But which Israel?

[notyourtypical]

How about this UA: Stubbornness - If capital city not founded by turn 2 , your settler and warrior decide to become Egyptian and you play as Egypt. Don't wander too long!

I kid, I kid.

 

[tetley]

Or their UA could be they don't have to abide by World Congress resolutions.

 

[LyricalAssassin]

Or their UA could be they don't have to abide by World Congress resolutions.

That could honestly be any other civs UA with that logic. There are a lot of countries that have blatantly ignored the UN in the past.

 

[tetley]

It's a moot point anyway, because I don't think Israel is enough of a major civilization to merit being in the game.

 

[LyricalAssassin]

Yeah, good point tetley. I think they're represented well enough just being the city-state of Jerusalem anyway.

 

[Fabio1701]

a city state that gets knocked around a bit, has periodic times of being puppeted (by egyptians, romans, ottomans, british, etc) and liberated, sometimes launches into wars with neighbouring city states, which all have quests set for declaring war on eachother. one of which Palestine it actually takes over, (I've seen a city state take 2 other CS and actually not raze them for the whole game) and is now allied with America.

No need for a full civ. A city state can also found a religion in a mod perhaps.

 

[reddishrecue]

Jerusalem, Israel's capital already exists as a city state.. If you are making a israel mod, make sure that you remove the Jerusalem city state and put the Jerusalem city state as Israel's first city and then the other cities that could come with Israel mod if still interested in making.

 

[Iannewton80]

Or their UA could be they don't have to abide by World Congress resolutions.

Like Hamas, the terrorist group they have to deal with does?

Moderator Action: This crosses the line of discussing Israel as a civ and starting down the road to a real life political discussion. OT is here for that discussion, or the History forums. Please get back on topic.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[Trackmaster]

The backstory of the Civilization tends to focus on the period of time that they were one of the most important empires in the world. They may be splashed all over the news now, but really other than sentimental value, they're nothing now. Maybe they could focus more on the spiritual, nomadic side, and have Moses be their leader. Afterall, the Huns are understood to be nomadic in the game, and never had a set homeland.

While they may have been a blip on the radar compared to Rome, Greece, and the other major empires at the time, you have to admit that they had a profound impact on global history, and spawned the religion that three of the four biggest world religions of the world came from (well, maybe exclude Judaism from that, but it's still an extremely powerful and influential religion).

 

[tetley]

The point of friction is that some want this glorious Civilization, while others the thought of it makes...well...we don't want it in our game. We paid for it, like everyone else. And we are playing it in 2014. The mainstream BNW release is not the place to make political statements--even "obvious" ones (in your mind)--and the devs made a point of keeping the religions neutral. Israel is represented a-plenty as it is, in a neutral manner. If you want something different, there are downloadable mods already available you can play with your friends.

Frankly, I would just love to see a Southpark mod, that intentionally tries to offend everybody. And I would play it. But it would suck to spend all that time developing it only to risk it being banned.

 

[Iannewton80]

The backstory of the Civilization tends to focus on the period of time that they were one of the most important empires in the world. They may be splashed all over the news now, but really other than sentimental value, they're nothing now. Maybe they could focus more on the spiritual, nomadic side, and have Moses be their leader. Afterall, the Huns are understood to be nomadic in the game, and never had a set homeland.

Okay, but... the games called Civilization for a reason. You can't have bunch of a munch of wandering nomads under Moses and call that a civ. I'm not denying that Israel's kingdom in David and Solomon's time was short lived but for those decades it reviled in size to the Egyptians and the raising-in-power Assyrians... Why can't we have an ancient Israelite Kingdom under the well known King David or Solomon?

And by the way, not every Civilization in the game has to be some massive empire. For example we already have Ethiopia, the Iroquois, the Celts, Morocco, Venice and Polynesia.

 

[Chum]

From what I've seen many if not most Civilization five players support Israel being included in Civilization five.

Where do you see this?

Legitimate question.

 

[Winsling]

The last time I looked into the historical David and Solomon, it seemed that Jerusalem was a minor city and the Bible's account of their greatness was wishful thinking. Has that changed?

More specifically, is there significant non-Bible evidence that there ever was a meaningful Israelite kingdom?

 

[Iannewton80]

Where do you see this?

Legitimate question.

I noted that when players gave the Civs they hoped for the most (before BNW came out) Israel was often among them.

Here are some links: http://steamcommunity.com/app/8930/discussions/0/828938354938446999/

http://www.weplayciv.com/forums/showthread.php?92-Civ-5-New-Civ-The-Hebrews

http://forums.2k.com/showthread.php?94670-JEWISH-Civilization



Players loved the mod(s): http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=78576215

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=491245

 

[Chum]

I noted that when players gave the Civs they hoped for the most (before BNW came out) Israel was often among them.

Here are some links: http://steamcommunity.com/app/8930/discussions/0/828938354938446999/

http://www.weplayciv.com/forums/showthread.php?92-Civ-5-New-Civ-The-Hebrews

http://forums.2k.com/showthread.php?94670-JEWISH-Civilization



Players loved the mod(s): http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=78576215

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=491245

So you dug up links that are in some cases 5 years old, and threads that have been locked due to a derail into a political discussion, all of which contain no consensus which provides evidence for your assumption, and then decided to stir up trouble based upon that assumption?

Look man, you're going about this the wrong way. If you want a civ in the game, mod it in. If the mod doesn't exist, work with the modders on this forum, or make it yourself. Bringing up such an obvious point of contention and presenting your assumption as fact only serves to incite people on the other side of the issue. This thread already has more warnings in it than any other thread I've read on these forums.

There's a big difference between "I think we can all agree that Israel is important enough to be in this game" and "Hey guys, I want an Israel civ, which leader should I build them with?" One will lead to legitimate discussion, the other is going to go nowhere good. Kinda like it did.

 

[Iannewton80]

So you dug up links that are in some cases 5 years old, and threads that have been locked due to a derail into a political discussion, all of which contain no consensus which provides evidence for your assumption, and then decided to stir up trouble based upon that assumption?.

*Rolls eyes* insults won't help Chum.

All I typed was that "From what I've seen many if not most Civilization five players support Israel being included in Civilization five." Which was an honest observation. I didn't type that I had done intense research and found that the majority of players want Israel as a DLC. I'm not trying to stir up trouble, like you seem to be with your 5 year old insults. I specifically typed "From what I've seen" to avoid problem like this.

Of course I want the Jewish nation in the game, but I also observed that I wasn't alone.

 

[tetley]

If these are the threads you saw, then you knew it was contentious, which means you loaded the poll knowing it was contentious.

 

[leif erikson]

Moderator Action: Contentious is fine, can mean a good discussion. This one has now gotten personal. That means trolling. If you have a problem with something someone posts, then report it and let the staff sort it out. This thread is closed.

edit - Please do not start another one.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889