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2 scout opening

Discussion in 'Civ5 - General Discussions' started by spellsteal, Dec 26, 2013.

  1. spellsteal

    spellsteal Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2013
    Messages:
    23
    continent -standard
    difficulty- immortal
    race- greece

    first tech pottery
    2 scout opening -> shrine if desert tiles if not monument into shrine -> worker -> 4 pop settler -> buy archer


    I've been doing this opening for 5+ games and I must say I've liked it a lot. I'm able to scout out the whole continent before real estate are taken up by other civs. Then I plant the scouts on the border of warmongering AI to see if they're moving their units (knowing an attack is coming 10+ turn ahead really really helps preperation!)

    What are the downsides do you see in this opening?
     
  2. APCY

    APCY Chieftain

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2013
    Messages:
    38
    Continent map is boring
     
  3. TheGrumpyBuddha

    TheGrumpyBuddha King

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2013
    Messages:
    822
    Ignore APCY, he got a lump of coal for Xmas and he's all grouchy.

    I used to open that way but I tend to go for warriors first now, at least for the first build, because they are better at snatching AI workers.
     
  4. mikeville

    mikeville Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2013
    Messages:
    59
    Location:
    Kansas
    I still go scout-scout-shrine, and if I know I'm on Pangea, I'll do Scout-Scout-Shrine-Scout.

    I just feel like knowing the land and finding potential choke points and future city locations can make or break a game for you. Not to mention the goody huts!
     
  5. Barghaest

    Barghaest King

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2011
    Messages:
    758
    I usually go for a 2 scout build and use them to tag team barbarian camps for bonus cash early on (and culture when I go Honor) and as skirmishers to delay/weaken early AI zergs through rough terrain. One of the real disappointments for me in the default game is Scouts having no upgrade path (apart from ruins but Scout to Archer gives you an ranged unit that ignores terrain cost and gets severely OP as the game progresses... especially if you managed to get Survival III before this happens giving you archers with double strength on defense who have a chance to withdraw from melee and heal every turn).

    Now I seldom play unmodded games and my current mod-in-progress has a line of upgrades for Scouts that remains Recon combat class and goes to Penicillin where you get a Marine Recon unit. They're still extremely weak vs most Military units because they lack access to Drill/Shock but make excellent skirmishers due to ignoring terrain cost and are very strong on defense with the Survival promotion line. They also make good spotters for indirect fire and air/missile strikes but attempting to attack a city with them is suicidal under most circumstances.
     
  6. chazzycat

    chazzycat Deity

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2010
    Messages:
    2,897
    I generally don't build 2 scouts on continents just because 1 will do the trick and there are so many important things to build that early. An earlier monument, extra warrior, or earlier granary all might be worth more than the 2nd scout, depending on the situation. Warriors can keep an eye on the AI just as easily, but they also boost pointy stick rating and are slightly less useless if war is actually declared. To max the scouting from your starting warrior, send him on a nice large loop so he isn't getting back to your capital until the last possible moment (when your 1st worker pops).
     
  7. cinattra

    cinattra Warlord

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2002
    Messages:
    193
    Marine Recon Scout! Sweet! :cool:
     
  8. Kizo

    Kizo Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2012
    Messages:
    97
    Ever since trade routes and the change in barbarian aggression, I always build a second scout and prioritize leveling up both of them to have +2 sight. I can't overstate how nice it is to park them on hills around my city, giving me a massive area of vision and keeping barbarians out and trade routes safe.

    With that said, I like your build order, OP. I'd personally include some other terrain options in my check for whether or not to build a shrine (marble/stone, gold/silver, salt/copper, gems/pearls), and maybe save a worker for later if I'm able to steal one from a CS quicker than usual.
     
  9. Barghaest

    Barghaest King

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2011
    Messages:
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    Yeah, they start with Amphibious, Defensive Embarkation, Embarked Sight, Extra Sight, Ignore Terrain Cost and have a Combat Strength of 50 and only get access to Recon promotions, so they're really weak vs Mechanized Infantry (and even regular Marines) but fun to use.... especially since I added a few earnable (utility, not combat bonus) promotions to the Recon line - Paradrop with Mobile Tactics, for one.
     
  10. reddishrecue

    reddishrecue Deity

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2009
    Messages:
    5,375
    I used to do this 2 scout opening in gnk before the shrine and then the worker since most of the technologies for improvements aren't researched by the time the two scouts are done. Now I usually do the scout shrine worker start instead. 2 scout opening could be good in finding more ruins and good at an island with large mass but it could not be that effective when stuck in an island with little land .
     
  11. neo_one

    neo_one Chieftain

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2008
    Messages:
    11
    I like two scout start. more goodie huts. You can almost skip monument since you get a lot more goodie hut, you might get culture from them
     

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