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Old May 03, 2004, 08:30 AM   #1
SunZsu
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Red face Nuke Attack by Gandhi !

So when was Gandhi a pacifist? .... playing my final game of vanilla Civ 3 (before installing Conquest) ....

background: playing @ emperor level as Chinese, it's 1975 and down to 4 civs left, India in 1st place, me as Chinese in 2nd place down by 1000 pts, followed by France and Germany ....
got into a war with India (ok, so I provoked them ) all Civs have MA and MI, etc., however, Gandhi and French have nukes, I do NOT .... Germany joined me in an alliance ... India started out numerically superior, invaded my home country, and my forces cut their armor and inf to pieces at the border with arty, MA, and cruise missiles and bombers ... time for payback, so I invade Gandhi's country, pushing him back steadily until finally camping out next to one of his size 28 pop. cities located 3 cities away from his capital .... ask him to make piece and he offers money, but I want Fission - he says no and I say TS .... he attacks my stack with a few MAs and has no success - then all hell breaks loose ... he nukes 9 of my cities, and not just any cities, but I noticed that the attack completely isolated all of my remaining cities from all luxuries and strategic resources (and I have LOT of cities) .... and France, who has nukes, just sits back and does nothing (thanks, fellas, I'll remember you, too) .... anyway, I said the heck with this and re-played the turn and accepted Gandhi's peace offer (and then proceeded all out to research Fission) ...

then, a few turns later, and this is really bizarre IMHO, my adviser pops up and says India and France have signed an MPP (I'm thinking great, here comes round 2 - both of them at me from opposite directions), and then, DURING THE SAME TURN, my adviser pops up again and says that France declares war on India .... now get this, so on the SAME turn as these two sign an MPP they also go to war with each other .... did the AI have a brainfart, or what? ......

my 1st reaction is WTF, over .... so now I'm just sitting back watching them destroy each other while I'm rush building my spaceship .....

anyway, 1st lesson I guess is when AI feels threatened enough (and that's the key, how much is enough - anybody know?), then it'll use nukes 1st .... 2nd lesson - MPPs not always what they seem, I guess ..... weird ... wonder if this sort of stuff can hap[en in Conquest ....

post script .... 10 years later and I now have tactical nukes on nuclear subs, about ten of them sitting off Gandhi's coast ... so if he starts something now, we'll incinerate each other .... meanwhile it's fun watching India and France destroy each other
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Old May 03, 2004, 11:25 AM   #2
alamo
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Never trust Ghandi with nukes...

Government and Miltary techs are very highly valued by the AI against a player, especially on emperor. You could have surrounded Ghandi's last city and he would not reveal the secret of Fission.

Any agreement, including a MPP is pretty worthless once reputations fall. The deal for MPP probably involved a tech trade. France probably got a tech then decided the time was ripe for attack. Sometimes the AI will do a pre-emptive attack on a strong neighbor.

BTW, a nuclear pre-emptive strike is an option if you can locate all the enemy missiles. I have seen an ICBM be the sole defender left in a nuked city, but I don't think it's very likely.
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Old May 04, 2004, 06:17 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally posted by alamo
Never trust Ghandi with nukes...
Never trust an AI with nukes
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Old May 04, 2004, 06:35 AM   #4
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you know, when i was still playing Civ3 - without any patches, i used the 99999999 bug and got alot of money... in the end, i was left with america, i gave Clinton 1000000 gold for all his cities except washington...

the next turn, i airlifted one tank to his island and i sent 10 ICBMs on washington virtually reducing it to nothing and i razed it with that tank... hell funny it was!

well, was it cheating then? but oh well, i got too bored in wanting to finish clinton the normal way... :P
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Old May 04, 2004, 01:57 PM   #5
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Not even Gandhi could resist the lure of supreme power! It really destroys a man's character!
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Old May 04, 2004, 06:41 PM   #6
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No AI is reliable with nukes (actually most human players aren't either). Maybe it's something to do with the lust of big explosions everyone seems to have.
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Old May 06, 2004, 05:35 AM   #7
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No AI is realiable period! I played Conquests as Carthage against Gandhi. All of a sudden, right after we agree to a right of passage, they unload an archer and a spearman into my terretory. THen the next turn, I get a startling message from my forign advisor "THe Indians have declared war on us!" Then they ambush me at Leptis Minor. I defeat thier archer and then thier spe3arman, eventually. Then I defeated the Indians that were furious with me. (Post number nine, and counting )
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Old May 06, 2004, 06:05 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by LLXerxes
No AI is realiable period!
I totally agree.
One day Carthage and Mongols were in a MA against me. I managed to make peace with Carthage during this MA by offering them a MA versus.... Mongols
And guess what : a few turns later, they broke their MA with me to go to war against me again, again they were MA with the Mongols
Anyway, I killed the Mongols, problem solved...
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Old May 06, 2004, 06:03 PM   #9
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quote:
Origionaly posted by knacki:
I totally agree.
One day Carthage and Mongols were in Ma MA with me. I managed to make peace with Carthage during this MA by offering MA versus.... Mongols
And guess what : a few turns later, they broke their MA with me to go to war against me again, again they were MA with the Mongols
Anyway, I killed the Mongols, problem solved...

Ouch!
Still a good story.
By the way, if this post is messed up like the quote doesn't go right, I tried my best!
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Old May 06, 2004, 06:23 PM   #10
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Re: Nuke Attack by Gandhi !

Quote:
Originally posted by SunZsu
.... and France, who has nukes, just sits back and does nothing (thanks, fellas, I'll remember you, too) ....
insert your own French-bashing joke here.
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Old May 06, 2004, 08:29 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by knacki
I totally agree.
One day Carthage and Mongols were in a MA against me. I managed to make peace with Carthage during this MA by offering them a MA versus.... Mongols
And guess what : a few turns later, they broke their MA with me to go to war against me again, again they were MA with the Mongols
Anyway, I killed the Mongols, problem solved...
Hmm, sounds like you'd be better off killing the backstabbing Carthage than the Mongols...

Actually AI are reasonably responsible with their actions as long as you are much stronger than them. If you're weak, they'll abuse the hell out of you, even if you did nothing to provoke them.
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Old May 07, 2004, 04:03 AM   #12
Kubannus
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I went to nuclear war few times too, but AI seems to me stupid. They had attacked not my biggest, or highes production cities. Some of them were big, but most of them were no.6 class.
Don`t know why!
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Old May 07, 2004, 04:39 AM   #13
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Old May 07, 2004, 05:08 AM   #14
Kubannus
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I see, it could be as you`re saying.
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Old May 07, 2004, 05:45 AM   #15
knacki
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Quote:
Originally posted by Lord Parkin
If you're weak, they'll abuse the hell out of you, even if you did nothing to provoke them.
That's why I finished the Mongols first, Carthage was way bigger than me.
Anyway it proves that Civ is real life : strong ones always abuse from weak ones !
When they're strong people often think they have rights to do whatever they want :slay:, they should realize they rather have duties to help and show example
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Old May 07, 2004, 08:16 AM   #16
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that's so true knacki

i'm just glad that most countries are more reluctant to use nukes in real life than they are in the game. who knows what would happen if india got a little trigger happy with their nukes
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Old May 07, 2004, 10:57 AM   #17
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I was playing a game once. I declared war on the scots and took three of there citys. The MMP most have been really out of hand because on the next turn everybody was at war with every body else. After my turn I herd the nuke sound, but it didn't hit me. The AI nuked each other. It was the first time iI had every seem that happen. On the next turn I tried to end the war by launching about 50 nukes at the ottomens completly leveling their empire.
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Old May 15, 2004, 08:12 PM   #18
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Re: Nuke Attack by Gandhi !

I once lost all of my cities in one turn to nukes. My best friend was in my borders when a nuke hit every one of my cities and he went and took them all in one turn. Bye Bye in one turn.
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Old May 16, 2004, 04:34 AM   #19
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Re: Nuke Attack by Gandhi !

gandhi is not only sneeky double dealing crook, hes also ruthlessly violent when he can be. i hate that guy. in my carthage game (i had to give up cos of him) he pre emptively declared war, and took some of my cities. because it was a small empire i asked for peace and he wouldnt even talk to me. he just kept on pumping cavalry into my empire. bastard (is this a non swearing forum?)
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