Advertisement
Civilization Fanatics' Center

Go Back   Civilization Fanatics' Forums > CIVILIZATION V > Civ5 - Strategy & Tips > Civ5 - War Academy

Notices

Civ5 - War Academy The compiled list of high-quality Strategy Articles for Civ5

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old Dec 01, 2012, 05:25 PM   #1
Browd
Dilettante
 
Browd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 5,877
Gender: Male
Faith Religion: How Does the Religion System Work?

Religion
How Does the Religion System Work?


"Just as a candle cannot burn without fire,
men cannot live without a spiritual life”
- Buddha


Introduction
Your Religion screen

Religion is one of the signature elements of the Gods & Kings expansion, adding new game mechanics and strategic options to an already rich game. Religion can provide you with valuable tools -- more , , , , and units -- to achieve any victory condition -- cultural, diplomatic, domination or science. This article provides an overview of the major elements of the religion system:
Other articles in this series explain how to found and enhance your religion, review in detail the many available pantheon, founder, follower and enhancer beliefs, and provide advice about how to spread and defend your religion.

Great Prophet
Key Concepts
  • Faith - a new type of “currency” or yield introduced in the G&K expansion and central to the religion system

  • Belief - the core element of any pantheon or religion, providing specific benefits depending on circumstances

  • Pantheon - a pre-religion belief that is absorbed into (and superseded by) a religion

  • Religion - a set of beliefs, consisting of a pantheon belief, a founder belief, two follower beliefs, and an enhancer belief. Establishing a religion includes two major steps: founding the religion and enhancing the religion.

  • Founding a Religion - using a Great Prophet to select a founder belief, a follower belief, and a name and symbol for the religion

  • Enhancing a Religion - using a Great Prophet to select a second follower belief and an enhancer belief

  • Great Prophet - a new type of Great Person that can be used to found or enhance a religion, to spread a religion or to create a new form of tile improvement - a Holy Site

  • Missionary - a new civilian unit that can be used to spread a religion (available only after your religion is founded)

  • Inquisitor - a new civilian unit that can be used to eliminate other religions from a city (available only after your religion is enhanced)

  • Holy Site - a new type of tile improvement that can be formed only by a Great Prophet, with a base yield of 6 faith.

  • Followers - population of a city following a pantheon or religion

  • Pressure - a mechanism used to convert followers of a pantheon or religion to another religion (or to convert non-followers of any pantheon or religion to a religion)
Note that the various faith thresholds and requirements described in this article and related articles apply to standard speed games. The standard multiplier for quick games is 0.67, for epic games is 1.5 and for marathon games is 3.0, as reflected in the following table:

QuickStandardEpicMarathon
Initial Pantheon requirement 6 faith10 faith15 faith30 faith
Increment for next Pantheon3 faith5 faith7 faith15 faith
Threshold for first Great Prophet134 faith200 faith300 faith600 faith
Increment for subsequent Great ProphetsMultiple of +67 faith for each increment (201, 335, 536, ...)Multiple of +100 faith for each increment (300, 500, 800, ...)Multiple of +150 faith for each increment (450, 750, 1200, ...)Multiple of +300 faith for each increment (900, 1500, 2400, ...)
Base Per City Pressure9642
Faith

Faith is the cornerstone of the religion system. Faith represents a new yield type in the game, similar to gold and culture, in that it is generated from a variety of sources, accumulates over many turns, and later can be "spent" for various purposes. Depending on the amount of accumulated faith, what beliefs you have selected, and your technological era, you can use accumulated faith to found a pantheon, generate a Great Prophet to found or enhance a religion, purchase religious units (Missionaries and Inquisitors), religious buildings (cathedrals, monasteries, mosques and pagodas), pre-Industrial military units, and, in the Industrial Era, Great Prophets and other types of Great Persons.

How to generate faith

You must generate faith in order to take advantage of the religion system. There are numerous ways to generate faith:

Shrine
Temple

  • Build faith-generating buildings - A shrine (unlocked with Pottery) will generate 1 faith per turn, while a temple (unlocked with Philosophy) will generate 2 faith per turn. The Piety social policy opener (unlocked in the Classical Era) halves the production cost of shrines and temples, and the Organized Religion social policy adds 1 faith per turn to the base faith generation of shrines and temples. The Grand Temple (a new National Wonder, unlocked with Theology) will generate 8 faith (and 1 culture) per turn.

    The Mayans and Ethiopians have Unique Buildings that provide faith-generation advantages--the Ethiopian stele (monument replacement) provides 2 faith in addition to the typical 2 culture, while the Mayan pyramid (shrine replacement) provides 2 faith and 2 science. In addition, the Celtic Unique Ability will generate 1 faith from an unimproved forest tile that is immediately adjacent to the city center (2 faith, if there are three adjacent unimproved forest tiles).

  • Meet, befriend and ally religious City States - The expansion introduced a new type of CS that provides faith. When you meet a religious CS you will receive 4 faith (8 faith if you are the first to meet them) in addition to the typical CS meeting gold. If you befriend a religious CS in the early game, you will receive 2 faith per turn (4 faith per turn if you are allied with them -- as with all CS bonuses, these amounts rise in later eras). Prioritizing religious CS quests can be quite helpful to accumulate faith.

Stonehenge
Grand Mosque of DJenne
  • Build faith-generating World Wonders - In G&K, Stonehenge (unlocked with Calendar) was changed from a culture-generating wonder to a faith-generating wonder. It is the only early-game wonder that provides faith -- 5 faith (and 1 Great Engineer point). Once you research Theology, you can also build The Hagia Sophia (3 faith, 1 culture, a free Temple, a free Great Prophet and 1 GA point) and the Great Mosque of DJenne (3 faith, 1 culture, a free Mosque, 1 GE point, and additional spread capacity for Missionaries and Great Prophets bought in that city). You can also build Notre Dame (unlocked with Physics), which now provides 4 faith per turn, in addition to 10 happiness and 1 GM point, or Machu Picchu (unlocked with Guilds), which provides 2 faith per turn, 5 gold per turn and 1 GM point.

  • Settle near a faith-generating Natural Wonder - Five Natural Wonders provide faith:
    • Mt. Fuji (3 faith, 3 culture and 2 gold)
    • Mt. Kailash (6 faith and 2 happiness)
    • Mt. Sinai (8 faith)
    • Sri Pada (4 faith, 2 food and 2 happiness)
    • Uluru (6 faith and 2 food)
    Settle a city near the Natural Wonder and assign a citizen to work that tile. If you pick the One With Nature pantheon belief, any natural wonder you work will generate an additional 4 faith. Since its UA doubles Natural Wonder yields, Spain can generate 8 faith from each Great Barrier Reef tile or 24 faith from Mt. Sinai.

  • Pop a faith ruin - In G&K, random ruins may provide faith. If you have not yet founded a pantheon, a faith ruin will usually provide enough faith to allow you to found a pantheon. If you have already founded a pantheon, a faith ruin will provide a significant amount of faith (often 60 faith) to speed you along to founding a religion. Of course you can’t count on popping a faith ruin, but it is helpful when it happens.
All of the preceding methods can help you found a pantheon and, later, found and enhance a religion. In addition, there are several pantheon beliefs that will provide additional faith to help you found and enhance your religion and a number of follower beliefs and enhancer beliefs can also help you generate additional faith.
How to use faith

Accumulated faith can be used for a number of useful purposes:
Missionary
  • Founding a pantheon

  • Generating Great Prophets that can be used to found and enhance your religion, help spread your religion or create a Holy Site to generate even more faith

  • Buying Missionaries to help spread your religion

  • Buying Inquisitors to eliminate other religions from your cities

  • If you have the appropriate follower beliefs, buying certain religious buildings (cathedrals, monasteries, mosques and pagodas) with faith

  • If you have the Holy Warriors follower belief, buying pre-industrial land units with faith

  • In the Industrial Era, buying Great Persons with faith. Note that to buy Great Persons with faith in the Industrial Era, you need a religion in the city in which you want to buy Great Persons; it can be any religion (not limited to a religion you have founded). You also need to have opened the social policy tree that allows purchases of that type of Great Person (Order: Great Engineer, Autocracy: Great General or Great Admiral, Freedom: Great Artist, Rationalism: Great Scientist, Commerce: Great Merchant).
To purchase religious units and buildings, chose the "Purchase" option in the city screen; available buildings and units will display their Faith costs. You can also use the "automatic faith purchases" feature on the "Your Religion" tab of Religion Overview; once you have accumulated the required amount of Faith, the building or unit will be automatically purchased in a city in which it is available.

Founding a Pantheon
Pantheons

A pantheon is a pre-religion belief (one pantheon belief per civilization) that can provide a helpful boost to empire development. Some pantheon beliefs provide additional faith, or happiness, culture, food, or hammers, or other specialized benefits, like higher population or border growth rates and enhanced healing rates for military units. Which pantheon belief makes sense for you will depend on the surrounding terrain, your civilization’s particular strengths and weaknesses, and your ambitions for the game.

When you found a pantheon, your pantheon automatically appears in your capital and in any other city you have founded. Your pantheon will also appear automatically in any city you found afterwards. However, once you have founded a religion, your pantheon will be absorbed into your religion and will no longer automatically appear in newly founded cities (but will persist in cities that already have your pantheon). Pantheons will not spread to other civilizations or City States.

How to found a pantheon

Founding a pantheon is a race. Each pantheon belief can be taken by only one civilization, so it is important to generate faith quickly to ensure that you can get your choice of pantheon beliefs. The first pantheon to be founded requires 10 faith, and each subsequent pantheon requires 5 more faith, up to a maximum of 45 faith.

Also, you will no longer be allowed to found a pantheon if, when the first religion is enhanced, there is a sufficient number of pantheons in existence to found the maximum number of religions allowed in that game (i.e., if 5 religions can be founded and, at the time the first religion is enhanced, there are at least 4 other religions and pantheons in existence, then no other pantheons can be founded).

Pantheon beliefs

There are 22 pantheon beliefs. The beliefs are typically terrain-based or based around improvements, with a few exceptions.
  • Ancestor Worship: +1 Culture for every Shrine in your civilization
  • Dance of the Aurora: +1 Faith from Tundra tiles without Forest
  • Desert Folklore: +1 Faith from Desert tiles
  • Faith Healers: +30 HP healed per turn if adjacent to a friendly city
  • Fertility Rites: 10% faster Growth Rate
  • God of Craftsmen: +1 Production in cities with population of 3+
  • God of the Open Sky: +1 Culture from Pastures
  • God of the Sea: +1 Production from Fishing Boats
  • God of War: Gain Faith if you win a battle within 4 tiles if your city
  • Goddess of Festivals: +1 Culture and +1 Faith for each Wine and Incense
  • Goddess of Love: +1 Local Happiness from cities with population of 6+
  • Goddess of Protection: +30% increase in city Ranged Combat Strength
  • Goddess of the Hunt: +1 Food from Hunting Camps
    World Religions screen
  • Messenger of the Gods: +2 Science in cities with a Trade Route
  • Monument to the Gods: +15% Production of Ancient/Classical Wonders
  • One with Nature: +4 Faith from Natural Wonders
  • Oral Tradition: +1 Culture from Plantations
  • Religious Idols: +1 Culture and +1 Faith for each Gold and Silver
  • Religious Settlements: +15% faster border growth
  • Sacred Path: +1 Culture from Jungle tiles
  • Sacred Waters: +1 Local Happiness from cities on rivers
  • Stone Circles: +2 Faith from Quarries
For more information about pantheons and pantheon beliefs, see "Pantheon Beliefs."

Religions

A religion is a set of beliefs that provides benefits to both the founder of the religion and to the owner of any city that has a majority of its population following that religion. A religion consists of a founder belief, a follower belief and your pantheon belief (which is absorbed into your religion at founding and becomes essentially an additional follower belief). When your religion is enhanced, you can select one additional follower belief and an enhancer belief. The Byzantines can select one additional “bonus” belief when they found their religion -- which can be any belief (pantheon, founder, follower or enhancer).

Like pantheon beliefs, each founder, follower and enhancer belief can only be taken once, so establishing a religion is a race for your desired beliefs. Also, there is a limit on the number of religions that can be founded in a game. For a given map size (dual, tiny, small, standard, large and huge), the number of permitted religions is one more than half of the default number of civilizations for that map size (i.e., 5 religions on a standard map with 8 civilizations, 7 religions on a huge map with 12 civilizations, etc.). Adding more civlizations to a map will not allow more religions to be founded.

At any time, you can obtain an overview of the current state of the religious world by consulting the Religion Overview screen. By default, Religion Overview opens to the "Your Religion" tab. The other tabs are "World Religions" (where you can see who has founded particular religions and the number of cities in which each religion has a majority of followers) and "Beliefs" (where you can see what beliefs each religion has adopted).

How to found and enhance a religion

The Hagia Sophia
Leaning Tower of Pisa
Only a Great Prophet can found or enhance a religion, and there are only four ways to generate a Great Prophet:
  • With accumulated faith

  • By completing The Hagia Sophia

  • By selecting a Great Prophet as your “free” Great Person with the Liberty policy tree finisher or the Leaning Tower of Pisa

  • If you are playing the Mayans, by selecting a Great Prophet as one of your long-count Great Persons after you research Theology
You should also be able to found or enhance your religion with another civilization's Great Prophet that you have captured, so long as the Great Prophet has at least 4 conversion spreads remaining.

The most common method of generating a Great Prophet is with accumulated faith. Great Prophets will be randomly generated in pre-Industrial eras after you cross various faith accumulation thresholds -- the first Great Prophet after you accumulate 200 faith, the second after 300 faith, the third after 500 faith, the fourth after 800 faith, etc. Once you enter the Industrial Era, Great Prophets will no longer be randomly generated and you will be able to buy Great Prophets and other Great Persons with faith.

When your first Great Prophet spawns, you can choose to use it either to found a religion or to create a holy site tile improvement (which will yield 6 faith). Assuming you can still found a religion, you should choose to found your religion. When you found, you will be able to select a founder belief, a follower belief and your religion’s name and symbol combination (there are 12 pre-set religion name/symbol sets, and you can edit the name of your religion).

When your second Great Prophet spawns, you can choose to use it either to enhance your religion, to create a holy site tile improvement or to spread your religion. Generally, you should choose to enhance your religion. When you enhance, you can select an additional follower belief and an enhancer belief.

For more information about founding and enhancing your religion, see "How to Found and Enhance a Religion."

Founder beliefs

There are 9 founder beliefs, providing happiness, gold, science, faith, culture or City State influence:
  • Ceremonial Burial: +1 Global Happiness for each City following Religion
  • Church Property: +2 Gold for each City following Religion
  • Initiation Rites: +100 Gold when each City first converts to this Religion
  • Interfaith Dialogue: Gain Science when a Missionary spreads this religion to cities of other religions
  • Papal Primacy: +15 to Influence resting point with City-States following this religion
  • Peace Loving: +1 Global Happiness for every 5 followers of this religion in non-enemy foreign cities
  • Pilgrimage: +2 Faith for each foreign city following this religion
  • Tithe: +1 Gold for every 4 followers of this religion
  • World Church: +1 Culture for every 5 followers of this religion in other civilizations
For more information about founder beliefs and how they can facilitate various strategies, see "Founder Beliefs."

Follower beliefs

There are 16 follower beliefs, allowing you or any other civilization with a city that has a majority of its population following your religion to buy religious buildings or pre-Industrial land units, receive boosts in the yields from other buildings (like shrines, temples and gardens), or enjoy food, growth or production benefits:
  • Asceticism: Shrines provide +1 Local Happiness in Cities with 3 followers
  • Cathedrals: Use Faith to purchase Cathedrals (+1 Faith, +3 Culture, +1 Local Happiness, Artist Specialist slot)
  • Choral Music: Temples provide +2 Culture in Cities with 5 followers
  • Divine Inspiration: Each World Wonder provides +2 Faith in city
  • Feed the World: Shrines and Temples provide +1 Food each in city
  • Guruship: +2 Production if city has a Specialist
  • Holy Warriors: Use Faith to purchase pre-Industrial land units
  • Liturgical Drama: Amphitheaters provide +1 Faith in cities with 3 followers
  • Monasteries: Use Faith to purchase Monasteries (+2 Faith, +2 Culture, more with Wine or Incense)
  • Mosques: Use Faith to purchase Mosques (+3 Faith, +2 Culture, +1 Local Happiness)
  • Pagodas: Use Faith to purchase Pagodas (+2 Faith, +2 Culture, +2 Local Happiness)
  • Peace Gardens: Gardens provide +2 Local Happiness
  • Religious Art: Hermitage provides +8 Culture in city
  • Religious Center: Temples provide +2 Local Happiness in cities with 5 followers
  • Religious Community: +1% Production for each follower (max +15%)
  • Swords into Plowshares: 15% faster Growth rate for city if not at war
For more information about follower beliefs and how they can enhance various strategies, see "Follower Beliefs."

Enhancer beliefs

There are 9 enhancer beliefs, which are intended to facilitate the spread of your religion or to provide other benefits from spread of your religion:
  • Defender of the Faith: +20% Combat near friendly Cities that follow this Religion
  • Holy Order: Missionaries and Inquisitors cost 30% less Faith
  • Itinerant Preachers: Religion spreads to cities 30% further away
  • Just War: +20% Combat near enemy Cities that follow this Religion
  • Messiah: Prophets 25% stronger and earned with 25% less Faith
  • Missionary Zeal: Missionary conversion strength +25%
  • Religious Texts: Religion spreads 34% faster (68% with Printing Press)
  • Religious Unity: Religion spreads to friendly city-states at double rate
  • Reliquary: Gain 50 Faith each time a Great Person is expended
For more information about enhancer beliefs and how they can facilitate various strategies, see "Enhancer Beliefs."

Spreading and defending your religion

Your religion will automatically appear in the city in which you found your religion (typically your capital, but you can relocate your first Great Prophet to another city and found your religion there, if you prefer). Unlike your pantheon, your religion will not automatically appear in your other cities. You must spread your religion to your other cities and to cities of other civilizations and to City States. There are two ways to spread religion to other cities:
  • Manual spread through use of Great Prophets and Missionaries
  • Passive spread through religious pressure
Manual Spread - Each Great Prophet can spread your religion 4 times and each Missionary can spread your religion 2 times (and one additional spread for each, if the Great Prophet or Missionary is purchased in the city that has the Great Mosque of DJenne). To spread to another city, your Great Prophet or Missionary must be immediately adjacent to your target city’s center tile. Great Prophets can travel to any location without penalty, while Missionaries must either have Open Borders or risk suffering attrition.

One common technique to get your religion’s spread started early is to buy a Missionary in your holy city before enhancing your religion, and use the Missionary to spread your religion to two nearby cities. This will delay enhancement of your religion (as you re-accumulate faith to the 300 level), but may trigger a beneficial cascade of religion adoptions by surrounding cities as a result of religious pressure.

Religious Pressure - Each city with a majority religion exerts religious “pressure” on neighboring cities. Once pressure reaches certain levels, a citizen of a neighboring city will convert to that religion (become a “follower”). Once the followers of a religion are a majority of that city’s population, that city will also start exerting religious pressure on its neighboring cities, potentially triggering a cascade (or snowball) effect as neighboring cities experience pressure from multiple cities.

Religious Pressure
By default, each city exerts 6 pressure on cities located within 10 tiles. So, if there are 4 cities of your religion within 10 tiles of a given city, that city will be experiencing 24 (6 x 4) pressure. The Itinerant Preachers enhancer belief extends the effect of pressure to 13 tiles, while the Religious Texts enhancer belief will result in 8 pressure (and later 10 pressure, after Printing Press is researched). Because both of these enhancer beliefs facilitate religious spread, they are popular with both human players and the AI.

Inquisitor
Each Holy City exerts a special type of “internal” pressure that is intended to help it maintain its Holy City status. That internal pressure is only experienced by the Holy City, and not neighboring cities. Accordingly, a Holy City generally exerts the same pressure on neighboring cities as other cities do. But, if the Holy City has the Grand Temple, the Holy City’s external pressure on neighboring cities is doubled (e.g., from 6 pressure to 12 pressure).

Inquisitors - Inquisitors serve several important purposes to combat the spread of other religions to your cities:
  • An Inquisitor can deter other civilizations’ Great Prophets and Missionaries from manually spreading their religion to the city in which the Inquisitor is located. An Inquisitor has no effect on passive pressure from other cities.

  • An Inquisitor can purge all other religions from a city that you own (that use consumes the Inquisitor). This is the only Inquisitor effect that can be replicated by a Great Prophet.

  • An Inquisitor can extinguish the Holy City status of an enemy Holy City that you have conquered (that use also consumes the Inquisitor).
For further discussion of religious pressure, spread mechanics and strategies, see "Spreading and Defending your Religion."

Conclusion

Religion adds a new strategic layer to Civilization V, with a new yield type - faith - and new sources of happiness, gold, culture, science, food, military units, and defensive and offensive military advantages, and new strategic opportunities and trade-offs. Astute use of religion can help you achieve any victory condition more quickly and more easily. Conversely, your opponents’ clever or aggressive use of religion may foil your ambitions. That tension can result in very interesting (and sometimes frustrating) game play.

Last edited by Browd; Feb 22, 2014 at 09:28 PM.
Browd is online now   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 12, 2013, 02:00 PM   #2
Bobby Digital
Chieftain
 
Bobby Digital's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 20
is there any reason why one would de-prioritize religion or even forgo it outright?
Bobby Digital is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 12, 2013, 02:36 PM   #3
Bandobras Took
Emperor
 
Bandobras Took's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Orem, UT
Posts: 1,692
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby Digital View Post
is there any reason why one would de-prioritize religion or even forgo it outright?
Saving maintenance on Faith buildings, building an extra couple of troops to knock out an early neighbor, and letting an AI do all the work of founding a spreading a religion to you all spring to mind.
__________________
You know, this is starting to become my favorite thread.
Bandobras Took is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 12, 2013, 02:56 PM   #4
Browd
Dilettante
 
Browd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 5,877
Gender: Male
Agree. This is addressed briefly in the How to Found and Enhance article:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showth...5#shouldifound
Browd is online now   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 21, 2013, 08:00 AM   #5
khaletski
Chieftain
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 5
Quote:
Pantheons will not spread to other civilizations or City States.
I took desert folklore and found religion. Than I spreaded my religion to city of other nation and its city start to collect faith from desert tiles! So maybe pantheons spread to other civilization? Here hot-seat save before religion changing:
http://rghost.ru/43205237
khaletski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 21, 2013, 01:10 PM   #6
Pouakai
Tangaroa

 
Pouakai's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: The Republic of New Zealand
Posts: 6,176
That's because when you found a religion the pantheon belief is part of that religion. When it's just a Pantheon (i.e. you have the lightning bolt symbol on your city banners) it will only spread to your cities and not outside of your territory
Pouakai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 26, 2013, 01:07 PM   #7
Moriarte
Emperor
 
Moriarte's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,526
Fantastic guide, Browd. Think it's time for you to adopt a religious avatar .

I do have a question though, maybe you now:

Quote:
by default, each city exerts 6 pressure on cities located within 10 tiles
Quote:
Once pressure reaches certain levels, a citizen of a neighboring city will convert to that religion
Exactly how many pressure points are needed for one citizen to be converted?

Thanks.
Moriarte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 27, 2013, 05:16 PM   #8
Browd
Dilettante
 
Browd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 5,877
Gender: Male
Thanks!

On pressure, the mechanics are a bit obscure to me. As a general proposition, it appears that 100 accumulated pressure is required to convert a citizen, but it seems to be more complex than that, with some "thumb on the scale" benefits for incumbent religions (including atheism, which can be a majority religion). Some folks over in the mods forums were poking around, but their exploration shed little light on the subject for me (as a non-coder type): http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=481624
Browd is online now   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 31, 2013, 12:47 PM   #9
GamerKG
King
 
GamerKG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 774
I am pretty sure pressure is applied as long as 1 full citizen of the religion is present. I don't think you need to have majority to spread religion at all.

If you go into a game and pay very close attention, cities exert pressure with 1 convert but no majority, and they exert pressure of multiple religions as long as multiple are present in the city.

Because the game doesn't show you pressure applied until there are already converts, I can't tell if pressure is applied before a full conversion of any citizens, but I doubt it.
GamerKG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 31, 2013, 02:55 PM   #10
Browd
Dilettante
 
Browd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 5,877
Gender: Male
Are you referring to the pressures you observe when you mouse-hover a city banner? E.g., in a given city with, say, 10 pop, you might see 5 followers of Christianity at 36 pressure, 2 followers of Buddhism at 18 pressure and 1 follower of Shinto at 12 pressure?
Browd is online now   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 31, 2013, 08:52 PM   #11
Pouakai
Tangaroa

 
Pouakai's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: The Republic of New Zealand
Posts: 6,176
Pressure has to be applied before citizen is converted, otherwise they wouldn't be converted
Pouakai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Feb 02, 2013, 12:48 AM   #12
GamerKG
King
 
GamerKG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 774
Yes, but you can have multiple cities all with no majority but all with converted citizens. And they must be getting the pressure from somewhere...and they aren't within reach of the capital.

But on the other hand I am sure the capital stays at only the pressure on itself until other cities have majorities, so maybe you're right. Hmm.
GamerKG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Feb 02, 2013, 06:31 AM   #13
Browd
Dilettante
 
Browd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 5,877
Gender: Male
Minority followers of a religion do not broadcast pressure to other cities--they do receive/experience pressure from other cities.

Easiest case is when you are first, and extremely early, to found a religion (say, you're Ethiopia AND you popped a big faith ruin), and you've founded a couple of cities within 10 tiles of your capital, plus a couple of CSs are also in range.. Clearly the only source of pressure on the map will be your capital, experiencing 30 internal holy city pressure and broadcasting 6 pressure to your two other cities and the two CSs.

Initially, nothing shows up when you mouse-hover the various cities -- your 2 cities show your old pantheon and the CSs show nothing.

Roll forward X turns (still no one else has founded a religion) and you find that you have one follower in each of the CSs, each receiving 6 pressure (from your capital). In your two cities, one city (with 4 pop) shows 2 pantheon followers and 1 religion follower (receiving 6 pressure) and your other city (3 pop) shows 1 pantheon follower and 1 religion follower (6 pressure) and no longer shows the pantheon lightening bolt (neither your religion nor your pantheon is majority anymore). Importantly, your capital still just shows 30 internal pressure -- none of those minority followers in the CSs or your other cities is exerting any pressure on your capital. Minority followers in a city do not broadcast any pressure.

Roll forward Y turns, and you find that your two cities are now majority your religion (5 pop, with 3 followers, and 4 pop, with 2 followers). Because each of those cities is within 10 tiles of each other and the capital, each of those cities shows 12 pressure (6 from your capital and 6 from the other) and your capital is showing 42 pressure (30 internal holy city pressure and 12 pressure from your other 2 cities). When you look at the CSs, one of them (6 pop) is in range of all 3 of your cities, so it shows 18 pressure, but still only has 2 followers, so no majority religion. The other CS (also 6 pop) is only in range of your capital, so it still shows just 6 pressure and only has one follower.

Your nearest neighbor now founds his religion. His capital is not in range of any of your cities, but he is in range of the second CS (the one with 6 pressure and 1 follower). When he founds, you won't see any change in pressure at that CS, since it hasn't caused any conversions yet. To get a leg up, you send a missionary to that CS, convert 4 followers, and your religion is now in the majority, but still only shows 6 pressure (since only your capital is in range). If you look back at your capital, it will show 48 pressure - 30 internal holy city pressure plus 6 pressure each from your other 2 cities and 6 pressure from this newly converted CS.

Roll forward Z turns, and you see that CS (now 7 pop) still has 4 followers of your religion (still 6 pressure), but the other guy's religion now has 1 follower with 12 pressure! What gives? Obviously, he has 2 majority-religion cities in range of that CS -- his holy city and some other random city, maybe somewhere in the fog (causing you to mutter to yourself, "I gotta do a better job scouting").

Anyway, what's the point of this elaborate example? Focus on the interplay of that CS and your capital. If that lonely, minority follower of the other guy's religion could exert pressure on your capital, you would expect (if enough turns passed) that one follower would eventually show up in your capital with (presumably) 6 pressure. But no. It doesn't matter how many turns go by; as long as your religion is majority in a given city, including that specific CS, the only pressure that city (or CS) will broadcast is the pressure from your religion.
Browd is online now   Reply With Quote
Old Feb 04, 2013, 01:57 PM   #14
Buccaneer
Deity
 
Buccaneer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 3,515
That was a great write up. However I remain unconvinced that religion, apart from minor bonuses, allows you to win more easily, esp compared to adopting someone else's or even ignoring it. I can and have seen short-term bonuses (like the extra units holy warriors can provide) but not sure about longterm benefits apart from generating faith for Great Persons. That was what I meant by diminishing returns. I think it's a great addition to the game but I believe its opportunity cost/benefits are not that great.
Buccaneer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Feb 05, 2013, 12:21 PM   #15
Streams
Warlord
 
Streams's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Berlin
Posts: 133
If you rack up faith, for example, and have enough for 4 great scientists, you can bulb them all 8 turns after Research Labs and you'll get to the spaceship parts in no time. This doesn't really have to do with religion however, but with good bonuses you can whip up some extra wonders, or take down your neighbor faster.

Or you can end up with a cray amount of gold and can buy entire armies in the span of a couple of turns.
__________________
"Endless rails for freedom trains."
Streams is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Feb 05, 2013, 01:16 PM   #16
Buccaneer
Deity
 
Buccaneer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 3,515
That was why I mentioned the advantage of buying GP with faith. It seems that gold or science or culture bonuses will not ever amount to much mid-late game considering the expenses of missionaries, inquisitors and prophets. If late game GPs are the goal, simply use faith to build more faith.
Buccaneer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Feb 06, 2013, 05:22 AM   #17
Streams
Warlord
 
Streams's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Berlin
Posts: 133
Doable, but with your own religion you can pick the beliefs that would help your goal better. Of course, there is the option of waiting for the AI's religion to drop (capture prophets from different religions so as to maximize on needed aspects), but it would be a game of chance then.

Get Tithe and spread it to everyone. Insane amounts of Gold. Someone else's Tithe won't do the job.

In regards to spreading your religion: in my last game I had a dominant religion, without me giving a damn about it. Itinerant Preachers did all the work for me. Nothing bought with faith except for one wrongly used missionary and 3 Great Scientists (I think there was also a fourth one just for kicks at some point).

Yes, you are right in one aspect: you don't really need a religion to get certain things. But one that id developed right, can help you get extra benefits, and more faith.
__________________
"Endless rails for freedom trains."
Streams is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Feb 08, 2013, 06:51 AM   #18
Homusubi
Kampaku
 
Homusubi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 862
How important is religion to a G&K game? I don't have G&K at the moment and am considering getting it, but it's expensive and I'm not sure how much new content the religion system adds. It seems like an interesting strategic element, but I'm not sure how much of one it is.

P.S. Half the enjoyment for me would come from something along the lines of the Vikings founding Buddhism as in the screenshot above.
Homusubi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Feb 08, 2013, 06:57 AM   #19
Browd
Dilettante
 
Browd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 5,877
Gender: Male
Religion adds richness to the game -- more choices, more ways to gain small advantages that are tailored to your desired strategy.

G&K also offers a lot more than religion, including revamped combat mechanics (100 HP scale vs. 10 HP, new units, new naval warfare mechanics) and espionage (which some decry and others love, and it is a game option than can be toggled on and off, like barbarians, ancient ruins, etc.).

I would recommend getting it as part of the CiV "Gold" package that is soon to be released. I believe that will include G&K and all of the DLCs and should be reasonably priced.
Browd is online now   Reply With Quote
Old Feb 08, 2013, 01:06 PM   #20
Buccaneer
Deity
 
Buccaneer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 3,515
I, as usual, agree with Browd. The advantages of religion is in the cool choices and adding richness but one should not overestimate its minor bonuses. G&K is an incredible expansion even apart from religion.
Buccaneer is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Go Back Civilization Fanatics' Forums > CIVILIZATION V > Civ5 - Strategy & Tips > Civ5 - War Academy > [G&K] Religion: How Does the Religion System Work?

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



Advertisement

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:07 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
This site is copyright © Civilization Fanatics' Center.
Support CFC: Amazon.com | Amazon UK | Amazon DE | Amazon CA | Amazon FR