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Éa, The Ageless and the Divine (phase 2, alpha)

Discussion in 'Éa Fantasy Mod Project' started by Pazyryk, Dec 21, 2012.

  1. Lplate

    Lplate Esus (Allegedly)

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    Hi,

    I've got the hotfix. I'll see if it works with the Sophronicus.

    Played a few more games, Agrarian with Ab and Abdelar and Pantheistic with Madb.

    Sometimes when I built Hunters with Ab, it did not establish camps on the Elephant camps outside ring 3 even though I had the techs for establishing camps further out. I already had a camp 5 tiles from the capital. There were no other cities close by. I had no issues with the Madb fishing boats. (Managed to get Madb before Ys was founded.)

    Lua logs are attached. Ab and Abdelar games ended fairly early. The Madb game lasted til turn 267 but then the system froze without the usual Lua message, so that might be down to my laptop rather than the game.

    I've only seen one barbarian heal himself. This might be a problem with the core civ game but it's a bit ridiculous to be able to beat any barbarian by attacking, healing and attacking the (now weakened and unhealed) barbarian again.

    Seas look very safe. Are there plans to introduce a few barbarian sea monsters (when there's graphics available)?

    In the Madb game, my research had ground to a halt (I had 19 techs). I had started a sage writing the Tome of Equus. Would this have enabled me to get the final horse tech?

    What file do I need to edit to change the number of players and city states? In the setup, it still indicates 6 and 12 for Small and 8 and 16 for Standard. I thought fewer city states were to be used in Ea. All of the games have been peaceful apart from the barbs. I'd like to try with more tribes crammed together so conflict can begin sooner.
     
  2. Pazyryk

    Pazyryk Deity

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    The Ab game has the same Hippus city naming error as your previous game. This should have been fixed by hotfix c (let me know if that's not the case). Save game file might be helpful for the Aldebar game. This one is already corrupted when you loaded from a save. I may or may not be able to learn something by looking at it. For the elephant issue, I can't find any problem in the code that would specifically affect this resource and not other camp resources. Keep in mind that elephants are only tradeable with Mounted Elephants. So maybe the camp was built but you didn't see the trade resource? If that's not the case, I'll need a savegame where this failure occurs.

    That's base Civ5 feature. Barbs don't heal, except by pillaging improvements. (I agree with you that this is weird. Maybe something to change later in the mod, at least for the one sitting on the encampment.)

    Absolutely. And land monsters/animals too. It's one of my major pet peeves with Civ5: exploration and revealing of the whole map is just too easy. My sea border system makes it even more so (though borders is a stupid way to block early exploration anyway). I need some monster art though to really tackle this problem.

    That one gives you 2% x Scholarship Mod bonus for Horseback Riding and War Horses (plus an xp bonus for horse-mounted units). So if your sage had Scholarship=10, then you would get 20% research on these techs. So if you were exactly at a standstill from Knowledge Maintenance, this would bring you back to 20% of base and allow you to finish those.

    Number of full civs is unchanged from base (defaults for map size). You can change this with a line like:
    Code:
    UPDATE Worlds SET DefaultPlayers = 10 WHERE Type = 'WORLDSIZE_STANDARD';
    or change by +2 for all map sizes with:
    Code:
    UPDATE Worlds SET DefaultPlayers = DefaultPlayers + 2;
    The proper place to put this would be in CoreTables/GameInfo.sql under the "Worlds" section.

    City states is a bit more complicated due to ongoing mod construction. Technically speaking, there are actually 41 minor civs in every game but most of these are taken up by pantheistic gods or never placed on the map. For v7 (not the upcoming v8!) the number of actual City States placed on the map is 6, regardless of map size. To change that, open up PreGame/AssignStartingPlots.lua and search for
    Code:
    self.iNumCityStates = 6
    (at or near line 1495) and change that. v8 will properly grab that number from the Worlds table based on map size. (Note: you will see the line: "UPDATE Worlds SET DefaultMinorCivs = DefaultPlayers;" in the Worlds section. That made City State number = player number in v5 and will again in v8. It was/is ignored in v6/v7 due to coding for pantheistic gods.) This and some other texts in the Game Setup menu are wrong.
     
  3. Regul

    Regul Warlord

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    Just jumped in the new version as i tried the first alpha some time ago. Very inspirating and i like the economic combinations. (need lumber to build siege weapons and ships...aso). The heroes...well, sometimes i had 5-6 of them, while still playing with my first city, what makes me wonder about the usage.

    BTW, i couldn't get lumber...no way, even when the city had the extention and free woods have been arround. Another point is, i couldn't build elephants cage also i had made the research for it.

    Game ended after 2 CTD's and stucked with only warriors. Looking forward to see more improvings. Good work!
     
  4. Pazyryk

    Pazyryk Deity

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    Yikes!!!! I might have done something terribly wrong when I restored normal save menu UI. In fact, I can't see how gamesave (via the save menu) is working at all in v7. For the moment, you should only use quicksave (F11) or restore from an autosave. Both of these should work fine. Don't trust save via the menu. It will produce a bad save and may even corrupt the game in progress.
     
  5. Pazyryk

    Pazyryk Deity

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    Hotfix d attached. This fixes a serious game corruption problem when saving from the save menu (which I introduced in v6). Includes earlier hotfixes. "Extract Here" inside your MODS folder.
     
  6. Pazyryk

    Pazyryk Deity

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    I'm still working through some difficult issues related to savegame. I wrote some code to test whether saved mod data is perfectly synchronized with the actual gamesave file. Answer so far is that it is for games saved by quicksave or (with hotfix d) from the save menu, but not for autosave.

    So for now, treat autosaves as potentially broken. I'm working on a solution but it is too complex for a hotfix. Will be in v8.
     
  7. Lplate

    Lplate Esus (Allegedly)

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    Few more thoughts (note: I haven't installed the last hotfix yet);
    I assume that natural harbor idea hasn't been implemented yet. I didn't gain a harbor when researching the tech or founding a city after researching the tech.

    I don't think you should make libraries less attractive for the AI - it can be the most sensible build to start with. If a player wants to be Ys, they'll have expect to race for it. In the endgame, those who've more techs have a major advantage. I've got Ys twice.

    In the long term, you might consider an option to disable certain naming events (and obviously alert the AI not to go for them).

    Warriors should be able to upgrade directly to the iron wielding units. I'd stacks of iron and iron working but the warriors couldn't be upgraded as light infantry, with a copper pre-req, was the only upgrade option.

    Generally, in all my test games, I don't think that policies have been common enough. I'd expect without a major culture focus, that a tribe should have enough culture for all of the policies in one policy branch or a good mix, i.e. about 8 policies, when not focussed on culture, by the time they're running low on tech options/have conquered their continent. I'd suggest doubling the rate of policy acquisition.

    There's a good chance that a civ won't have all of the resource gathering techs when they conquer a city. I think improvements in unclaimed territory or in a territory which doesn't have their pre-req tech should degrade to pillaged as they are not being maintained properly. Workers should not be able to repair improvements, if their tribe doesn't have the tech to build them.
     
  8. Pazyryk

    Pazyryk Deity

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    I had science flavor jacked up pretty high for library, so the reduction is good anyway so the AI will more often build a worker or monument instead. And if you play Emperor+ with large AI production bonus, there was basically 0 chance for human to get this name. We'll see how it goes now.

    Thanks for the policy feedback. I have two variables to adjust, one affecting "limit" (how many you can ultimately get as a function of total culture / total population) and the other affecting how fast you approach that limit. I recently cut the former in half, but then I did a massive yield overhaul reducing yields across the board (including culture) so everything is off right now. So I need you to answer two questions: Is the early rate of adoption about right? Is the late game (approaching) number of policies right? (I take your comment as addressing the second question.)

    I thought natural harbor was working -- I'll check that.

    Thanks for reminding me about the "non-standard" unit upgrades. I'm just now (as of last night) able to add extra actions for non-GP units. I needed these so you could sell slaves or put mercenaries up for hire. I had forgotten alternative upgrades though. I'll add those now...
     
  9. Pazyryk

    Pazyryk Deity

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    This one fixes a lot of holes in the game. Slavery system should all be in place now, ready for testing. Missing resources (that were preventing some units) are placed now. Strategic resource placement on the map finally got some attention, so feedback on that is welcome. Units now have alternative upgrade paths!

    New manual for v8 is linked in the OP. Less and less grey stuff. I did add more detail on city state effects, though that is grey out (next on my list, I promise!).

    Éa II, v8 (breaks saves)
    • Includes v7 hotfixes
    • Some improvement to mod-data preservation in autosaves (autosaves are still a bit dicey for now)
    • Can sell Slaves for 30g with the Slave Market building
    • Can render Slaves for 20p with the Slave Knackery building
    • Servi Aeternam policy: total civilization unhappiness is converted to production divided among all cities
      --All Slavery branch mechanics listed in manual have now been added; these need testing
    • Added alternative unit upgrade paths (see specifics in Manual)
    • Hunters given flavor so they will be built by AI
    • Fixed Fishing Boats so they can be built by inland cities if there is an unimproved lake within 3 plot radius (& gave them some land tile improvement flavor so AI will build)
    • Fixed bug in water expansion: did not occur properly if fishing/whaling boat constructed on same turn as a "natural" border expansion
    • Naphtha (strategic resource) is now properly placed on map
    • Removed "Blasting Powder" as a strategic resource. All "gunpowder" units (including cannon-bearing ships) now require Chemistry in addition to some other tech. (I did this because all of these units also had Iron requirement, so it seemed redundant. And cannon ships had 3 resource requirements, which seemed like too many.)
    • Yew (strategic resource) is now properly placed on map
    • Re-balanced strategic resource placement on the map. Copper, Horses and Iron should be fairly common. Yew should be reasonably common in forests. Naphtha, Reagents and Mithril should be rare. Elephants maintain their patchy (luxury-like) distribution.
    • Yew resource is removed if plot no longer forest or jungle
    • Added Bowyer's Camp improvement (available with Bowyers tech) as an alternative way to improve & hook up Yew resource without Sawmill (so you don't need Milling tech).
    • Added automatic help text generation for units that have >1 tech requirement
    • Building policy reqs are now automatically indicated in tech tree mouseover
    • Changed Crossbowmen: now requires Milling tech (180p; 8/8; range 1 as all "archers"; Piercing promotion gives +20% vs. melee), upgrades to Arqubussmen
    • Added Arquebussmen: requires Machinery & Chemistry techs; requires Iron (320p; 15/15; range 1; Piercing II promotion gives +40% vs. melee)
    • Fixed bug in Natural Harbor code: works now
    • Fixed Top Panel so it will show strategic resource that has no tech reveal or tech trade requirement (i.e., Timber; this is why it wasn't showing even though you had it)
    • Timberyard no longer has tech requirement. City must own at least 1 forest or jungle plot. Provides +1 Timber by itself. The building is also required to receive additional Timber from sawmills (+1 timber per 2 sawmills) or unimproved forest or jungle (pantheistic only; +1 per 4 plots)
    • A small part of Mercenary system is implemented: with Mercenaries policy you can put combat units "up for hire". Currently, no one hires so it has no gameplay effect. But the UI will indicate what price you would get when it does work...
    • Boosted policy progression from v7 (about 2x higher late game; less than 2x early)
    • Returned city state number back to base map defaults (numbers indicated in start menu for map size)
     
  10. Pazyryk

    Pazyryk Deity

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    If you happen to be one of the first two people who downloaded minutes after I posted, discard what you have and re-download. I had one mistake that would prevent Bowyer's Camp from being built. (I didn't want to post a hotfix after only 5 minutes.)
     
  11. onedreamer

    onedreamer Dragon

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    Yeah I am not discussing the shift, but adopting a policy should give you something, even if not a GP. Btw I thought with "free warrior" it was meant a normal warrior unit, not a GP. Even just a normal warrior unit would be a decent opener for this policy.

    They are freshwater plots. Tundra next to river is what I meant (and I assume next to lake).

    Downloading v8 now, I couldn't play the past week.
     
  12. onedreamer

    onedreamer Dragon

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    bugs in v8 (will edit if I find more)

    game
    - Mayd civ spawn doesn't work, probably because of the changes you made to fishing boats.
    - a civ attacked a city state which asked me for help. I haven't lifted a finger but one turn later I got quest completed.
    - Pantheism and Agrarianism aren't exclusive.

    manual
    - outdated description for Fir Bolg (you switched tech names)
    - Undocumented: building Stonehenge will reduce your city production of 80% (AFAIK) initially, which will gradually lower. With the indicated bonus resource (stone) this reduction starts at 42%.
     
  13. Pazyryk

    Pazyryk Deity

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    I just checked Pantheism and Agrarianism (in game) and they were exclusive in both directions. I got the "do you want to go into anarchy popup". (The mod doesn't account for switching between exclusive branches right now, so the game will break in many ways if you choose that. I'll disable it in v9.)

    Perhaps related however, I got the "stuck popup" problem twice in a row on goodyhuts. What happens here is that almost any error in UI causes the game to think that you have a popup open when you don't, preventing others from opening. (So perhaps you didn't see the anarchy popup above.) This is really a base game problem and causes several serious bugs in base Civ5 (like players not getting annex/puppet popup when conquering cities, so being forced to annex). The mod might be exacerbating the problem though...

    Edit: Another problem I'm seeing now is there is a "run out of city states error" happening during init. Problem is related to the fact that I returned city state number to original map default (in conjuction with the pantheistic gods system). Doesn't always happen. When it does you won't even have unit panels in game so something is obviously very wrong. Just restart and possibly reduce map size. I'll have a fix for this soon...
     
  14. Pazyryk

    Pazyryk Deity

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    Hotfix a for v8 attached below. "Extract Here" inside your MODS folder.

    This fixes a crash when AssignStartingPlots runs out of available city states. There are only a certain number available in each game. The number varies from game to game (depending on how the game engine randomly sorts out city states and pantheistic gods), but the max number of city states should be around 17 or so. You will receive this number if it is smaller than the default number for map size (e.g., 20 for Large).
     
  15. Pazyryk

    Pazyryk Deity

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    Ah! I see the elephant problem now. city:IsHasResourceLocal evaluates to false if you don't have the trade enabling tech (Mounted Elephants). Funny thing is, if you had it outside of 3 plots (and had extended range from Tracking, or if you had some other camp-resource in range) then the mod would see that and allow you to build Hunters and improve the Elephant. I want to keep the strategic Elephants resource only available with Mounted Elephants, but the plot improvable with Hunting. I'll figure out some way to solve this.

    Very minor issue: you'll get some free Timber for the first 10 turns if you have forest or jungle in your city radius. Mod thinks that these were "chopped" on turn -11, so is giving you some chop Timber for 20 turns after that. Timber related change: for v9 I'm requiring Sailing or Mathematics to build Timberyard. You only need Timber for ships or siege so it is a waste for AI to build this without one of those techs.


    Edit: Still problems with AI policy selection. Really two problems: 1) they can't pick certain specific policies for some reason and 2) they have no inhibition about opening exclusive branches so are constantly going into anarchy and losing benefit of previous policies. This has serious consequences, to say the least...


    Edit2: OK, found & fixed both problems with AI policy selection. I think this will finally get us past the turn ~130 barrier. The AI should be much more formidable too. I'm going to do a few hrs of fine tuning on the AI and release v9...
     
  16. Pazyryk

    Pazyryk Deity

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    This one has some pretty important bug fixes for AI.

    Remember to follow instructions in post #2, THINGS YOU NEED TO DO TO MAKE IT WORK, especially when installing a new version. I only say that because I violated that rule and spent hours tracking down a bug that didn't really exist...

    Éa II, v9 (breaks saves)
    • Includes v8 hotfixes
    • Timberyard requires either Sailing or Mathematics (since you only need Timber for ships and siege -- don't want AI wasting early production on this)
    • Fixed minor bug that gives you some free Timber before turn 10.
    • Fixed Tech Panel so it doesn't try to show FINISHED: <hidden tech>
    • Fixed bug that would crash if GP woken while doing research & no research tech currently selected
    • Fixed bug in AI policy selection that was preventing it from selecting prereq policies
    • Fixed AI so it won't open mutually exclusive policy branches
    • Improved UI to reflect changed research rate when changing tech selection (e.g., if you have an applicable Tome). UI update was previously so delayed it was hard to see the effect.
     
  17. Lplate

    Lplate Esus (Allegedly)

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    I decided to test what would happen if I played with a culture focussed civ (this was with v7). I played the Eleutherios, with just two cities, both with stable pops around pop 6-7, both with two grape resources. I fully retract my suggestion to double the rate of policy acquisition. My civ had 16 policies by turn 206. Tradition was complete, which meant that there was a tasty bonus for research from the right hand side of this branch (even with out the finisher). The last three great people I received were all sages. Two tomes were in production, so the civ was guaranteed to be able to reach some high end techs. My second GP was the only artist I received. Noone else was close culture wise.

    My land area dwarfed the others as Forest Dominion was providing a nice expansion effect.

    I noticed that the options for gaining culture from kills are disabled in version 7. This may help other civs to catch back up on culture. I think Tradition is probably the most powerful policy branch I've used, as the steps within it actively aid in completing the policy branch and picking up the others afterwards.
    Maybe alternative ways to gain culture could be added (or maybe I'm not aware of them), e.g. Agrarians gaining culture for clearing forests/marshes. I haven't built any Wonders (apart from Stanhencg) in my games, so perhaps these will contribute a healthy level of culture also.

    Downloading latest version. I'll try Slavery again and see how it goes.
    I have not been able to clear forests. Has that been sorted in v8 or v9?
     

    Attached Files:

  18. onedreamer

    onedreamer Dragon

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    Well, what I meant is that I wouldn't get a lock on Agrarianism after going Pantheism, while I would with Theism (which is also mutually exclusive with Pantheism). I didn't actually try to click on Agrarianism and wasn't aware of anarchy mechanics. Honestly I would just make it completely exclusive like with Theism, in case you haven't already done it since you fixed it.


    I agree with Lplate that maybe policy acquisition is now too fast, but on the other hand I never thought it was too slow (I felt it was in line with the general -somewhat slow, if compared to base civ- progression in the mod).

    For balance talking among policies I think it's too early to discuss, since many branches are incomplete.


    PS: what happened to gatherer's hut? You didn't forget about it did you?
     
  19. Pazyryk

    Pazyryk Deity

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    Hotfix a for v9

    "Extract Here" in your MODS folder.

    This will dramatically improve AI policy selection in the mid-game. (v9 basically fixed the AI policy selection "hardware"; this hotfix supplies the "software".)
     
  20. 400cats

    400cats Chieftain

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    Whenever I try to play v9, I start with no units or LOS and immediately get the "You are defeated!" window. It might be something on my end because my computer reacted a bit weirdly to v7 before it started to work. I'm trying a couple of different things (different map size, removing hotfix a, etc) to see if its a problem with the # of city states generated or something related to the game like that.

    Although I haven't experienced them yet, the new changes to resources like timber and the reworking of gunpowder units both sound very good. They're going to make securing resources for units much less arbitrary.
     

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