Preferred number of beakers and culture points per turn on king level

[Gomer_Pyle]

Hi!

I have resently gone over to play King and doing ok or so I guess. Until turn 400 of max 500 or so I was number 1 in science with my 3 cities and rather small but tall empire.

Now I found myself wondering what should I expect to have in terms of beakers per turn or cultur points per turn at this point in the game? I have seen people in Let's Play games talking about now they usually got 1000 beakers per turn on turn 300 or so. I find this really difficult to achieve. 650ish I got now with my 3 cities. Culture wise I got 150ish? Also here people talk about 1000 culture per turn. (How?) It feels like I am in nomans land and don't know what victory condition I wanna go after. I guess on King level being number one in science with only 3 cities against AI's with 15 cities is rather difficult in the end game.

Is there any guide or anyone got an idea of what is a good number when we talk about beakers and culture point per turn in a game? For example how many culture points should you have by year 0 in a culture game? Culture I think is the one I struggle most with.

Another thing about this. Specialists... How do you guys use them? Do you put all of them on in all your cities if you can do this (if you got enough food I mean). Or is this bad? Is it better to go for either culture, production or science specializing?

Prince level is so much easier. I dont really need to think about all this there.


Thanks,

Gomer

[AGorillaKiller]

on quick speed I use the rule of thumb 100bpt at turn 110 and standard you want to hit 150bpt on turn 150. universitys need to be filled as soon as there built. This was before GaK but should be close

[prince_caspian]

It's quite possible to get to the 1000 bpt figure in GAK. Science is important for all types of victories. Of course more cities will result in a much higher bpt but even for a small 4-city empire it's not impossible.

Spoiler:

Build NC in the capital, settle GS from liberty/UA/faith purchase around it, get universities, observatories, schools, labs, work all 4 scientist slots, rationalism etc

I think the new standard (I'm not referring to immortal/deity) would be 1000 bpt around T250 as labs are available earlier.

As for cpt, having 800-1000 is not necessary unless you play cultural. Again the approach is the same as bpt -

Spoiler:

science is important to reach the technology, build all culture buildings, get to Radio asap to get broadcast towers, work all 4 artist slots (5 if cathedral), Hermitage in capital, generate/buy GAs, settle them on earlier turns, burn when cpt breaches 500 or so, piety, freedom

Also on King it's easy to get most wonders, in fact I feel that GAK actually made cultural victory the easiest on lower difficulties.

About specialists, I think people mainly focus on the scientist and artist slots for the above reasons, in some cases engineer slots to rush wonders or manufactories for spaceship/utopia production. Merchant slots are rarely filled as unfortunately, GMs don't really lend themselves to any victory condition. Exception is Korea, you'd want GP focus as much as possible for the +2 science.

[Huaojozu]

So what would be a good BPT on Emperor by 0AD? Or by 1000AD?

[Gomer_Pyle]

Wow! 1000 bpt in turn 250? Holy moly. How is this even possible. I build all science buildings in my games always and still have never been at 1000 bpt even at turn 500. But then I never really build more than 3 maybe 4 cities.

So build all science buildings and turn on the specialists they provide aswell I guess. I will try the 150 bpt on turn 150 and see how it goes. I dont understand how it can be possible to have 1000 on turn 250 though. :S

[Xile]

Originally Posted by Huaojozu

So what would be a good BPT on Emperor by 0AD? Or by 1000AD?

I usually have 50-60 or so by 0AD, but I've had games when I have the same amount on turn 140. I usually end up with ~1,5k bpt on turn 260ish(rationalism and order op).

However, it largely depends on map type and tech path. In a game where I did "badly" early bpt wise, for example, I went into currency before philo to get petra, so I built a really late NC, after NC I went machinery to get my chus thus delaying education, but it was worth it in the end since I conquered 3 and a half civs with them. At the end of the game turn 300ish I was at 1,6k bpt regardless. On an island map at 0AD you probably have universities already building.

tl;dr There is no "good" amount of bpt for any given turn, it depends on your strategy.

[Hambil]

For simple math that seems to hold pretty true for culture on just about any map size/speed (someone correct me if I'm wrong) you want to keep your turns per new policy around 10 or less - for a cultural victory at least.

[Gomer_Pyle]

How many cities do you normally run with these numbers then?

[Mazer Rackham]

Originally Posted by Gomer_Pyle

Hi!
.
.
.
Also here people talk about 1000 culture per turn. (How?)
.
.
.
Thanks,

Gomer

Basics to achieve 1000+ cpt, build 4 cities:

• Build monument, ampitheater, opera houses and museums in each and staff with 4 artists.

• Build the hermitage in one city; settle and work landmarks around that city.

• Build the Sistine Chapel and at least one world wonder in each of the 4 cities.

• Take the Piety tree with the culture bonus policy and finish the Freedom tree.

• Ally all cultural city states.

• Take the religion options that allow the purchase of the culture buildings. (Pagoda and the other one.)

• Enter a golden age

Creating a large puppet empire doesn't hurt either, but it isn't necessary. Cultural victories seem like the quickest peaceful victory option now.

Originally Posted by Hambil

For simple math that seems to hold pretty true for culture on just about any map size/speed (someone correct me if I'm wrong) you want to keep your turns per new policy around 10 or less - for a cultural victory at least.

Once "The Engine" is running above, the policies hopefully come in from 5 to 7 turns.

[Hambil]

You left out play Emperor or lower. Otherwise you'd need a lot of luck or GEs to get those wonders.

[Xile]

Originally Posted by Gomer_Pyle

How many cities do you normally run with these numbers then?

With G&K I like going tall so usually 3 or 4 initially. Later, once I feel safe, and if there are good spots left(I can get new luxuries or it's in a good place(next to a mountain and a river, for example)), I settle some more. If an AI close to me builds 3 or 4 cities, I puppet him before settling any cities past the initial 3 or 4. So usually I end up with 6 or so cities of my own + puppets. How many puppets depends entirely on what victory condition I'm going for.

The key to get good bpt is settling great scientists. I'm quite bad at that, since I don't pay attention to when settling them becomes worse than bulbing techs and over-settle them, I think.

[Gomer_Pyle]

Thanks for all these great tips. I am amazed with how good at this game you are. Really feel like a noobie now. hehe