2194 Days of War Civilization III

[pap1723]

Well, I just released my 2194 Days of War Gigamap Version for Civilization II, so I am now working full go on a version for Civilization III. You can take a look at the scenario here:

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=80325

http://www.historic-battles.com/2194Days/index.html

For Civ 3 the scenario will be similar, but it will be an even bigger scale. It will be of the whole world like my other scenario and it will feature tons of units for each country. As of right now, there are more than 50 units decided on for the German side. The scenario starts in December 1941.

The Civs are as follows:

Japan (Japan, parts of China, Vietnam)
Germany (Germany, France, Yugoslavia, Greece, Romania, Hungary, Austria, parts of Russia, Finland)
Italy (Italy, Albania, parts of North Afirca)
America (America, Phillippines, Guam, Wake, Midway, 1 Airbase City in Britain)
Britain (British Islands, Middle East, Egypt, lots of islands in the Pacific)
China
Soviet Union
Neutrals (South America, parts of Africa, Turkey, Sweden, Switzerland, Spain, pretty much everyhwere where a larger power would not make sense)

 

[pap1723]

Here is a screenshot of what most of Germany and Italy looks like, tell me what you think of city choices and placement. The railroads that you see are actually roads, but the graphic is replaced with railroads.

 

[Procifica]

Marseille should be in France somewhere, it is France's second largest city.

La Spezia, could be Florence or Pisa?

Naples shouldn't border the Adriatic.

Strasbourg looks like its too far southwest. Lyons should be added somewhere.

Frankfurt and Cologne look to be too far north.

Cracow should be added.

Vienna seems to be too far east.

Leipzig is on the wrong side of Berlin. Berlin itself looks too far east.

Manchester should be added.

Britain did not have alot of islands in the Pacific.

Japan had alot of islands in the Pacific.

The USA had alot of islands in the Pacific.

Germany should have bases in Libya.

Britain should have Malaysia and Hong Kong, as well as India and Burma. Parts of Africa too.

Overall, looks good.

 

[pap1723]

Thanks Proc, all duly noted, here is a question, I moved Berlin east an extra square so I could get Kiel in there, as it was an important naval yard during the war. I can move Kiel NW a square and Hamburg NW a square and move Berline back over, but then Kiel becomes a city in Denmark, is that better than how it is now?

 

[Procifica]

I wouldn't move Kiel, it already should be SE a square, but its decent where it is.

Hamburg also, shouldn't move anymore NW.

Leipzig shouldn't be where it is at all, so removing that would enable you to move Berlin. Then Leipzig or Dresden could be put in SSE of Berlin.

 

[pap1723]

Marseille should be in France somewhere, it is France's second largest city.

In, I just renamed Toulon.

La Spezia, could be Florence or Pisa?

Renamed to Florence

Naples shouldn't border the Adriatic.

Fixed

Strasbourg looks like its too far southwest. Lyons should be added somewhere.

Changed Strasbourg's name to Besancon
Lyons added SW of Bern

Frankfurt and Cologne look to be too far north.

Moved Frankfurt, unfortunatly I can't move Cologne anywhere else, moving it SE puts it too far East

Cracow should be added.

Done

Vienna seems to be too far east.

Vienna is actually further east than Prage in RL, but there just isn;t enough room on the map

Leipzig is on the wrong side of Berlin. Berlin itself looks too far east.

All the maps I've ever seen have Leipzig southwest of Berlin
Moved Berlin

Manchester should be added.

Where? I know it is real close to Liverpool, but I can't find room for it, any ideas?

Britain did not have alot of islands in the Pacific.

You are right, I meant possesions, Burma, India, Malaysia, Hong Kong, they will also have Indonesia

Japan had alot of islands in the Pacific.

Yes, I forgot to add them to the list, Truk, Okinawa, Kwajelin (sp) all in there

The USA had alot of islands in the Pacific.

Yep, got them too, Wake, Midway, Guadalcanal, etc

Germany should have bases in Libya.

Give them Tripoli perhaps?

Britain should have Malaysia and Hong Kong, as well as India and Burma. Parts of Africa too.

Done, see above

Overall, looks good.

Great, thanks, I updated the picture of Europe, looks a little better, but I can't figure out any other way to put the cities than they are now, if you have any other ideas, please let me know!

Pap

 

[pap1723]

Here is Britain and most of Scandanavia, Russia coming soon...

 

[pap1723]

South West Russia

 

[pap1723]

Northwest Russia and Finland

 

[Procifica]

Trondheim I believe is a little further up the coast. (north)

You're right about Leipzig, I was thinking of where Dresden is.

Ok, city population: Odessa, Minsk, Rostov, and Kiev should be bigger than Sevastopol. (meaning they should be that size, sevastopol shouldn't be)

Cologne should be the size of Berlin, the Ruhr was a heavily populated area (metro area larger than Berlin's).

Brussels should be larger.

Looks like you have too much rail in parts of western Russia.

Overall, looks excellent.

 

[pap1723]

Trondheim I believe is a little further up the coast. (north)

Fixed

You're right about Leipzig, I was thinking of where Dresden is.

No problem, at least you questioned me about it!

Ok, city population: Odessa, Minsk, Rostov, and Kiev should be bigger than Sevastopol. (meaning they should be that size, sevastopol shouldn't be)

Fixed all of em

Cologne should be the size of Berlin, the Ruhr was a heavily populated area (metro area larger than Berlin's).

Done

Brussels should be larger.

Done, 13 ok? Just big enough to be a metropolis then

Looks like you have too much rail in parts of western Russia.

Fixed, I got a little overexcited with it around Moscow

Overall, looks excellent.

Thanks for caring, I get the feeling that nobody really cares, I know you've felt the same way. I don't know why it is like that though. With Civ II at the Apolyton boards, everyone is always helping people out to make things so much better. Maybe it is because there have been a lot of bad scenarios released for Civ III so far, and a couple of good ones need to be released to get everyone excited?

Pap

 

[Procifica]

Well, I tend to look at all the scenario threads in this forum, well at least the historical oriented ones.

Fantasy ones and LotR don't interest me as much. (LotR is too overhyped in my opinion, much like Harry Potter and every other American craze)

Anyways, this is looking like a good WWII scenario. Unfortunately though, as I've stated elsewhere, alot of competition. 11 WWII scenarios are sitting in the Completed Scenarios forum, and counting this one, there are at least 4 being worked on in the C&C forum. Good luck.

 

[pap1723]

Here is the Western United States...

 

[pap1723]

And here is the Eastern US, NE of New York is Boston, and just to the west of where the map cuts off is Albuquerque...

 

[Procifica]

Ok, major major problems with the USA. First, why Carson City? LOL Go for Reno.

I'd add Spokane.

Houston was not that big in 1940. (should be mid-sized)

Cleveland was the 6th largest city in the USA in 1940.

St. Louis was in the top 10.

Atlanta was MUCH smaller.

Miami and Jacksonville were much smaller.

Washington DC was the 11th largest city in the USA in 1940.

Detroit was the 4th largest city in the US in 1940.

Pittsburgh was the 10th largest city in the US in 1940.

Jackson is too far south.

Lexington is WAY too far south. I'd go with Louisville instead anyways, or Knoxville.

Philadelphia really should be added. (3rd largest city in USA)

Florida is too narrow at the center.

Minneapolis/St. Paul is not on Lake Superior (several hundred miles south), and Lake Superior seems to stretch out too far.

Chicago sits on the southwest corner of Lake Michigan and should be moved south.

The Ozark mountains don't extend into central Oklahoma (Oklahoma City.)

Western Texas is too hilly/Mountainous. The only Mountains are near El Paso.

Too much desert in Central Texas (I lived in Killeen, worked in Austin, trust me, they get ample rainfall there).

Desert should start in far western texas, again near El Paso. If you're using an atlas, then it should be west of the Midland/Odessa area.

Phoenix is too far east.

I don't see the Rio Grande, which should be included.

The Ohio River extends toward Pittsburgh, not Cleveland.

Atlanta is way too far south.

Hills should be added between Buffalo and New York. (continue the mountain chain, there's a break in it, but these should be hills)

Butte is too far east and I'd use Billings instead.

I'd use Fargo instead of Bismarck.

Omaha should be added.

The map you used makes the Ohio/Indiana/Illinois area too small, which throws off Cincinnati and St. Louis. Cincinnati ideally should be further south, St. Louis further west. This in turn, means Kansas City also should be further west. To do this though, the Ohio River and Mississippi Rivers would have to be redone.

The Mississippi River runs through Minneapolis/St. Paul.

The Missouri River runs east of Omaha, not west.

Bismarck is 400+ miles from the Mississippi River (IE, the Mississippi is too far west up there).

San Diego is too far south.

There are no mountains in southern Texas.

http://www.census.gov/population/documentation/twps0027/tab17.txt

1940 official US census, that might help.

 

[Tiger_Nation]

I can't wait for this scenario could you pm me when it is finished

 

[pap1723]

Imagine that Procifica, I am from America yet I mess up the cities in America 10x worse than in any other part of the world!

I am going to fix everything today sometime.

Immortal, it is going to be a long time before this one is done. As of right now, only the cities are placed, and none are placed in Africa, most of Asia and South America yet.

Pap

 

[Smoking mirror]

Looks good.
I played the original captain nemo and alex the magnificent 2194 Days of War on civ II ages ago and it was one of my favourite scenarios. One thing you may want to copy from the original is to have differnt versions of the scenario fro each player, so that if you are playnig as the russians, your tanks are slightly weaker than the Germans; not realistic, but give you a real chalenge- The original relied heavily on events to balance the game (those spawning V2s were a pain in the kneck ) so unless the game is played on deity level you are going to have to ballance the game quite heavily in favour of the A.I. each time (though the civ III A.I is slightly better than the Civ II A.I. ).

To be honest I think in real life the the war was already lost for the axis powers by 1942 though certain events speeded that loss, such as the battles of midway and stalingrad.

One thought on the map, I think stalin grad and the caucuses should be connected by rail to Moscow, otherwise you won't be able to build tanks any where in the soviet union (the oil will not be conected by trade). On the other hand, those areas occupied by germany should have less rails, to simulate damage caused to the rail network during the invasion earlier in the year. Also remember that the ukrain was mostly an agricultural area so you may want to limit its production capabilities.

Procifica; I don't supose you know where I can get hold of population statistics for individual cities in the european theatre do you?

 

[Procifica]

Originally posted by pap1723
Imagine that Procifica, I am from America yet I mess up the cities in America 10x worse than in any other part of the world!

I am going to fix everything today sometime.

Immortal, it is going to be a long time before this one is done. As of right now, only the cities are placed, and none are placed in Africa, most of Asia and South America yet.

Pap

I was thinking the same thing Pap. My knowledge of US geography and stuff is augmented by the fact I've been to states from Washington to Florida, from New Mexico and Texas to New York. 22 states in all so far, and lived in 4 of them.

I'll let you know about anything else when you post a new set of screenshots with the fixes.

 

[Procifica]

Smoking mirror, I've been looking for such data myself. I've found maps that show approximate populations for Europe in 1871 and 1910 so far.