GPP, overrated or underrated?

Tecibbar

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I feel that GPP is overrated. Could someone show me otherwise?
 
He's probably posting this in response to a thread on general discussions, where someone said pacifism sucks, Rusten (hadn't seen him in a while) came on and said that GPP was underrated, and that pacifism is one of the game's best civics for its time, and probably about 6 other posters then felt the need to *insist* that pacifism was too costly/not very useful.

The argument becomes tiresome after a while though. I've seen games played by deity players that showcase very clearly just how useful GPP can be...yielding tech rates that these players saying pacifism sucks have never, ever matched. If they don't want to listen, though, nothing that can be done. The less stubborn will at least give it a serious look and improve. The rest will just stay bad.
 
How are great people overrated? They are all good in certain points of the game. You can use great people to discover technologies no one else has and trade them with other civs to catch up in tech.
 
He's probably posting this in response to a thread on general discussions, where someone said pacifism sucks

yes


I've seen games played by deity players that showcase very clearly just how useful GPP can be...yielding tech rates that these players saying pacifism sucks have never, ever matched.

Could you show me those games?
 
You get way more infra than me. I'm closing in on the reasons though. Just by looking at that empire now, it's obvious to me that I'm not whipping enough, and that my micro prioritization is off.

But damn, 700 AD rifles with a settled spec approach. I *will* find a way to play at this level, somehow!
 
Thank for showing the game, but I don't see you overfocusing on GPP. Looking at the settled specialists and the Great people bar. I am guessing you are at your 10th GP. Which is not uncommon at 700AD for a philosophical leader with GLibrary and pyramids.
 
pyramids have nothing to do with the GPP speed at all (it just make it even more profitable to run)
 
I feel that GPP is overrated. Could someone show me otherwise?

In case you can't bring youtself to anything useful about them, think about golden ages... and now if you tell golden ages are overrated...
 
How could you insist pacifism was too costly? It has no upkeep, the only cost is for units which if were running organized religion is usually a wash or often I come out ahead cost wise over OR. If most of your infrastructure is up pacifism is much better than OR, and if you're not building military then theocracy is wasted. I usually switch to pacifism a handful of techs before liberalism, chain a couple golden ages and bulb some of education to get lib lightning fast and have a golden age for my civic changes.
 
Most of the players who say gpp are overrated are probably playing lower difficulties and don't do much tech trading. I know when I play prince I usually am tech lead the entire game, but if you're playing emperor and bulb a tech no one has it can have awesome trade value and backfill tons of tech for you.
 
Even at the Noble level, I was playing a significant portion (sometimes most) of the game in Pacifism. A combination of representation, Castes, and Pacifism can generate incredible research no matter what level at which one is playing. (I am now playing mostly prince/monarch and my love of pacifism has carried over 100%) The only times I avoid it is when I am in a clearly military situation. That "no cost" is misleading when you decide to build a big military in this civic. Generally, that's when I abandon it: when my reserve army gets big enough that unit cost is problematic. Then it's time to get free religion and destroy your backwards enemies' riflemen with tanks and bombers. (At low difficulty levels, anyway)

After that, you can turn to your not so backwards enemies knowing you have the added manufactuing capacity of the people you just killed. At difficulties up to prince, this can be achieved without even abandoning Emancipation/Suffrage, and thus maximizing economic muscle during wartime. It's been said that a motivated democracy is the most frightening military force the world can know, and every time I've been in a US/WW2 level situation in civ iv, I have proven just that.
 
It's sometimes kinda funny how people tell Deity players they are wrong :). I sometimes find it hard to believe what they are saying, but then again who am I to tell them they are wrong? I beat Monarch with comfort, but haven't finished a emperor game.
It's my lack of skill of not being able to use the skills the Deity players use that make me doubt their advices mostly, but then I always quickly realise they play Deity and I'm not :D
 
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