If you were Oda, what would you do? (Tactics)

[alpaca]

In my latest OCC game I had one of the weirdest civ selections ever. Everyone either went for domination (Harald, Oda, Genghis, Monty) or culture victory (Pacal, William, Nebu - and I, although I might settle for science instead). This required a strong military on my part, so I built a lot of archers and got some more from city states, which were subsequently updated to Gatlings. Seeing my own unit set-up I wondered what I would do if I'd like to conquer something like this.

Imagine you are Oda and trying to attack my weakling military that's sitting in front of all those ripe pickings in the rest of the continent. Which options do you have against a strong defensive line spearheaded by a citadel?

Going around in the north is not an option as you'd have to shuffle all your units through a single tile mountain pass.

In my opinion you have three options: 1) use infantry and a lot of artillery in a combined force manner, or 2) circle around over the ocean in the south (you can't see it but Monaco there on the southern tip of the continent is actually allied with Japan, which they bought just before they declared war), or 3) sign peace, open borders, and attack somebody else. What would you do if you weren't playing against an AI who'll just throw their units against you?

P.S: Desert Folklore+Petra is awesome

[Hambil]

Air strikes with great war bombers

[S.K. Ren]

Easy. Artillery fronted by my own Gatings. I'd take you out in a heartbeat.

[_megafone_]

Air strikes, easy - even if you build some anti-air defense, they won't be a match for some Zero + Bombers (unless you went heavy on it, which you can't do all the time when going Culture OCC).

The Artilleries are easy pickings, and then he could use whatever ground troops he has to mop you up.

[S.K. Ren]

You miss the part where he has to get past my own gatlings. He has no Artillery himself. Trying to engage a line of Gatlings backed by Artillery is suicide with his current units. Additionally Great War Bombers would require Flight whereas playing as Oda, I would have gotten Artillery anyways after getting Fertilizer and Rifling. Meaning I oculd take him out now before he got his own Bombers/Artillery up.

Edit: AH I see the tech is a bit farther than I initially thought. Then yeah Bombers look to be the way to go.

[smallfish]

Bombers to break this WW1 Deadlock

Followed up by shock trooper breakthroughs and flankings... with tanks

This is all coupled with a amphibious swing from the south, and try getting that CS to the south of Korea to be a new thorn every other civ on his other borders to DOW him at the same time

[Xile]

Nukes solve everything.

[Glassmage]

"Genghis Khan, Sejong is a threat to the civilized world, would you like to join me to take him out?"

[Laniko]

air is the key.In GK air attack is very good,it's buffed a lot and their attacks are great,and one thing is good the dont have any anti air so you will be good

[Xile]

Originally Posted by Laniko

air is the key.In GK air attack is very good,it's buffed a lot and their attacks are great,and one thing is good the dont have any anti air so you will be good

I find AIs spamming tonnes of AA units making bombers a lot weaker than in vanilla.

[Laniko]

Originally Posted by Xile

I find AIs spamming tonnes of AA units making bombers a lot weaker than in vanilla.

not quiete they are buildin aa but not in that number whitc will be dangerous,with ww1 bombers in 2 attack u can kill them and then they don't bother building more

[smallfish]

Originally Posted by Xile

I find AIs spamming tonnes of AA units making bombers a lot weaker than in vanilla.

Get some fighters, sweep the area you want to bomb beforehand

[Denkt]

Some nukes will take out the defenders and then rush in with tanks which are backed by artillery and aircrafts which will take out that city very fast. If nukes are not an option you can still use aircrafts, paratroopers, artillery, tanks and the southern CS to great effect agains that defense and with that empire Oda got he can probably easy outproduce you in military. Also I may build upp a strong railroad network close to your defense so that I can easily move my units. Also If I got 2 GG I can capture your citadel which will creat a great breach in that defense. I would also If I got the gold and the ability to purcase the neutral land that you border to so that my units can easly heal.

[dthompson32]

It looks like the opening at 10 o'clock on that gold mine. I would use artillery to wipe on the infantry on the citadel, then degrade all the gatling guns behind it. Use a fast unit to occupy the citadel.

Of course I don't know what happens if the citadel is occupied? Do you still take damage?

Will the game let you build a citadel right next to it? If so, that is another tactic, drop a Great General next to it and make your own.

But I think that is the best approach, short of bombers and nukes. Put down your own citadel somewhere, use some cheap expendable units as spotters, then degrade the front line with artillery using indirect fire.

[Hambil]

Originally Posted by dthompson32

Of course I don't know what happens if the citadel is occupied? Do you still take damage?

If you take the citadel you can pillage it. Then units no longer take damage from it.

[The Pilgrim]

Originally Posted by Hambil

If you take the citadel you can pillage it. Then units no longer take damage from it.

Then you can grab that tile with your own citadel, let worker repair it and it will become YOUR citadel.

[alpaca]

My tech is farther. Oda might have flight perhaps (although not long, perhaps a bomber or two unless you buy them) but he has certainly no atomic theory, radar or combustion. I'm honestly not convinced that you'll have a good chance of killing the infantry with artillery - 28 ranged against 70 str potentially fortified in a citadel for 140-168 def means you need a lot of shots to kill it in one turn, and if you don't kill it I've got another two in reserve, admittedly a little far away. Perhaps if you used two-three horses along with it. Going for the gatlings on the flanks might be a better option and would probably force me to withdraw further inward. You might win the war, but the price, I think, will not be trivial.

Thanks for pointing out my lack of artillery, I was teased by rocketry (which I can only get away with against AI, of course)

FYI Oda opted for my option 3): sign peace and open borders. Let's see if he marches an army through.

[Resonance]

Originally Posted by The Pilgrim

Then you can grab that tile with your own citadel, let worker repair it and it will become YOUR citadel.

I did something like that in my last game. Just that I never pillaged the AI citadels. I used a GG bomb before my advance and they were mine.

[The Pilgrim]

Originally Posted by Resonance

I did something like that in my last game. Just that I never pillaged the AI citadels. I used a GG bomb before my advance and they were mine.

Yes, I wasn't sure whether you have to pillage them first or just have in your territory. In my case I couldn't progress without destroying it first. So good to know, you can spare worker hours.

[dthompson32]

Originally Posted by alpaca

I'm honestly not convinced that you'll have a good chance of killing the infantry with artillery - 28 ranged against 70 str potentially fortified in a citadel for 140-168 def means you need a lot of shots to kill it in one turn

However, with a 3 hex range, you can get 8 artillery within range of that citadel in on this particular map. That's over 200 firepower (not counting upgrades) on that one Infantry, it won't survive the one turn.

I'm finding on my games that Artillery is game changing. I can take pretty much any city with a mixed set of units and 5 upgraded artillery.