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Old Jun 02, 2004, 07:49 PM   #201
scoutsout
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@Tal: as they say in Italy... "mille grazie" for telling us of your plans. I was thinking of giving Tweed 48 hours to show up again... I'll discuss it with GK and we'll figure it out. Maybe we can re-shuffle thing so that you can enjoy a round after your guests leave...
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Old Jun 03, 2004, 01:51 AM   #202
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I was leaning towards pretty much what Tal said as well, go for the Gardens & worst case senario we still end up with a REALLY expensive Market. The risk is worth the reward.

I also pretty much agree with his second part, we "could" take it. But it would mean throwing expansion & infrastructure out the window & putting up barracks everywhere which will cramp our research.

We're just going to have to alter our game plan a bit, finishing up now.
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Old Jun 03, 2004, 03:46 AM   #203
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T6-(630) Sell our WM around. MM cities a bit.
Change Konigsburg to Oracle.

[IT-[/b] Russia cascades to GL as well. Come on Moscow!
Sell WM around.
Galley starts off into the Ocean.

T7-(610) Sell WM around.
Galley starts off into the Ocean.

[IT-[/b] Hannover: grows & produces worker. Starts on galley.
Our galley sinks.

T8-(590) Found Stuttgart, starts on cat.
Bremen switched to Lib, to get incense in our borders.
Lose a warrior attacking a barb camp.
Take out a different barb camp.

[IT-[/b] French start the GL.


T9-(570) Found Bonn, starts on a library.
Sell WM around.

[IT-[/b] Berlin: settler>setter
Leipzig: worker>worker

T10-(550) Rush galley in Nuremburg. That’s going to be the last one we can rush for awhile. I’d take the warrior in Nuremburg & pop those two island villiges, we might get lucky.
Take out a barb camp.
Poly is on the table, Joanie(cheapest) wants WM & 200g. We have currency due in 4 so I’d wait & hope Lizzy picks it up first so we can trade with her, then get France & Russia’s treasury.

*End o turn report* Not much, founded a couple cities, got a couple techs. There’s a settler headed for our last RCP 5 site.

We've got to pick where we want our last couple 9 sites to the South, then those have to be a priority if we want to get them.

We also have to decide where we want the FP & how we want to arrange rings around it. We can either go with the NW or SE, here’s maps of both.



Good luck!
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Old Jun 03, 2004, 03:52 AM   #204
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Oh yea, I was thinking that once we got our last couple 9 sites down, then our FP ring, we can pretty much stop expanding. Leave the the rest for the AI to take, that will keep them off our backs for a while & make them have more income(aka faster research) at the same time.

edit- Hopefully I got it done in time for you to be able to pick up, either way thanks for the heads up!

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Old Jun 03, 2004, 06:07 AM   #205
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Well, actually I think I can find time to play my turns this afternoon - I know that won't leave us much room for discussion, but I hope that I have a handle on things as we are...

Having said that, as well as a FP site (and due to the amount of jungle in the SE, and the nice river area in the NW, I recommend the latter) we just need to decide the radius of our third ring... RCP12 or 13? Dotmap, anyone?

Tal

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Old Jun 03, 2004, 06:27 AM   #206
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gengis Khan
Oh yea, I was thinking that once we got our last couple 9 sites down, then our FP ring, we can pretty much stop expanding.


@Gengis: Care to share some thoughts on a third ring and/or FP w/ possible rings? I'd like to look at an FP in the north... I think there's just enough room up there for a smaller secondary core. Thoughts on settling priorities for Tal?

@Tal: No objection if you want to pick it up this afternoon... I'll take another look on my lunch hour and see if I can offer a useful suggestion or 2...
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Old Jun 03, 2004, 06:38 AM   #207
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priorities: I'd get those last couple of 9 sites towards Russia down first. We're actually going to need to set up another unit factory shortly, I was running out of escorts, but want to leave all our scouts in the field for hunting.

As to the FP, I'm leaning towards the north as well. More defensible, & will leave the east for russia/france. I havn't figured out a good FP spot/ ring location yet, we'll draw one up once we have those 9 sites settled in that direction. That will give us a better idea of what we're working with.
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Old Jun 03, 2004, 07:33 AM   #208
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Quick point on cities...

See the attached dotmap. At the moment, there is a settler pair heading towards the RCP5 site near Leipzig, presumably to the yellow dot on my new map.

I have come to have reservations about this, even though I originally suggested it in one of my own maps

I think that the two red sites on my new map are better, as it allows us to use all four of the floodplain tiles available, whereas yellow misses out the 3 floodplain sites outlined in pink...

RCP9 sites (green) also fail to use these floodplain tiles, when combined with yellow.

Therefore, I humbly suggest we use the red sites


Tal
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Old Jun 03, 2004, 07:38 AM   #209
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Looks good, I suggest going with the southern one first. Leaving the northern one out for a while, and concentrating on expansion south(those 2/3 other 9 sites). We can't settle that city next to Leipzig, without first abandoning Leipzig, and abandoning Leipzig means losing our granary & about 20 turns before it can be replaced.
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Old Jun 03, 2004, 07:42 AM   #210
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I'm pretty sure that the Yellow site has fresh water, and as that site and Munich mature, they'll be good cities... though we might want to pump Leipzig for a settler and use that settler to settle that particular site.

The northerly red site is a nice looking spot, but it crowds Munich a little. Since these northerly cities are some of the very few we have that are nicely developed at the moment, I'd rather not crowd them. They'll be real powerhouses later in the game.

Though the southerly red site looks like it will claim a nice chunk of territory, it's a little short on food, and will require many worker turns to get productive. Ordinarily this wouldn't bother me... but we have so many cities that are many worker turns from being productive...

Between the green sites, I'm leaning slightly towards the westerly of the two... Gengis? What do you think?
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Old Jun 03, 2004, 08:52 AM   #211
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OK, for now, I'm sticking to the original plan - access to fresh water, and immediate use of space points to the yellow site. We can always do the lower red site later, and keep Leipzig for a long long time anyway.

Playing now, wish me luck!
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Old Jun 03, 2004, 09:56 AM   #212
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Pre-flight - brace myself for the GL disappointment, and cross fingers for monarchy...

IBT - Warrior beats off barb horseman

Turn 1 - 530 BC


Galley moves off with warrior from N'burg, another galley on the way. Worker stuff, including mine building and forest clearing... Trade WM with France, again...

IBT - zip

Turn 2 - 510 BC

Found Salzburg, set it building catapult. Emphasise shields in Bremen, to get incense quicker.

IBT - fend off 2 barbarians

Turn 3 - 490 BC

Disperse a barb camp Disperse another one Chop forest to hurry library in Bremen... Trade maps to France and England, Russia not interested...

Hut produces a friendly horseman! He boards galley to come back to main continent - don't want him stuck here forever...

IBT - Joan wants an alliance vs Lizzy - the war must be back on! i agree to an ROP just to maintain a positive relationship, but confess I was just stabbing in the dark here... Should I have just said "Not a chance"?

Currency researched - prepare for trading!

Turn 4 - 470 BC

Miscellaneous movement... Now a dilemma. Lizzy is at war with France, so no learning or money, and no way of her getting Poly... Grr! If she gets it from the GL, she may get Currency too... So, I go ahead and trade it for Poly with France. No point in delaying, really (Note - can we discuss this later?) get 95g, WM and Poly from France, 215g and WM from Russia. Decide to give it to Lizzy, as she will get it soon enough, we can use the diplo boost, and she is likely to get the GL first anyway...

IBT - Settler built in Munich, start a spearman, as we need escorts.

Turn 5 - 450 BC

HUGE uprising spotted in the SE... And another in the NW! Last turn these both had one warrior... Now they have the Golden Horde...

I am pausing here for suggestions...
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Old Jun 03, 2004, 10:04 AM   #213
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Have a look and tell me what you guys think.

Dark Blue: Proposed FP site
Light Blue: FP RCP4
Green: FP RCP7

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Old Jun 03, 2004, 10:06 AM   #214
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NOTE TO MODS!

I am uploading the save after 5 turns in order to get some input from my team... I *may* not be able to continue playing later on this evening, so uploading it now means that Scout can have my last 5 turns if this is necessary and I don't cause any further delays


Tal
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Old Jun 03, 2004, 10:16 AM   #215
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@Scout - I like that dotmap, nice work... Just one question (I am no expert on FP placement, but what would happen to N'burg if it is RCP9 and FRCP7?)

Tal
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Old Jun 03, 2004, 10:17 AM   #216
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Fine, Tallanas. No problems with that.
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Old Jun 03, 2004, 10:20 AM   #217
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallanas
@Scout - I like that dotmap, nice work... Just one question (I am no expert on FP placement, but what would happen to N'burg if it is RCP9 and FRCP7?)
I have no idea, but it will be fun to see!

@Karasu:
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Old Jun 03, 2004, 02:01 PM   #218
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A friendly horseman. That's odd, very cool but odd. You give him a *****en name to honor our first mobile unit?

About your trade(since you asked for comments): What I would have done is traded currency to Russia first(IIRC she has close to 1k gold) for as much gold as we could get. Since it was a Monopoly sell it to the person you can get the most from. Then I would have done the same to France(all the gold I could get). Last I would have sold it to England for Poly, even if I had to throw in a bit of change.

Dotmap looks good, I'd ditch the green by Leipzig though will put additional strain on an area that's already going to be overcrowded.
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Old Jun 03, 2004, 03:32 PM   #219
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Originally Posted by Gengis Khan
A friendly horseman. That's odd, very cool but odd. You give him a *****en name to honor our first mobile unit?

About your trade(since you asked for comments): What I would have done is traded currency to Russia first(IIRC she has close to 1k gold) for as much gold as we could get. Since it was a Monopoly sell it to the person you can get the most from. Then I would have done the same to France(all the gold I could get). Last I would have sold it to England for Poly, even if I had to throw in a bit of change.

Dotmap looks good, I'd ditch the green by Leipzig though will put additional strain on an area that's already going to be overcrowded.
First up, the trade - yes, it would make more sense to do it the way you outlined... That information is duly filed away, lesson learned.

The green city near Leipzig can be founded once we are ready to disband Leipzig to give the other two cities there more room - those 3 will fit nicely together (I agree that with the 3 cities *and* Leipzig, people would be treading on each others' toes a lot)...

Hmm, the horseman! How about Horseman of the Apocalypse? Or is that slightly too much for a unit with an attack rating of 2?


I am afraid my time ran out this afternoon, and I am now away from home again. The PC here died when I tried to play 1.29, although it handles vanilla ok... Ah well, it's just not to be, I guess! Therefore, I request that one of you guys play my last 5 turns. I know I'm shirking, but 5 turns is better than none, right??

I will keep checking up on the discussion over the weekend - my guests can take care of themselves for a minute or two


Tal
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Old Jun 03, 2004, 04:16 PM   #220
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallanas
First up, the trade - yes, it would make more sense to do it the way you outlined... That information is duly filed away, lesson learned.
No worries, we still profited quite a bit. And it was a good move gifting Currency to Lizzy.
If at any point my suggestions come off condisending, or anything like that just slap me with a fish. I'm not trying to turn this into a TDG, just makeing sure a good time is had by all & we all walk away having learned something. Besides, we can't do that well, I have another wooden spoon to win!

Quote:
The green city near Leipzig can be founded once we are ready to disband Leipzig to give the other two cities there more room - those 3 will fit nicely together (I agree that with the 3 cities *and* Leipzig, people would be treading on each others' toes a lot)...
It's still crowded without Leipzig, especially compared to anywhere else we've set up. For example: Green & Munich will share 6 squares, Green & Numeburg share 3(Nume & Munich are already sharing 2), and Green & blue share 6.
But all this is insignificant when compaired to one thing....... the green city is 7.5 tiles from our capitol.


Quote:
Hmm, the horseman! How about Horseman of the Apocalypse? Or is that slightly too much for a unit with an attack rating of 2?

I am afraid my time ran out this afternoon, and I am now away from home again. The PC here died when I tried to play 1.29, although it handles vanilla ok... Ah well, it's just not to be, I guess! Therefore, I request that one of you guys play my last 5 turns. I know I'm shirking, but 5 turns is better than none, right??

I will keep checking up on the discussion over the weekend - my guests can take care of themselves for a minute or two

Tal
Sounds great! I couldn't come up with a better name for the first horseman I've ever popped from a hut.

No big deal, better to get 5 in before company came then none at all.

And btw, I'm going to need to get a definition for shirking.

Last edited by Gengis Khan; Jun 03, 2004 at 04:21 PM.
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