(2-25) Proposal: weaken the religious building Order

[alchx]

Currently building Orders in every city in a wide empire generates an insane amount of faith for unit kills. With each era, the effect of these buildings becomes stronger, although in reality the buildings of the early eras should reduce their influence on cities and empires.

The screenshot is not very informative, but will give a rough idea of the scale of the empire. As a result, about 30 cities are under direct control. This allows you to get approximately 8k faith in one turn by killing enemy units in an all-out war, each against all the rest. Together with Zealotry, you can not bother with the production of ground units and aircraft at all, but simply produce ships.

I don't want to introduce any coefficients or limit that only 4 Orders at most can generate faith, because the possibility of a wide game should remain and the player should be compensated in it for the higher prices of science and policies.

I suggest that each Order building gives a bonus only 1 time per turn for the first kill. And it gave a fixed amount, so that the player did not have to kill an expensive unit first, and then cheap ones.

Something like +8 faith in the early era. +16 next, +24(+32) next.

Moderator Action: Clarification: Proposal is for the Order to award +8 Faith, scaling with era, applied only once per turn instead of every time a unit is killed.

Spoiler :

 

[DeAnno]

I agree that Orders get out of control, I'm not sure this is the solution I would like (it's a new mechanic and seems like it could still be fairly strong to me) but it'd be nice if something was done to tone them back. Ultimately I think the problem is that the instant faith scales with era, number of kills per turn already scales somewhat so it's effectively a superlinear scaler.

 

[axatin]

I can sponsor this

 

[Recursive]

Proposal sponsored by axatin.

 

[pineappledan]

Didn't see this one before.

I suggest that each Order building gives a bonus only 1 time per turn for the first kill.

I'm a little worried that this might create weird incentives. Like encouraging players to space out their kills between turns, or disengage after they have made their 1 kill so they can max their order kills rewards.

 

[DoveCDog]

I see it's too late now to make a counter-proposal, but maybe a better idea would've been to change the bonus based on map size.

Tiny maps: 6 faith on kill
Standard: 3 faith on kill
Huge maps: 1 faith on kill

 

[AndreyK]

I see it's too late now to make a counter-proposal, but maybe a better idea would've been to change the bonus based on map size.

Tiny maps: 6 faith on kill
Standard: 3 faith on kill
Huge maps: 1 faith on kill

What about epic or marathon? (also a large?)

 

[DoveCDog]

What about epic or marathon? (also a large?)

I think faith purchase costs scale with game speed, so that would balance it out

 

[Favorius]

Why not limit bonus like we have in Runestone or Acropolis? Bonus faith is generated in the city that produced the unit. To compensate increase bonus faith.

 

[pineappledan]

We wanted it to work different from the acropolis.

I think the yields on kills are okay. Maybe they could be reduced to 2 on kills and still be worthwhile. It’s a mechanic that you have to work on, rather than passive rewards, so I’m not opposed to it being situationally powerful. OP’s grinding front in the late game ignores all the turns where he didn’t kill anything since founding.

Implementing a 1 kill per turn reward will create a weird incentive to space out kills. At nearly 3x power from what it is currently, I could see orders becoming even more of a problem than they are now, if people manage to find a barb camp to farm in mid game, or a front against a weak opponent that they can just bleed forever.