[BTS] SGOTM 15 - Xteam

[zamint3]

OK - let's build an army.

Research: Construction (4T hopefully) - Meditation

Civics: PS+OR, PS will net us 10 each turn building units in Delhi, Bombay and Vij

Delhi: Spear-Axe-Cats
Bombay: Axe-Axe-Cats
Vij: Axe-Cats
Pat: Barracks (1 chop) -Cats
Varanasi: Barracks (1 chop) - Cats

Workers will complete the road network to Pat and start prechopping for cats.

What kind of demands do we give in to? I don't suppose we'll give away MC but apart from that Hammu and Hatse can have anything. Toku will be ignored.

If nothing happens I'll play until Med is in. GE will be ready in Pat.
I would like to play in about 24-30 hours from now.

[leif erikson]

Looks good.

On demands, think we have to see what happens with Hammu. With the Cats that will be needed for Toku, may have to give in for MC? With the bug noted above, will have to look for WHEOOHN each turn and see. If he gets to this anyway, no sense giving him anything, just start praying.

[Undecided]

I mostly agree with the PPP.

The only thing i'd suggest is switching out of OR as soon as the last building is completed and we're only building up our military.

Your plan regarding demands is the best solution i think so go ahead.

Hoping that we're getting the AP otherwise this will get alot more interesting. Not that it isn't already.

[Cactus Pete]

Like the plan.

Agree with Undecided that we can get out of OR, once barracks completed and enough turns have passed after switch to PS.

Green light to Med from here.

[Mad Professor]

Looks good to me.

I agree with the change out of OR after the buildings are done.

[Htadus]

I see the storm clouds gathering . Let the Lord of Chaos cause confussion among Toku's.

[zamint3]

Originally Posted by Undecided

Hoping that we're getting the AP otherwise this will get alot more interesting.

Spoiler:

300BC: AP built in England

Report and save shortly.

[zamint3]

Turnlog:

T100: Switch to PS.
Fire the engineer.
Start a spear in Delhi.

IBT: On Machiavellis list of wealth, Hammu is #3 and Toku #8, neither Hatse nor us is on the list.
Corn at Bombay is within our borders.
Bombay finishes axe and start another.

T101: Research is going down as maintenance is going up.

IBT: We meet the English Tokugawa in the name of Elizagawa, he/she’s got Monarchy, Theology, Construction and Machinery. She is the founder of Buddhism and has 7 cities and a score of 645 Her scout came from Babylon.
A great Prophet was born far away. Hammu’s GA is over.

T102: Our power rating is going up.

IBT: Staue of Zeus was built in Egypt and a Great Scientist was born far away.

T103: Micro cities to force through Construction next turn.

IBT: AP was built in England.

Save:
Gandhi BC-0275 in progress T104.CivBeyondSwordSave

EDIT: I did not upload at the central and I'm ready to play a few more turns, but I think we need some time to figure out what to do.

[leif erikson]

Originally Posted by zamint3

IBT: AP was built in England.

Oh Dear.

Originally Posted by zamint3

EDIT: I did not upload at the central and I'm ready to play a few more turns, but I think we need some time to figure out what to do.

Guess we need to search for more info on the workings of the AP?

[Htadus]

We need to isolate Toku in a city without AP religion asap since we can get unlucky religion spread and things get way out of hand. That city toku get to keep must have our religion or any other for that matter. So we do not have respite from war until Toku is forced to go no religion or another religion. So we need a good size force. If possible I would found a city north of gold city to east(Oracle city) and let it ungarded when DoWing toku. Make sure that it has Hindu. I do not have time today to do more. We can still win the game with some haste. Aslo we need to spread hindu to every new city.

[leif erikson]

This says we need to remain in OR in order to build Missionaries, no?

[Cactus Pete]

The best laid plans . . .

Originally Posted by Htadus

We need to isolate Toku in a city without AP religion asap since we can get unlucky religion spread and things get way out of hand. Is the logic here that we need to make it difficult for AP religion to spread not only to us but to Toku as well? That city toku get to keep must have our religion or any other for that matter. So we do not have respite from war until Toku is forced to go no religion or another religion. And what would force his religiosity? Part of peace negotiation? So we need a good size force. If possible I would found a city north of gold city to east(Oracle city) and let it ungarded when DoWing toku. Make sure that it has Hindu. Why not just take one of his poor cities and convert it? This would not require a settler, only a missionary. I do not have time today to do more. We can still win the game with some haste. Aslo we need to spread hindu to every new city.

Concur with this and with leif's corollary observation that we stay in OR.

[Htadus]

@CP.

Yes. To make it difficult for AP religion spread.

Toku will be forced to go into No Religion when we take his cities with AP religion. Of course he may have another religion in another city and he will convert to that. If he does not have another religion, he will become hindu once we let him take back or give him a city infected with Hindu.

If we find a city that can be isolated, it would be cheaper to infect that city and let him take it back. My issue is that I do not think there will be such city out there.

Yes, we need to stay in OR for a while.

[Mad Professor]

So I guess we can use the GE for Machinery?

[leif erikson]

Originally Posted by Mad Professor

So I guess we can use the GE for Machinery?

Yes, but we need to find Iron to build XBows.

The Great Prophet we could build the shrine for gold or start a Golden Age?
I suppose we could settle him too?

On the AP, please correct me if I am wrong:
- The AP victory vote can happen once all civs have the AP religion? Does the civ with the AP need to have contact with all the civs before the vote can happen?

- Taking a Toku city with Buddhism makes the AP VC vote a reality, doe sit not?

- The only way we can avoid an AP vote is to take all of Toku's Buddhist cities, leaving him with no Buddhism or a city with Hinduism in order that all the AI civs do not have a population with Buddhism.

- It is going to be difficult to keep Buddhism out of Toku cities. We will need to isolate the city as best we can. Contact means religion can spread and Open Border means it probably will spread?

[Undecided]

Originally Posted by leif erikson

The Great Prophet we could build the shrine for gold or start a Golden Age?
I suppose we could settle him too?


Or we still bulb theo for some double-promoted troops to match the agg-trait from our opponents and non no-state-religion spread might help too.

On the AP, please correct me if I am wrong:
- The AP victory vote can happen once all civs have the AP religion? Does the civ with the AP need to have contact with all the civs before the vote can happen?

That's correct. The owner of the AP has to have contact with all civs and every civ has to have a city with the ap-religion in it. So right now, we're in no danger because we don't have a city with buddhism. Also both kago and osaka have no religion present right now so we could conquer these cities without any problems on that front

- Taking a Toku city with Buddhism makes the AP VC vote a reality, doe sit not?

If elizagawa has contact to every civ, yes. We need to monitor her EP-points to get a idea of her progress on that front.

- The only way we can avoid an AP vote is to take all of Toku's Buddhist cities, leaving him with no Buddhism or a city with Hinduism in order that all the AI civs do not have a population with Buddhism.


Depending on how fast elizagawa is with meeting other people, we have a reasonable timeframe to get atleast one opponent stripped of buddhism and therefore making a vic vote impossible. (S)he's teching incredibly fast though thanks to the shrine and a pretty nice starting area.

- It is going to be difficult to keep Buddhism out of Toku cities. We will need to isolate the city as best we can. Contact means religion can spread and Open Border means it probably will spread?

I wonder if we could get a two-city colony going at some point in the near future and forcing our then hindu-friend into theocracy for the rest of the game to screw the ap-victory up.

Using the GE for machinery is an interesting option but given that our research will only be supported by city raids we might want to get IW and archery from toku and not teching it ourselves.

[Htadus]

I believe that no colonies are allowed when there are no Vassals.

[zamint3]

Originally Posted by Undecided

The owner of the AP has to have contact with all civs and every civ has to have a city with the ap-religion in it.

Are you sure about that. I tried testing in The World Builder and on the turn of the vote I met everybody with a Buddhist city.

Are we absolutely sure everybody has a Buddhist city?

Not sure how to read the victory screen:


Just noticed Hammu's settler party up north. Will he settle or pull back?

[Cactus Pete]

Once we have Theo, we can't bulb Astro, and that is an option that we want to leave on the table.

Not sure we can get good value from the GE immediately, as Machinery does us little good. Perhaps we should save it for a few turns and see how the game plays. Is there a another wonder available soon of any great use?

GProphet and its potential GA is like holding an ace. May want to pay the maintenance on it for a while.

Don't see the value of Med now. Suggest either Sailing or IW, just to make it easier to get for peace.

Pasturing the cows should be done ASAP.

[leif erikson]

Can't remember what the list of techs we need to leave in order to bulb Astro. Perhaps we should memorize that list?