be guessing wrong - but that knowledge doesn't help me either.

Originally Posted by Todd Hawks

Trying older versions doesn't really work since we have to play a few hours for the error to happen. Hmm, maybe switching the version after the error is there? Maybe we'll try that, I'm not very optimistic, though.

I was hoping you still have a savegame from the time you got that endless OOS. You could try to continue playing, with an older version. Worst case scenario: It won't work either.

I'm not optimistic either, since I have no clue what's going on there,
and because I'm a pessimist by nature. But that doesn't mean you can't try.

[Todd Hawks]

Sorry, I don't have a screenshot or savegame. Actually, I might have a savegame. I didn't specifically keep it but I didn't delete it either. I will take a look. The screenshot wouldn't tell you much, though. I have the blinking OOS message on screen and behind each player there are two numbers. The first is different, the second is identical.

I said in the part you quoted that the second number (that you call "hash number created from game/player options") was identical. You just highlighted the wrong part of my quote.
And if they are identical, the options are not the problem, do I understand that correctly?

After a reconnect, the error is indeed gone, but it comes back the next turn. Or maybe inbetween turns, during the AI move. I was not looking for the "guilty" party, OOS errors have existed since the release of Civ IV and it might have nothing to do with the mods at all. I was just hoping someone had experienced this before and had an idea how to fix it.

Thanks anyway and keep up the good work improving Civ IV (especially now that Civ V has turned out to be an utter disppointment)!

[keldath]

i tend to agree civ5 is not what i had in mind,

i hope people will continue to improve civ4, which is near perfection (kinda)

[Fuyu]

After 2 whole months, finally another update:

Better BUG AI 1.02b @ mediafire
Better BTS AI 1.2a r597
BULL 1.3 r219
BUG 4.5 r2245

Apart from a few small fixes and a better Civic AI (which will not have much effect with standard BTS civics but should improve AI decisions for some mods with more complex civics), the biggest additions in this update are once again brought to you by EmperorFool:
City Tile Status
Pre-Chop: Multiple workers chopping on the same tile will all stop, not just one of them.
Hovering over a building shows you when it was constructed.

city tile status: worked improved and unworked unimprovable are not marked by default. All options for that feature can be changed in BUG Options, Map tab.. ok, not all of them, colors can only be changed in the XML (BUG_GlobalDefines.xml)

[keldath]

yeah!!!! thanks!!!

[MarkJohnson]

So, when can we expect a Civ V version of this? Hopefully soon. Civ V is so uninformed on everything and we need this desperately. not to mention the AI is horribly stupid.

[Fuyu]

1UPT might be interesting for humans but for the AI it's just horrible, and I assume that's why the AI performs so poorly. I don't even know how to make the AI use the SoD the same way a human does, even though that should be so much easier, so really, don't expect me to go anywhere near Civ5 AI.
Apart from that I don't have Civ5 yet, or even a computer that's strong enough.

[Ayt]

Quick question. For some reason when I run this mod, Blue Marble isn't loaded. Any ideas?

[pob]

Originally Posted by Ayt

Quick question. For some reason when I run this mod, Blue Marble isn't loaded. Any ideas?

#145 "If it's just Blue Marble, setting NoCustomAssets to 0 in Better BUG AI .ini might work... This will break some functionality if you also have an old BUG version (older than 4.4) installed in your CustomAssets!"