New Civ Concept

[Valkrionn]

First, I'd like to say this is an excellent idea... I'm willing to help with whatever you need. Of course, that's partially so I can later steal it...

Explain? They clearly have some interaction with Mythril, given one of the Golems is only available AFTER Mythril Weapons tech. What's so terrible about Mythril Golems as an analogue for others having Mythril Weapons? I assume you're considering the Mythril Golem hero, but, well... he's a Hero. If all else fails, we rename him Mythril Titan to differentiate him.

The main issue here is that it took direct intervention by Kilmorph to imbue Mithril with the necessary magic... Although you could get around that by saying it's just an Iron Golem, in Mithril armor.

 

[Thuellai]

Well, yeah. That's kind of the idea - the Bronze/Iron/Mythril Body promotions are their version of the Weapons others can get. He's still a base Metal Golem, just with his body sheathed in Mythril to make him more awesome. As opposed to the Mithril Golem Hero, who is a Golem actually made of pure Mythril. And you're definitely someone I'd like helping me on this.

 

[cyther]

I really like the ideas of this mod, they would be great for spicing up the Luchurip. I probably will use whatever is made in Rise of Darkness.

It's sort of sad really. Like fangirls all of the interesting features all flocked to the "bad" civs and left the goody Bannor and others all alone in the cold.

Making golems on terrain or improvements would be interesting too but I truely fear a pigs resource spawning a golem made of porkrinds.

 

[Valkrionn]

It'll make it's way into FFPlus too. I had been thinking about what civ to work on next, but got sidetracked by the Mechanos... You've solved that problem nicely.

I've noticed that too though.... Most of the civs that are powerful, are evil. We need more strong Good civilizations.

 

[Vermicious Knid]

It'll make it's way into FFPlus too. I had been thinking about what civ to work on next, but got sidetracked by the Mechanos... You've solved that problem nicely.

I've noticed that too though.... Most of the civs that are powerful, are evil. We need more strong Good civilizations.

Llosaljafar, Malakim, and Mazatl are all strong good guys with interesting mechanics. Sounds like the gnomes are on their way to relevance.

Fall Flat had some good stuff for the Amurites. They probably aren't far from viability. Need a cool mechanic of some sort.

Kuriotates would be fun if their weakness wasn't so crippling. Weren't they supposed to get Lamias at some point? They could use a little love in general.

I haven't played the Elohim in Fall Further...so no comment.

Dural are boring as hell, in my opinion.

Ditto for Bannor.

Who else is there?

 

[Opera]

Llosaljafar, Malakim, and Mazatl are all strong good guys with interesting mechanics. Sounds like the gnomes are on their way to relevance.

Fall Flat had some good stuff for the Amurites. They probably aren't far from viability. Need a cool mechanic of some sort.

Kuriotates would be fun if their weakness wasn't so crippling. Weren't they supposed to get Lamias at some point? They could use a little love in general.

I haven't played the Elohim in Fall Further...so no comment.

Dural are boring as hell, in my opinion.

Ditto for Bannor.

Who else is there?

Ljosalfar aren't good per se. Arendel is but that's all. I tend to think of them as neutral rather than good. In fact, I actually think the same for the Svartalfar. Faeryl is evil, yes (maybe), but the civilization itself isn't imo. Elves just seem neutrals. End of digression

I don't think there is another good civ (but my memory may fail me). There is many more evil civs than good ones.

 

[Vermicious Knid]

What would make Bannor interesting to play?


If I understand correctly, they are a good empire that survived the Age of Ice? Their one and only unique mechanic is a fairly powerful civic option. Assassins are pretty useless against them.

Hmmm. Not much there. Jotnar and Lizards have equally interesting powerful civics. So do the Elves (nobody else can effectively use it).

No other civ has a Knight theme...maybe that? Templars, dismounted super-heavy infantry(champions), halberdiers (axemen), Clerics that can use faith-based stack enhancers. Courage liberally distributed as a free promotion. Perhaps a mechanical representation of their tendency to charge headlong into danger? Quest events?

Another way to take it is make them a good counterpart to the Orcs (who are mutant ex-Bannor if I understand correctly). Throw the orc-slaying promotion around. Put their mounted line on some other animal...there is a giraffe rider in the database, but that doesn't feel right. Lions? At the very least use lions for their hunters and such. Courage as a free promotion. They used to be fans of Bhaal pre-fall, so give their tier 3 and 4 melee/mounted units Strong and Crazed. Maybe a "cleansing fire" theme. Lots of inquisitor ability, extra population loss when conquering cities.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

The Bannor are descended from those followers of Bhall who remained pure but fell with her into hell, thus avoiding the Age of Ice and returning once it was over.

I think that making Courage or Valor the Bannor Racial promotion, or maybe just having it apply to units built in their capital, could be a good idea. I don't like the idea of giving them crazed at all, as they are very orderly and their peculiar form of insanity is not one associated with the uncontrollable rage that Crazed would lead to. Strong would probably be overpowered.


I don't like the way their towns spawn units randomly during a crusade, as it is not good for the economy and it doesn't happen where the troops are really needed. I think it would be better to remove the automatic spawning and give the Bannor a special recruit spell for use in villages/towns.

It could be nice if Bannor forts/villages would spawn their own defenders when encroached upon.

 

[deadliver]

It could be nice if Bannor forts/villages would spawn their own defenders when encroached upon.

Exactly my sentiment, or their villages should provide defensive bonuses considering the pedia does mention that bannor lands are well defended. Either one would be justified I think.

Regarding courage or valor as a promo, I guess Guardsman is okay...in numbers but i could see valor or courage. The Bannor strike me really as a paladin realm, like the Cormyr in Forgotten Realms.

 

[Vermicious Knid]

The Bannor are descended from those followers of Bhall who remained pure but fell with her into hell, thus avoiding the Age of Ice and returning once it was over.

I think that making Courage or Valor the Bannor Racial promotion, or maybe just having it apply to units built in their capital, could be a good idea. I don't like the idea of giving them crazed at all, as they are very orderly and their peculiar form of insanity is not one associated with the uncontrollable rage that Crazed would lead to. Strong would probably be overpowered.


I don't like the way their towns spawn units randomly during a crusade, as it is not good for the economy and it doesn't happen where the troops are really needed. I think it would be better to remove the automatic spawning and give the Bannor a special recruit spell for use in villages/towns.

It could be nice if Bannor forts/villages would spawn their own defenders when encroached upon.

You see, that is an awesome backstory right there. Not boring at all. But that backstory doesn't come across in the game. I had to go delving into the lore forum to find out more...and a race of fanatics that were dragged down to hell and managed to fight there way back out more or less unscathed should be anything but boring to play.

I can see where guardsman came from as a civ trait (a vacation in hell makes you jumpy). That promo isn't really significant until you start facing assassins though...and when it does become useful it isn't terribly flashy.

Perhaps as a first step change the civ trait to something more flavorful/exciting? As a first stab...

Tempered: Free promotion for just about every unit. Immune to Fear, 25% resistance to death/fire/unholy, +25% vs. illusions. Allows guardsman and access to a number of xenophobia-themed promotions (elfslayer, orcslayer, dwarfslayer, giantslayer, etc...).

Represents that they were hardened and tested in their journey out of hell. They are well-equipped to battle demons and undead, and very wary of the "impure".

 

[WarKirby]

Why not go make another thread for bannor discussion. This one is about luchuirp and golems

 

[Brokenbone]

Y'know how the Clan has Warrens which double the production of living units? Something like that for Luchiurp, applicable only to golems, may be interesting. Maybe the second one starts out with a "Spare Parts" promotion which is the equivalent of "Weak" (-1 att/def), maybe blocks any Master equipment promotions if "fancy after market add ons" become part of this Luchiurp rethinking, but to at least give it something that makes it worth its maintenance costs, maybe let it sacrifice itself to cast Repair or a juiced up version of Repair on its stack.

Anyhow, golem factories spitting out not just "perfect" product, but "surplus, scratch and dent stuff" as an afterthought, possibly unreliable through some negative promotions etc. like suggested above, or different handicaps (double terrain cost, susceptibility to additional damage types, weakness, randomly losing all movement points once in awhile, dunno), may be a little something to fool around with. Again, if you're racing against Armageddon, there's certain weapons of war you'll take pride in, but you might have a waste-not / want-not attitude about your cannon fodder or reinforcements for garrisons etc. (picture three dwarven slingers and one half-blind one legged Iron Golem!)