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Old May 01, 2013, 08:17 PM   #1
OzzyKP
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Is There Meaning Behind Firaxis' Brave New World New Cover Art?

I blogged:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/alex-k...b_3193008.html


(and I linked to CFC btw)
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Old May 01, 2013, 08:31 PM   #2
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Could you elaborate on what you mean by this:

"Many comments on the Civ5 Facebook page thought the placement was a little odd. Shouldn't communism be put on the left and fascism on the right?

They have a point."

It seems a perfectly reasonable order to me, being alphabetical.
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Old May 01, 2013, 08:48 PM   #3
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I suspect that you are reading far too much into that. The logo placement is essentially as one would expect, the only difference (the Firaxis logo going to the centre) probably being little more than an aesthetic choice given the clear three panel division that is otherwise absent on past box art.
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Old May 01, 2013, 08:51 PM   #4
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I didn't know 31 years old men are excited for this game like me.
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Old May 01, 2013, 11:10 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JFD View Post
Could you elaborate on what you mean by this:

"Many comments on the Civ5 Facebook page thought the placement was a little odd. Shouldn't communism be put on the left and fascism on the right?

They have a point."

It seems a perfectly reasonable order to me, being alphabetical.
Communism and Fascism are generally considered ideologies of the Far Left and Far Right, respectively.

It's an interesting concept, though it's likely just coincidence. One could just as easily make a comment about how the Fascist leader is raising his left hand as opposed to the right hand raising of the others.
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Old May 01, 2013, 11:28 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonrock411 View Post
Communism and Fascism are generally considered ideologies of the Far Left and Far Right, respectively.

It's an interesting concept, though it's likely just coincidence. One could just as easily make a comment about how the Fascist leader is raising his left hand as opposed to the right hand raising of the others.
I don't know why, but I didn't think of that first. But I think Firaxis is just playing it safe with putting it Alphabetically, just as they did with the Religions.
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Old May 01, 2013, 11:28 PM   #7
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The solution is obvious: The whole picture is mirrored!
The best evidence: The worker is holding his hammer in his right hand. Everybody knows, that civ5's workers all are left-handed!

What the artists wants to say with his Great Work is, that Civilization 5 is an alternative mirror-world to our own history.

Ohhh, its so deeeep!
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Old May 01, 2013, 11:39 PM   #8
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The logos are in their usual order:


They're most likely separate into three because the box itself is. It makes it more clear and doesn't have two logos packed into the communists box.

Good work on the blog though!
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Old May 01, 2013, 11:40 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonrock411 View Post
Communism and Fascism are generally considered ideologies of the Far Left and Far Right, respectively.

It's an interesting concept, though it's likely just coincidence. One could just as easily make a comment about how the Fascist leader is raising his left hand as opposed to the right hand raising of the others.
But that "general consideration" is hogwash. Ultraconservatives would be Imperialists or Monarchists. Fascism's only parallel with monarchy is that there is a single powerful leader. The reason fascism is considered far-right is because of revisionist history on the part of leftists; the only ideology fascism could be considered "to the right" of is communism.
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Old May 01, 2013, 11:40 PM   #10
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The Right-Left is just a way of attempting to simplify politics, it's good for a basic understanding of politics but falls apart if you dig deeper. Most things resist simplicity, like history, science and arguments about whether or not Italy should be in Civilization V or not :P
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Old May 01, 2013, 11:43 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Peng Qi View Post
But that "general consideration" is hogwash. Ultraconservatives would be Imperialists or Monarchists. Fascism's only parallel with monarchy is that there is a single powerful leader. The reason fascism is considered far-right is because of revisionist history on the part of leftists; the only ideology fascism could be considered "to the right" of is communism.
Didn't the whole "left/right" political description come from France when the clergy would sit on the right and the laymen on the left? So technically that would make anyone not a member of a religious clergy part of the "left"
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Old May 01, 2013, 11:48 PM   #12
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Left-to-Right:

Pot Pol?!; Lincoln; Castro.

Edit: I'm not necessarily saying these are who I'm guessing just that they're artwork on the box was possibly inspired by these three.
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Old May 01, 2013, 11:50 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by jonrock411 View Post
Communism and Fascism are generally considered ideologies of the Far Left and Far Right, respectively.
Not really, no. The understanding I've been given is that the right wants less government involvement and the left wants more. Therefore, the extreme right would be anarchy.
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Old May 01, 2013, 11:52 PM   #14
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A good find, I sure hope it's not a coincidence!
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Old May 01, 2013, 11:56 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Glassmage View Post
I didn't know 31 years old men are excited for this game like me.
The age of the average gamer is somewhere around 37 (I don't remember the actual number, but it's somewhere around there), which is a bit surprising to younger folks like me, who would normally assume dudes (and gals) with families and real jobs and all that wouldn't have time for games.
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Old May 02, 2013, 12:04 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peng Qi View Post
But that "general consideration" is hogwash. Ultraconservatives would be Imperialists or Monarchists. Fascism's only parallel with monarchy is that there is a single powerful leader. The reason fascism is considered far-right is because of revisionist history on the part of leftists; the only ideology fascism could be considered "to the right" of is communism.
This isn't a thread for it, but branding Monarchists as Ultraconservative is an offensive presumption.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arachnofiend View Post
Not really, no. The understanding I've been given is that the right wants less government involvement and the left wants more. Therefore, the extreme right would be anarchy.
The extreme Left is Anarchy. The Left is opposed to social hierachies, which includes government.

Last edited by JFD; May 02, 2013 at 12:07 AM.
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Old May 02, 2013, 01:35 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by Arachnofiend View Post
Not really, no. The understanding I've been given is that the right wants less government involvement and the left wants more. Therefore, the extreme right would be anarchy.
Please explain to me where the anarchists in the Spanish Civil War, and where the Ayatollahs ruling Iran, sit on this spectrum of yours.
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Old May 02, 2013, 01:44 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by jonrock411 View Post
Communism and Fascism are generally considered ideologies of the Far Left and Far Right, respectively.
It's simply wrong stating that fascism is far-right. It has many far-left/socialist elements as well and should be seen as a fusion between (far-)leftist and (far-)rightist movements. As I learned fascism is a fusion between revolutionary socialism (out of which also communism sprang), national conservatism and national traditionalism.

Last edited by anandus; May 02, 2013 at 01:47 AM.
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Old May 02, 2013, 01:50 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by labrynianrebel View Post
The Right-Left is just a way of attempting to simplify politics, it's good for a basic understanding of politics but falls apart if you dig deeper. Most things resist simplicity, like history, science and arguments about whether or not Italy should be in Civilization V or not :P
I'm going to go with this as my response. Unfortunately the attempt to try and "simplify" politics usually ends up just complicating things further, since it often can create division based on misunderstanding the terms rather than actual conflict between political standing.
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Old May 02, 2013, 01:51 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anandus View Post
It's simply wrong stating that fascism is far-right. It has many far-left/socialist elements as well and should be seen as a fusion between (far-)leftist and (far-)rightist movements. As I learned fascism is a fusion between revolutionary socialism (out of which also communism sprang), national conservatism and national traditionalism.
He did say "generally considered."
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