pineappledan
Deity
Counterproposal to: https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/2-17-proposal-early-naval-unit-rework.680296/
A Response and re-submission of this proposal
Proposed Change:
Add a Galley melee boat at Fishing, move the trireme back to Philosophy, and cosmetic changes to the Dromon.
Galley
available at Fishing
70
3
12
Trireme
Available at Philosophy
120
4
18
Quinquereme (Carthage trireme replacement)
Available at Philosophy
120
4
20
Heavy Assault
Pincer
Dromon Changes:
rename to "Liburna"
Change attack animation to arrows instead of shooting greek fire
shrink unit model slightly
No balance changes
Reasoning:
Moderator Action: Note: This change would also affect the Barbarians. Galleys would not spawn until 80% of civs have researched Fishing. - Recursive
A Response and re-submission of this proposal
Proposed Change:
Add a Galley melee boat at Fishing, move the trireme back to Philosophy, and cosmetic changes to the Dromon.
Spoiler details :
Galley
available at Fishing
70

3

12

Trireme
Available at Philosophy
120

4

18

Quinquereme (Carthage trireme replacement)
Available at Philosophy
120

4

20

Heavy Assault
Pincer
Dromon Changes:
rename to "Liburna"
Change attack animation to arrows instead of shooting greek fire
shrink unit model slightly
No balance changes
Reasoning:
- Galley/Trireme split:
- The trireme currently comes just slightly too late, and it's a bit strange that units can embark before there is a proper boat to defend them.
- Closes the gap between trireme and Caravel, in which time triremes become desperately obsolete vs ranged attacks and city defenses.
- Regularizes the naval melee line, giving a 2 tech gap so the naval game can "keep up" relative to land combat, without awkward lags and spikes. This spacing also doubles the number of units that unlock in late classical(!), which I find can get pretty stale without any new toys.
- Quinquereme
- This resolves some strangeness with some civs with their interactions with the melee unit line:
- Polynesia has an ability that lets them build fishing boats with melee ships, but melee ships currently unlock 1 tech after fishing. In fact, there is another proposal to address this specific issue right now.
- Carthage has an early trireme UU, which makes it anachronistic in ancient era, and it unlocks an entire unit domain before any other civ even can field units that can occupy the same tile type. The UU is doubling as a naval conquest unit and early scout, conflating Hanno's voyage 100 years before the invention of the Quinquereme, with it's use in the Punic wars.
- This also restores Carthage's incentive to go for the Sailing tech. Their UA currently takes the lighthouse off this tech, and the UU moves the unit unlock off this tech, leaving the tech barren, with only a wonder and a trade slot
- This resolves some strangeness with some civs with their interactions with the melee unit line:
- Dromon/Liburna
- The liburna is an antecedent ship design to the later Dromon first employed by Dalmation pirates in the early classical era. The design de-emphasized ramming, with a greater emphasis on speed. The Dromon's creation was iterative on the Liburna, so the existing unit model is a passable representation of both.
- Dromon's have a strong association with Rome and Byzantium, and with the deployment of Greek Fire. This is hyper-specific to a Mediterranean context. While a Liburna is still a mediterranean ship, it's more general in design and usage than napalm-spitting Byzantine dromons.
Moderator Action: Note: This change would also affect the Barbarians. Galleys would not spawn until 80% of civs have researched Fishing. - Recursive
Last edited by a moderator: