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Old Sep 26, 2010, 09:34 PM   #1
dickens
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CIV5 too easy in Immortal difficulty

Small map, 8 CIVs, 16 City States.

AI does not attack in early stage, which leaves a lot of time for buildings and improvements. Later on I build 5 swordsman and 1 catapult. This tiny army is enough to wipe out 3 CIVs, because their army is even smaller. Now I am the largest CIV in the world. The only headache is how to keep happiness. CIV5 seems too easy in Immortal difficulty compared with CIV4, CIV3 and CIV2.

Anyone have the same opinion?
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Old Sep 26, 2010, 09:55 PM   #2
Alexfrog
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Absolutely. They are worthless at fighting.
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Old Sep 26, 2010, 10:01 PM   #3
goodolarchie
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Any strategy revolving around the AI and combat is most likely going to succeed at this point. My cat wages war better than they do when he walks on the keyboard!

It's like playing chess against an opponent with no back row..
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Old Sep 26, 2010, 10:13 PM   #4
jaycuhbbb
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I think you got lucky, I've been declared early quite often. However, the enemy AI is horrible at combat as always. If the human makes a dedicated military effort the AI cannot win.
I see a lot of elements of civIII in this game. For example, gpt/resource trades for flat gold. I wonder if it's the same as in civIII, do you lose "reputation" when you break a trade like that-even unintentionally?. Everything is very hard to decipher because the diplo screen gives little feedback. And is illogical. An AI will ask me to create a pact to undermine another player. And when I decline, they ask again the next turn to declare on that civ?! Or another great one, last game China was at war with a city-state one turn and then the next makese peace, pledges to protect the civ, and complains to me about their sphere of influence (?!). Another CivIII feature, tiles are generally weak so there is more of a focus on the empire and not individual cities. Not sure if it's more or less fun.
Overall though, the AI seems to be quite active and "irrational" which makes games interesting. Nothing like religion and no tech trades means you truly are only for yourself, which is very fun.

Last edited by jaycuhbbb; Sep 26, 2010 at 10:21 PM.
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Old Sep 26, 2010, 11:04 PM   #5
Guardian_PL
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AI is a dead meat. Makes playing the game quite boring. I'm playing on Emperor with Greece now, and with 5 Companion Cavalry I'm mopping the entire continent

Seriously, I'm not a good player, and yet it's astonishing how crippled the AI is. Tokugawa declared on a City State, while having 3 archers and 3 Warriors. Two Archers blocked the way for the rest of his army and... Stayed like that for hmmm, 40 turns already? Ridiculous

Please fix this ^^
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Old Sep 27, 2010, 05:24 AM   #6
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Deity is no different. The only exception is when the RNG decides a 3000 BC DoW is in order. Horsemen/swords have near unlimited capability at eradicating civs. You armies don't decrease in size as you go about this. Just conquer, heal up, rinse repeat.

Smarter AI is probably too much to ask for. If Firaxis patched in some "cheat" bonusses for AI combat on Immortal/Deity that would already be an improvement.
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Old Sep 27, 2010, 05:43 AM   #7
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yea it took me 5 years to win a game on a huge map, epic speed, and immortal diffuclty for civ4. I've already did it with civ5 on day 7. Its not the AI economy, techs or anything else, just that they are utterly terrible at war.

One time I even DoW'ed Rome because they moved a settler near me, I only had 3 scouts, I found out later that they had at least 3 warriors, and an archer. Needless to say I killed all their units, none of my scouts died, I stole their settler, and eventually built my own, and stole the land. Killed some other weak civs that were more important at the time, came back about 40 turns later with 2 hoplites, and an archer and easily killed them completely.

Its still a shock to me how much they patted themselves on the back for this AI, when its the worst AI I've ever seen in a civ game.
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Old Sep 27, 2010, 05:47 AM   #8
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Seems like the only way an A.I. is a challenge in war remains the exact same case as civ4 ~ if they can outproduce (and outpurchase, now) you. A Civ only seems to reach this point if they gobble up an entire continent. Wars with any "small" empire is swiftly won, however I've fought larger empires and the wars drag on, not because I can't conquer or out-think them.. but by the time my units heal up from on conflict on the way to a city... The SoB has bought/built more units at that city, causing me to fall back.
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Old Sep 27, 2010, 06:31 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monsterzuma View Post
Deity is no different. The only exception is when the RNG decides a 3000 BC DoW is in order. Horsemen/swords have near unlimited capability at eradicating civs. You armies don't decrease in size as you go about this. Just conquer, heal up, rinse repeat.

Smarter AI is probably too much to ask for. If Firaxis patched in some "cheat" bonusses for AI combat on Immortal/Deity that would already be an improvement.
I am strongly opposed to making more nonsense/BS cheat bonuses, even on deity. This lead to chancy ticky-tack outcomes in IV where one could play at the same ability 1 game and win blow out games and then lose badly the next - with no difference in ability!

Also, be careful what you wish for. On larger maps, high-level AIs can get impressive empire sizes, and then taking them down is no longer so easy. If you feed them bonuses, you effectively repeat the "just about impossible" status that huge/deity/standard civ # had in civ IV. I don't know how anybody could be excited for more of that.

Rather than giving the AI bonuses, it could simply be encouraged to produce more military quickly with an increased emphasis on units that take strategic resource. Swords and horsies are only unstoppable because the AI isn't packing their own and shooting at you from behind with cities. Another alternative is to just have it spam archery units early and give invaders an arrow shower...although we're already getting complaints from people about the longbows ^_^.
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Old Sep 27, 2010, 07:06 AM   #10
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Try less civs or bigger maps so the AI can expand more. Or try to get cultural/diplomacy victory for a challenge.
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Old Sep 27, 2010, 08:12 AM   #11
Dark_MadMax
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Did you actually finish the game? Sure enough you can easily steam roll a few AIs early , especially on smaller maps , but with deity I was unable to win so far on normal+ maps. As the civs left alive get enormous tech lead by the time you finish first 3-4. They easily crush your medieval/renaissance era units with modern ones
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Old Sep 27, 2010, 08:58 AM   #12
oppy
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Did you actually finish the game? Sure enough you can easily steam roll a few AIs early , especially on smaller maps , but with deity I was unable to win so far on normal+ maps. As the civs left alive get enormous tech lead by the time you finish first 3-4. They easily crush your medieval/renaissance era units with modern ones
Haha This is exactly what I came here to say. I've been playing on emperor and it's very easy to take out a couple of AIs but then everyone single other AI declares on me and the game gets insanely tedious.

For reference, Emperor / random map / standard speed and if I kill AIs early I have yet to see a game where the rest just don't all declare on me same turn.
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Old Sep 27, 2010, 09:02 AM   #13
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And I thought it would be easy to code the AI to NOT throw his archers in front of my melee units.
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Old Sep 27, 2010, 09:09 AM   #14
André Alfenaar
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Rather than giving the AI bonuses, it could simply be encouraged to produce more military quickly with an increased emphasis on units that take strategic resource.
There is an Aggressive AI option in the game setup, if I recall this correctly. Did you try this?
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Old Sep 27, 2010, 09:21 AM   #15
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I think you are destined to control half the world in Civ 5 and then finish up with a huge power struggle between you and the 1 or 2 other superpowers. The question is, can you compete with the other side by using diplomacy on you allies to build an effective force or must you conquer half the world and then go mono a mono against the other half.
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Old Sep 27, 2010, 05:55 PM   #16
Monsterzuma
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monsterzuma
Deity is no different. The only exception is when the RNG decides a 3000 BC DoW is in order. Horsemen/swords have near unlimited capability at eradicating civs. You armies don't decrease in size as you go about this. Just conquer, heal up, rinse repeat.
This remark was a little premature. I was having a bunch of lucky games apparently. It turns out things are tougher than I thought in the average case. It does happen that a continent wipe on Deity succeeds, though, to this much I can attest. Making opportunistic use of AI vs. AI wars is an important step in doing so.
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Old Sep 27, 2010, 06:50 PM   #17
Dan Quale
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Its not the numbers of AI units that make them weak, they usually outnumber me 4 to 1 its how they use them. I hardly lose any units, maybe 5 total in a full marathon game, they are just plain dumb with them and too easy to pick off at range.
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Old Sep 27, 2010, 06:56 PM   #18
IAmEverywhere
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I've had civs declare war on me in the early game but once you defeat half of their attack force, they give up and run away. That and when I capture their capital and one or two other cities, they gift me the rest for peace.
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Old Sep 27, 2010, 10:58 PM   #19
ExCivFan
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I finish on deity... Emperor on civ 4 was harder than deity in this game. This game has so many problems it just isn't worth playing and the horrible ai is at the top of the list. If you micromanage everything (which is easy to do in civ 5 since it's so much simpler!) you shouldn't have any problem keeping up with the bs ai
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Old Sep 28, 2010, 01:50 AM   #20
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What's actually amusing is that the higher the difficulty, the more loaded with gold the AI is, and therefore the more money you can get from them through trade and win more easily
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