(06) Proposal: Units Should only Heal at +5HP Within the Borders of a Revolting City

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usadefcon1

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I always thought it was realistically inaccurate that a city that has just fallen would be able to resupply an army (or navy).

I propose that units should only heal at +5 HP within the borders of a revolting city (the fist symbol✊)

This mechanic would be interesting in the spy game too as you could cause a revolt right before an attack.

EDIT: If the city is being Razed :c5razing: units within the borders of the city would heal at +20 HP (looting).

EDIT 2: Within the borders of the city (not 3 tiles)
 
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Stalker0

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Let me take it one step further. What if revolting cities just didn't have city borders while they are revolting? Now if your remaining cities have enough border to cover than so be it, but otherwise you lose all the benefits of friendly terrain, which I think makes even more sense.
 

Rekk

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Let me take it one step further. What if revolting cities just didn't have city borders while they are revolting? Now if your remaining cities have enough border to cover than so be it, but otherwise you lose all the benefits of friendly terrain, which I think makes even more sense.
This would be a nightmare to code.
 

nekokon

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Historically it's very common to "use war to feed war", and lots of cases armies had to take over the city to survive when their supply was cut.
If anything, healing all units around the city when it's captured would make more sense and more historically accurate (then you can apply the reduce healing while city in revolt thing).
Even though I assume it would make warfare a bit too good, but feels like that needs a buff anyway.
 

Stalker0

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Historically it's very common to "use war to feed war", and lots of cases armies had to take over the city to survive when their supply was cut.
If anything, healing all units around the city when it's captured would make more sense and more historically accurate (then you can apply the reduce healing while city in revolt thing).
Even though I assume it would make warfare a bit too good, but feels like that needs a buff anyway.
You could do that as an effect of razing. When you raze a city, every unit within 3 gets a big boost to healing. That does several things:

  • Gives razing a use beyond "this city sucks and I don't want it"
  • It focuses on a short term versus long term option. A razed city gives you a big boost to healing, but then you lose the city and its borders for longer term healing.
  • Fits in with the history you described.
 

usadefcon1

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You could do that as an effect of razing. When you raze a city, every unit within 3 gets a big boost to healing. That does several things:

  • Gives razing a use beyond "this city sucks and I don't want it"
  • It focuses on a short term versus long term option. A razed city gives you a big boost to healing, but then you lose the city and its borders for longer term healing.
  • Fits in with the history you described.

I was thinking the same thing. There aren't too many benefits of razing right now, this would help.
 

CppMaster

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You could do that as an effect of razing. When you raze a city, every unit within 3 gets a big boost to healing. That does several things:

  • Gives razing a use beyond "this city sucks and I don't want it"
  • It focuses on a short term versus long term option. A razed city gives you a big boost to healing, but then you lose the city and its borders for longer term healing.
  • Fits in with the history you described.
That should be a counter proposal to this. No borders from a revolting city too.
 

Recursive

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The original proposal has been amended to add the following:
EDIT: If the city is being Razed :c5razing: units within 3 tiles of the city would heal at +20 HP (looting).
@usadefcon1 Please also make a new post in the thread when you make an amendment to your proposal. :)

It's helpful to ensure people watching the thread get notified, and it creates a record of when the proposal was changed for anyone reading the discussion later.
 

Recursive

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Proposal sponsored by me (in current form).

(This indicates that I am able and willing to perform the code changes required for this proposal if the community votes Aye on it. Other coders are free to sponsor this as well.)
 

Kevun1

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Sounds like a very interesting idea, but the only problem I have with this idea is that a 3 tile radius may be incongruent with city borders. For example, suppose you great general to have your borders be 2 tiles away from a captured city. Do your units now have reduced healing even though they were in friendly territory even before the capture? What about if a unit was in neutral territory, but within 3 tiles of the captured city? It wouldn't make sense for it to suddenly heal less since the city was captured. And with the healing boost when razing, what if that 3 tile radius is in the borders of an enemy city? I think the proposal should only effect units in friendly territory (probably intended but should be clarified).

Also, what about revolts due to inquisitors/unhappiness? I'd imagine you don't intend for these to count but they both have the fist symbol, so I think it's important to clarify (and I'm assuming its easy to differentiate between captured city revolts and other types of revolts code-wise?).
 

Rekk

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I agree that it would work way better (in code and immersion), if it's based on city borders instead ofa 3-tile radius. The map UI tells you what the city's borders are (at least EUI does).
 

usadefcon1

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I agree that it would work way better (in code and immersion), if it's based on city borders instead ofa 3-tile radius. The map UI tells you what the city's borders are (at least EUI does).

Oh that would be easier to code? I'm not sure why but I thought it would be harder. Yeah we should definitely use the actual city borders.

Also, what about revolts due to inquisitors/unhappiness? I'd imagine you don't intend for these to count but they both have the fist symbol, so I think it's important to clarify (and I'm assuming its easy to differentiate between captured city revolts and other types of revolts code-wise?).

Why not? The city is revolting against you.
 

azum4roll

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Counting only "within borders" may make fewer units being able to heal at increased speed if you have taken some of the razed city's territory before capture. I'm not sure how much this actually matters, but it doesn't feel right.
 

Rekk

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Counting only "within borders" may make fewer units being able to heal at increased speed if you have taken some of the razed city's territory before capture. I'm not sure how much this actually matters, but it doesn't feel right.
You're not looting the territory that you stole from them, just like you can't pillage it.
 

Recursive

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Just remember that you can stop City Razing
Yes, but it won't revert the population loss.
To prevent exploits, the game already tracks the lowest population that a captured city has been razed to. If you cancel razing, grow 1 pop, then raze, you won't get any war score for it, for example.

I would recommend applying this here as well (though it may not be transparent to the player).
 

Recursive

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I sponsor this proposal, as amended.
 
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