1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

6 Most Frustrating Leaders to Play Against

Discussion in 'Civ4 - General Discussions' started by LegioCorvus, Oct 21, 2009.

  1. RagingCalm

    RagingCalm Chieftain

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2009
    Messages:
    26
    Location:
    Pennsylvania, USA
    I'll throw a couple out there that have given me problems since I started playing BTS:

    -Hatsheput -- I know a lot of people like her but I've never had much luck. She almost never declares on me but, man, can she be a beggar even when she has a runaway tech lead. Her rapid expansion can be annoying as well.
    -Peter -- This guy really backstabbed in one game and he never declared. I discovered Confucianism, spread it to all of my neighbors (including him), and everyone converted. No problems thus far until Pete discovered Christianity. He managed to convert a neighbor and then, diplomatic relations went to pot.
    -Stalin -- This bugger declared on me at Pleased. Luckily, his stacks were somewhat backwards but he keeps doing it over and over again when he was my neighbor.
    -Catherine -- Same as other people have posted.
    -Shaka -- Again, same as other people above. Though at least you do know where you stand with him.
    -Mansa Musa -- This guy makes me groan when I see him, especially if he's on another continent and I can't get at him right away.
     
  2. ZeekLTK

    ZeekLTK Warlord

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2002
    Messages:
    259
    Catherine always gives me the most problems. She always declares war on me when she's on the otherside of the map and then sends tons of troops to come fight me for seemingly no reason at all.

    I tried to play the World Map twice, once as Japan and once as Mali. Both times Catherine declared war on me and just kept sending an endless amount of troops to come fight me. It was a lot easier to deal with as Japan (since I only had 1 city on the continent [around Korea]) but it really messed me up as Mali. I was on another map with her too and even though she was all the way on the otherside she did the same thing.

    I hate her!!
     
  3. Kawalimus

    Kawalimus Warlord

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2008
    Messages:
    247
    Location:
    Baltimore, Maryland, USA
    To start out it sucks when anyone creative is your next door neighbor. I mean Zara, Van Oranje, anyone with that trait. Because early in the game that 2 culture is brutal.

    Justinian--Always ends up as the leader of a worldwide religious cult. Can be very annoying.

    Mansa Musa--This guy can be your best friend or your worst enemy. He's easy to trade with but that can work for you or your opponents. And when it's working for your opponents you can get left behind. I usually end up killing him right when skirmishers go out of style because he's too dangerous. But if I can leverage him or vassalize him to be a good tech buddy I'll do that too.

    Tokugawa--Another love/hate. It sucks when you start out with him as your neighbor. But if he's in your game he's got a huge target on his back for a mid-game invasion when he starts to fall behind. But when he's your only neighbor you will be frustrated by no trading and then even more frustrated when he DOWs.

    Sury for reasons many have already stated.

    Joao--expands like a maniac.
     
  4. LeHam

    LeHam Prince

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2009
    Messages:
    375
    Location:
    Pacific Coast
    I had a game with Brennus, Alexander, and Genghis Khan for my neighbors. Earth2 map. I got an event that ended up improving my relations with Alexander so that he was Pleased with me.

    Then guess what happened next turn? Alexander suddenly declares war on me, then sends five phalanxes (this is just after we discovered bronze working, btw) to Philadelphia to capture it. Fortunately, I fought them off with four archers, then proceeded to starve my people to mass produce Axemem, and then crush two of his cities.

    Alexander can be a real pain. Brennus, though, I've found to be a good friend if you can get him on your side early.
     
  5. KaytieKat

    KaytieKat King

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2007
    Messages:
    999
    Hi

    Here are the leaders that tend to get on my nerves doing games. Not ALL of them have to do with making it harder to win the game but they do tend to get on my nerves.

    1) Rags. He is my ARCH nemisis. I SWEAR he is out to get me personally. Even IF I get him to friendly he will do stuff on PURPOSE JUST so he can drop dwon a notch and attack me. Like if in a game 99% of his cities are Judaism, I will convert eeven tho only ONE of my cities is judaic and and then VERY next turn he switches to his 1% religion and then attacks cuz he upset by being a pagan. I KNOW he does it on purpose it's in the code somewhere something like "if Kaytie is playing try to kill he no matter what"

    2)Sitting Bull this guy can be a MAJOR PITA. He is very hard unless you target VERY VERY early and if not you have to wait till much later and meanwhile he settles out as much as he can then just turtles up and then for REST of game until he is dead spies spies spies it is just annoying.

    3)Mehmed. This guy is just a TOTAL dillhole and cuz of his traits can be a major pain to have to deal with if he gets too big.

    4)Shaka. He actually scares me the most of all the AI's and I have no idea which is worse him being close by and having to scramble to deal with him and his unit spam and dow's or him being on other side of map and by time you meet him he has steamrolled all the AI's near him and is HUGE. He is even scary to have as a buddy cuz even when he is friendly and someone attacks me I kinda dont wanna ask him for help cuz before ya know it he has taken half their empire and then capped them and is now even BIGGER. Only reason he didnt make number one is cuz he isnt as annoying. He isnt after me peronally like Rags is and, unlike SB and Meh, when he acts like a dillhole at he can usually back it up so has the right to be a little cocky and act like he the tuffest ai on the block. Both Meh and SB act like that even if they just have 2 or 3 cities left.

    5)Julius almost as bad as shaka and can be an even bigger dillhole sometimes.

    6)Sury He is another of those dillholes who not only a dillhole but can become an annoyingly powerful dillhole if you dont watch it.

    Honorable mention goes to Nappy who can be like a mini Julius, Pacal who can be like a mini Sury. And Hattie, I know she is very very sweet and LOTS of ppl like her cuz she is so easy to be friends with. And that is kind of the problem she is EVERYBODIES friend. Youre arch enemy asks her for a tech and of course she is "always happy to help". Someone DoW's you is she gonna help? No cuz she couldnt "betray her close friends" She wont even close borders with em and just let them march troops through her territory into your backyard. And even when she doe shelp its like gee thanks Hattie Im sure that galley loaded with two cats is REALLY gonna help take the pressure of Shaka and is stack of 30 rifles :/. And to that her wonder, religious hogging and cutlrue pressure if she is a neighbor just makes her annoying.

    Leaders who surprizingly didnt make the list:

    Monty yeah he can be a pain early and he has ended a couple of games for me but getting mad at monty for DoWing on ya is like getting mad at a ******** puppy for piddling on the carpet or chewing up your fave pair of shoes. The puppy doesnt know any better and doesnt have the brain capacity to actually have any malice. He just being a puppy. Same dealio with Monty. He is a warmongering whackjob who cant help it. Cathy is similar situation. You know she a backstabbing skank who will go with whover gives her anything shiny so you know its not a matter of if you gonna have to kill her just when. Then there is Alex. Alex can be on same level as Nappy and Julius it just I kinda feel bad for Alex just cuz there has been at least a half dozen games where its been like I call him up on the diplo phone and am like "Alex sweetie Rags or Nappy or whoever is picking on me. Can you DoW on em for me, please? Coolies, I knew I could count on ya!!" and he usually a good enuff fighter to keep whoever I send em after busy but NOT SOOO good I have to worry bout him running away and taking a whole continent like shaka. Unfortunately next time I call poor Alex on the diplo phone its usually something like "Alex thanks for taking care of that for me. It helped LOTS. So much in fact that now I am THIS close to a dom win and just need to kill off one more civ and since youre not only closest but cuz most of your army is on other side of map fighting that ai I asked you too youre also easiest target. So uh sorry but thanks again for all youre help. K, gotta go now, bye" So Im a lil more understanding when he acting all snippy in other games cuz I feel a little bad for that. But only a little hehe :p.

    Kaytie
     
  6. dalamb

    dalamb Deity

    Joined:
    May 9, 2006
    Messages:
    3,160
    Location:
    Kingston, Ontario
    Kaytie: :lol: I love the way you phrased your comments.
     
  7. KeloGBites

    KeloGBites Warlord

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2009
    Messages:
    274
    Alex always has it coming. That guy will declare war at the absolutely WORST times. "Whats that you just switched out of slavery/nationhood? ATTACK!"
     
  8. LeHam

    LeHam Prince

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2009
    Messages:
    375
    Location:
    Pacific Coast
    I imagine If I were an AI I'd be one of these really annoying leaders. Not because I'm that competent or anything, mostly because I send out my troops simply to piss you off or because you settled that one city before I did, or something equally stupid. Course, if I'm losing and it looks hopeless, I'll just end up suiciding myself and going out in a ball of flames and/or clouds of radiation.
     
  9. Nothingontv

    Nothingontv Warlord

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2009
    Messages:
    152
    Location:
    The Netherlands
    My most frustrating leaders vary from time to time, but some are always on my list.

    1. Gilgamesh (always on the list)
    2. Cathy (new on the list) in one of my recent games she expanded like crazy leaving
    very little room for me. War solved that but still...
    3. Ragnar (always on the list) when i started playing i didn't understand that AI's DOW
    at different points. I was like..why did he attack me? He is pleased with me!
    4. Sury (always on the list).

    Numbers 5-6 change all the time.

    I never really had a problem with Alexander, the American leaders or the English leaders.
    Actually i can't even remember ever having the English as a neighbour.
     
  10. mtr12

    mtr12 Prince

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2008
    Messages:
    596
    Erm, I've got a somewhat different list, I suppose.

    1) Charlemagne
    Its worth picking this guy just to not have him appear as an AI. Seriously, this guy means that you'll have to send your Early Rush in another direction...if you can even still do an Early Rush. The kicker is that he remains useful later into the game, and is a REX master who manages to keep midgame income issues under control thanks to the Rauthaus. All this makes him one of the strongest AIs in the game, and the most annoying one to face. If you get dragged into a war with him, even if you win, the other AIs will have ran away in tech while you spent all your resources on an army to take his ridiculously well-defended cities.

    2) Zara Yaqob
    This is my favorite leader. He has probably the best AI out of any leader. He can tech well, he can expand, and he can beat out his buddies in terms of power. Although nothing really screams at you, he's a competent, intelligent AI who always poses a challenge.

    3) Sitting Bull
    Protective is as annoying as ever, and this guy has solid midgame potential with Philosophical. The thing is, though, that he rarely is a top power like Charlemagne or Zara Yaqob, and usually ends up fading into obscurity by the Rennaissance.

    4) Montezuma
    This is the guy that tells you 'time to die' and then smiles about it. That really about sums it up: there's something to be said about a leader who is content to live in a metaphorical cave as long as he can throw stacks of units at you.

    I don't know about the rest, just that Protective is really annoying.
     
  11. baba_yetu

    baba_yetu Chieftain

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2009
    Messages:
    4
    pacal II
    tokugawa(agg-pro)
    j. caesar
    hannibal
    victoria
    hammurabi
     
  12. Ramesses-Rules

    Ramesses-Rules King

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2008
    Messages:
    837
    Location:
    Sequim, WA
    You absolutely have to be on guard against Alex at all times. His UU trumps mine, which makes him especially dangerous in the early game. In my last Emperor game, I launched an early war with Cyrus and was winning nicely. I converted Alex to my religion before I started the war, but he attacked anyway at the WORST possible time, when I was about ready to declare peace with Cyrus.:mad:
     
  13. mariogreymist

    mariogreymist Deity

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2009
    Messages:
    2,201
    I think a lot of this is probably about chance (how often have I drawn them as an opponent, and how often have they been gifted favorable starts)

    Sury
    Kublai Khan
    Mansa Musa
    Shaka
    Stalin
     
  14. JP1

    JP1 Warlord

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2009
    Messages:
    185
    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    1. Tokugawa- If this is an 'annoying' list, Tokugawa MUST go at the top. He may as well have been an empty slot, or maybe a barbarian civilization. His incredible unwillingness to trade anything means he'll never be a huge threat to win, but also slows down the game around him. However, he'll be an annoyance to just beat up on early on because he'll spam out a bunch of units and has Agg/Pro.

    2. Shaka- If he starts off close to you, you'll be at war with him before too long whether or not you want to. If he starts next to others, he has a reasonable chance of getting some vassals and making a huge pain out of himself for the rest of the game, and he keeps up in tech better than some of the other warmongers. He is the perfect Vassal if you smash him first, though.

    3. Monty- Just annoying and unpredictable. And somehow, he always manages to be a totally different religion from everyone else in the world, giving him an excuse to attack you. He's usually not totally incompetent in other areas of the game either.

    4. Gilgamesh- Somehow, he always seems to be high up on the charts, doing well for himself. He's also annoying to try to rush early on.

    5. Cathy- Needy people suck. People who give -2 on a refusal suck. Sury could have also taken this slot, but Cathy seems to be a little more competent most of the games I play.

    6. Joao- He expands like crazy, then make a nuisance of himself constantly begging for/demanding things.

    Honorable Mentions:

    7. Sury- See Cathy, but slightly less competent, and far more ugly.

    8. Mansa Musa- A total tech whore who can be a serious threat, but you can use him pretty well by trading with him or sending spies to visit.

    9. Izzy- The easiest AI in the game to manipulate... But sometimes, you just can't afford to be the same religion as her, and you can expect her to DOW you 5 or 6 times that game.

    10. Ghengis Khan- Kinda like Shaka the Lesser in most of my games. A warmonger who just seems to do a little worse killing other civs and keeping up in the tech race.
     
  15. dalamb

    dalamb Deity

    Joined:
    May 9, 2006
    Messages:
    3,160
    Location:
    Kingston, Ontario
    I'm not so sure Mansa is all that bad -- I've had him voluntarily capitulate as soon as I got Feudalism in a couple of games. Then he's a nice tame research helper -- unless he goes for a cultural victory faster than you can get to your own VC.
     
  16. JP1

    JP1 Warlord

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2009
    Messages:
    185
    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    Most of the time, Mansa Musa's a great research buddy I love having on the map, but if he starts out far away, he can occasionally get himself in a good position and research so fast that he's a huge annoyance that has to be dealt with as soon as possible.
     
  17. cdcuase

    cdcuase Warlord

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2005
    Messages:
    134
    I get really mad when Zara is beside me. He always manages to expand faster than I can and gobbles up territory that I was planning on taking.

    Surry comes a close second.
     
  18. kochman

    kochman Deity

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2009
    Messages:
    10,818
    Making them two of my favorite targets for an early rush, especially sury as he is annoying as hell and usually will be so kind as to found a religion or two for you before you crush him, see him driven before you, and hear the lamentation of his women.
     
  19. jmas

    jmas I Can Has Imperium?

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2007
    Messages:
    399
    Location:
    US
    Do you mean Izzy (Isabella), rather than Lizzy? I don't think I've face Lizzy as an opponent yet, but Izzy is the one with the religious zealot reputation.
     
  20. JP1

    JP1 Warlord

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2009
    Messages:
    185
    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    Yes, that's what I get for mixing in a half-dozen abbreviations. I'll fix that.
     

Share This Page