NOTE: This proposal had a math error that triggered a key change to the proposal. As such, voting has been reset.
Original discussion thread:
VP Congress: Session 5, Proposal 44
Current situation
God of the Expanse Pantheon belief
+34% Faster Border Growth. Gain 20
Faith and 10 
Production every time a City expands its borders naturally, scaling with game speed.
Last congress, a proposal changed all other border growth bonuses in the game from plot cost reductions to BGP modifiers.
This was done because multiple plot cost reductions stack exponentially, and they could combine to greatly increase border expansion. The total number of plot cost reductions also exceeded -100%, so it was possible to bottom-out the bonuses at an artificial minimum of -80% reductions.
This change to BGP modifiers is a broadly positive change, but it was done with no compensation for the GoExpanse pantheon, which relied on the stacking effect of plot costs and had its yield rate calibrated based on that. With the new border growth bonuses, GoExpanse has become almost impossible to found with.
All civs that aren't Mongolia and Russia at least have access to monuments, which used to combine with GoExpanse to give -50% plot culture cost. This is equal to 200% of regular border growth.
The new Monument + GoExpanse combine to give 168% of regular Border Growth. A difference of 32%. This means that GoExpanse is giving its 20/10 on tile claim at 5/6ths the rate that it used to.
Proposal:
Increase God of the Expanse Yields on Border expansion to 25 Faith and 15 Production
Reasoning
This increases the faith by 25% more yields than GoExpanse gives now.
Compared to the old GoExpanse:
this will give a little more yields per turn when combined with a Monument (20*100 = 30*0.68) as compared to when this ability gave cost reduction
This is compensated by the ability giving fewer tiles
It will synergize less with additional sources of border growth bonuses, like Russia, Mongolia, and Angkor Wat
This change will keep GoExpanse's synergies weaker than it was, but the rate that the pantheon generates Faith in the early game for most civs will be almost back to what it was before, but with a little more production.
Original discussion thread:
(5-VT) God of Expanse Buff
Current situation God of the Expanse Pantheon belief +34% Faster Border Growth. Gain 20 :c5faith: Faith and 10 :c5production: Production every time a City expands its borders naturally, scaling with game speed. Last congress, a proposal changed all other border growth bonuses in the game from...
forums.civfanatics.com
VP Congress: Session 5, Proposal 44
Current situation
God of the Expanse Pantheon belief
+34% Faster Border Growth. Gain 20
Faith and 10 Production every time a City expands its borders naturally, scaling with game speed.Last congress, a proposal changed all other border growth bonuses in the game from plot cost reductions to BGP modifiers.
This was done because multiple plot cost reductions stack exponentially, and they could combine to greatly increase border expansion. The total number of plot cost reductions also exceeded -100%, so it was possible to bottom-out the bonuses at an artificial minimum of -80% reductions.
This change to BGP modifiers is a broadly positive change, but it was done with no compensation for the GoExpanse pantheon, which relied on the stacking effect of plot costs and had its yield rate calibrated based on that. With the new border growth bonuses, GoExpanse has become almost impossible to found with.
Spoiler here is a list of all the border growth bonuses in the game, what they used to do and what they do now :
All civs that aren't Mongolia and Russia at least have access to monuments, which used to combine with GoExpanse to give -50% plot culture cost. This is equal to 200% of regular border growth.
The new Monument + GoExpanse combine to give 168% of regular Border Growth. A difference of 32%. This means that GoExpanse is giving its 20
/10 on tile claim at 5/6ths the rate that it used to.Proposal:
Increase God of the Expanse Yields on Border expansion to 25
Faith and 15 ProductionReasoning
This increases the faith by 25% more yields than GoExpanse gives now.
Compared to the old GoExpanse:
this will give a little more yields per turn when combined with a Monument (20*100 = 30*0.68) as compared to when this ability gave cost reduction
This is compensated by the ability giving fewer tiles
It will synergize less with additional sources of border growth bonuses, like Russia, Mongolia, and Angkor Wat
This change will keep GoExpanse's synergies weaker than it was, but the rate that the pantheon generates
Faith in the early game for most civs will be almost back to what it was before, but with a little more production.
Last edited by a moderator:
