New Player Feedback + one request

[Matsume]

First of all, sorry for my english , im brazilian and learned on my own.

Hi, i have discovered ffh a while ago and been playing for some time now.
I've been to all modmods for ffh and i like wildmana most for being faster(short await between turns), and some drastic changes like the rework on Esus.
I usually win domination games in noble dificult easy, but not always.
Wildmana is great but i noticed some issues(maybe its just me but im just trying to provide feedback)

*The goblins arches are especially annoying in this mod, they seem to appear earlier than other mods(how can a bunch of goblins have developed archery first than my empire?).They also seem to be stronger and come im greater numbers than the other mods, im some games i found my capital sieged by 4 golins archers (one of them with str+40%) early on.What slows down my civ development much.And this dont seem to happen with the computers civs at all.Why dont you do like FF and take from them the defensive bonuses?

*Is it me or the automated workers have a fetish or something for building farms out of the range of the cities?(instead of building mines, and usefull stuff near the cities).And after it stay inside the cities(with a lot of unimproved lands still arround the cities).

Again, im just providing feedback, ffh is the greatest mod for civ IV and wildmana is one of the bests modmods(if not the best).Just trying to help improve it.

And at least one "little" request...

Is there any possibility to add the Jotnar from FF to the mod??when?? They are my fav civ along with Lanun and RIfe messed with them making them OP (they dont have the 1 tile range restriction...).They are great cause have unique gameplay and have few but very powerfull units, the way i like it.

Thanks anyway.

[wapamingo]

Welcome to Wild Mana. This is the best mod

You have to play Wild Mana very differently than other FFH modmods as the early game is very difficult (you must must have 4 warriors defending your city before you do anything else; you must must move your settler with 4 warriors; at least this is what I found works for me). At the end of it all, I think Wild Mana is a notch or two ahead of the other modmods in terms of difficulty, so don't get discouraged. It takes a bit of time getting used to and learning.

To be honest, I like the difficulty aspect of it - its a lot more fun.

With respect to Jotnar, Sephi and the development team can speak to this. I played with them and I found them very strange to play with. Very different.

[Valkrionn]

Originally Posted by Matsume

Is there any possibility to add the Jotnar from FF to the mod??when?? They are my fav civ along with Lanun and RIfe messed with them making them OP (they dont have the 1 tile range restriction...).They are great cause have unique gameplay and have few but very powerfull units, the way i like it.

Thanks anyway.

I obviously don't think we messed them up, though the balance is a bit off still.

Really, why in the world would GIANTS have SMALL cities? It doesn't make sense. In RifE, they have larger cities but require more food per population... 3 food each. This makes them slowgrowing but giant, exactly as they should be. They also have some higher maintenance for number of cities.

Originally Posted by wapamingo

Welcome to Wild Mana. This is the best mod

I completely disagree, obviously, but respect your right to say so.

[wapamingo]

Originally Posted by Valkrionn

I completely disagree, obviously, but respect your right to say so.

Love

[Matsume]

Originally Posted by Valkrionn

I obviously don't think we messed them up, though the balance is a bit off still.

Really, why in the world would GIANTS have SMALL cities? It doesn't make sense. In RifE, they have larger cities but require more food per population... 3 food each. This makes them slowgrowing but giant, exactly as they should be. They also have some higher maintenance for number of cities.

Valk, your mod is very good,in fact i think yours and wildmana scored a tie, both mods have good features,but have some problems too.(i know you americans hate ties). I still play it, but i really think the jotnar are over.
But seriously, if you allow me to ask some construtive questions: Why dont you merge CAR mod into RIfe too? And if it is already, why wildmana run faster(at least in my pc)?
The major issue with Rife, at least for me its the time between turns, this was the cause im playing wildmana most of the time now.
And about the jotnar "cities", they live in clans not cities, and their society its conservative, they have their traditions.I liked the change 2 to 3 food per pop, but you should also increase their: mine productions(its GIANTS miners) their windmill bonuses(its GIANTS windmills), and so on for improvements(minus farms, pastures ...).
I have some ideas for making them more unique and fun to play, will create a thread in Rife forum.

I'm not complaining about the dificulty of wildmana, i am just complaining that the computers civs dont seem to get a single goblin at all...In the other mods its not uncommon to receive a "someone has been defeated" warning early on in the game.But here the barbs appears to hunt human players only.A more dificulty world off course is better, since it is the same for all in it...

[Valkrionn]

Originally Posted by Matsume

Valk, your mod is very good,in fact i think yours and wildmana scored a tie, both mods have good features,but have some problems too.(i know you americans hate ties). I still play it, but i really think the jotnar are over.
But seriously, if you allow me to ask some construtive questions: Why dont you merge CAR mod into RIfe too? And if it is already, why wildmana run faster(at least in my pc)?
The major issue with Rife, at least for me its the time between turns, this was the cause im playing wildmana most of the time now.

Best to answer in the RifE forum so as not to clutter up Sephi's forum, but to put it simply: We have plans. GreyFox has optimized a significant amount of our python... Same speed early on, but a greater than 25% speed boost in the late game. Next version will be much faster as a result... And that's WITHOUT the Car mod, which I plan to look into.

Originally Posted by Matsume

And about the jotnar "cities", they live in clans not cities, and their society its conservative, they have their traditions.I liked the change 2 to 3 food per pop, but you should also increase their: mine productions(its GIANTS miners) their windmill bonuses(its GIANTS windmills), and so on for improvements(minus farms, pastures ...).
I have some ideas for making them more unique and fun to play, will create a thread in Rife forum.

That really depends on how you view each citizen. The way we see it (Keep in mind, we dropped the Greek mythology and just kept the Nordic aspects, didn't want both as they combined poorly) each citizen working a plot is a single family and it's thralls (non-giants), with the city as a whole being a clan. It's just more spread out, move living space for the Giants. Which is the part that we objected to with the original implementation.

We DO have plans (at least two) for small cities like the Jotnar had, as the mechanic was good. It just didn't fit their flavor, in our opinions.

We decided that the improvement boosts were too strong... We may bring them back, but they'd need a nerf to compensate. One possibility would be for them to gain no innate yields from terrains, only improvements... Or a higher food/pop requirement.

[Matsume]

Originally Posted by Valkrionn

Best to answer in the RifE forum so as not to clutter up Sephi's forum, but to put it simply: We have plans. GreyFox has optimized a significant amount of our python... Same speed early on, but a greater than 25% speed boost in the late game. Next version will be much faster as a result... And that's WITHOUT the Car mod, which I plan to look into.

Thats good news, and if you guys achieved this without the CAR mod its great cause its gona make it still faster.

And about the jotnar, take away their innate yields from terrains and give bonus to every improvement that the Giantic size of the improvement helps(mines, windmills, lumbermills...)of course no bonus to farms, pastures and fishboats. Their cattle isnt giant as well, as their fish and so on for animals/croops.
That makes more sense to me than the atual innate bonus.

I think that this will balance their 3 food requeriments, unimproved lands is bad for anyone, but worse for giants that require much more resources to grow, but once the improvements are done and with their 3 plot work range will do.
PS: loved the slavery in the traditions. "Jotnar fights...tralls work..."

[Sephi]

Originally Posted by Matsume

The goblins arches are especially annoying in this mod, they seem to appear earlier than other mods(how can a bunch of goblins have developed archery first than my empire?).They also seem to be stronger and come im greater numbers than the other mods, im some games i found my capital sieged by 4 golins archers (one of them with str+40%) early on.What slows down my civ development much.And this dont seem to happen with the computers civs at all.Why dont you do like FF and take from them the defensive bonuses?

I find the defensive bonus the best thing of archers. Forces you to deal with them before they can start camping on hills. Next version of Wildmana there will be a lot less goblin archers around though, you will probably only see 1 or 2 goblin archers on average in a standart game.

Originally Posted by Matsume

Is there any possibility to add the Jotnar from FF to the mod??when??

that's very possible. I really like the idea of a 1-city radius civ. And it fits quite well to a giant race. They need so much food that there cities can't support a large population.

[Sephi]

Originally Posted by Matsume

And if it is already, why wildmana run faster(at least in my pc)?

wildmana has a nearly completly rewritten AI that is designed to be very fast. Also only new things are added if they don't significantly slow down the mod. I really hated it when I had to abandon epic games in the past because of slowdown.

In general there will never be a mod that has the best of all worlds, but that's not necessary anyway since nothing forces you to play just one mod.

Originally Posted by Matsume

I'm not complaining about the dificulty of wildmana, i am just complaining that the computers civs dont seem to get a single goblin at all...In the other mods its not uncommon to receive a "someone has been defeated" warning early on in the game.But here the barbs appears to hunt human players only.A more dificulty world off course is better, since it is the same for all in it...

the barbarians don't hunt human players only. But in Wildmana the AI builds a lot more military early to deal with the barbs. They have some trouble with barbarian heroes but I think that's fine. Barbarian heroes should be able to make an impact on the history of Erebus.