[DLL] (7-NS) Buff rebels and partisans

[Yngwie]

So, there is a problem with snowballing warmongers. They can easily take one City after another without problems and move their troop’s forward regardless resistance and unhappiness. One of the means to slow them down is rebels and partisans.

By now, Rebels and Partisans are fairly weak option. They can act only one turn after spawning. In most cases they are wiped out by that time. For some Civs these “problematic” Units could be even beneficial (Aztecs, France etc.)

So, to change the situation and to make unstoppable warmongering less powerful it is proposed to buff Rebels and Partisans.

Proposal:

• Rebels and Partisans can act immediately.
• All spawned Partisans and Rebels gain +1 Movement and +33% Combat Bonus within 3 tiles of unhappy Cities (Temporary “Rage” promotion - 10 turns long)

 

[Phosphoraptor]

This needs to come with some UI indicator especially for partisans on when they will spawn. Having low health units / ranged units get OTK by something you cant really react to (like them spawning right in the face of said units) is not very fun.

 

[pineappledan]

Having low health units / ranged units get OTK by something you cant really react to (like them spawning right in the face of said units) is not very fun.

Partisans spawning is predictable. You can’t react to them but you know where and when they will appear.

I think this is touching on something very apt. Partisans and rebels are often bonus fodder for my units to heal on kill and generate some extra yields. I avoid picking the Order tenet that blocks partisan spawning specifically because the benefits of farming partisans for yields outweigh the trouble they cause me. I think making them more dangerous is a good idea.

 

[pineappledan]

• All spawned Partisans and Rebels gain +1 Movement and +33% Combat Bonus within 3 tiles of unhappy Cities (Temporary “Rage” promotion - 10 turns long)

I would change this tho.

Rebels and Partisans can act immediately
All Partisans gain No movement to pillage
Partisans Have +33% CS and RCS when on a tile owned by a city in Resistance

 

[Tekamthi]

Could maybe just give them a withdraw from melee so they are more likely to survive til they can act, as a possible smaller change

 

[hokath]

So, there is a problem with snowballing warmongers.

Has there been a discussion about this? Could someone direct me to it if so!

 

[Anarcomu]

All Partisans gain No movement to pillage

I would also give them a bonus to heal on pillage. After all, if the city is revolting, "pillage" there could represent bringing more people to join the resistance, instead of a "classic pillage" you would do in other players' territories.

 

[azum4roll]

Rebels and Partisans can act immediately
All Partisans gain No movement to pillage
Partisans Have +33% CS and RCS when on a tile owned by a city in Resistance

Great, now they're completely impossible to defend from. The tiles they spawn on are guaranteed to be pillaged, along with adjacent ones.
And they cause even more unhappiness!

Sorry for the lack of constructive criticism, but there's simply no balancing this. Warmonger can always kill them more easily, and at the end either you kill all of them on their spawn turn and reap benefits, or you fail (even if slightly; or you remove their spawn turn inaction) and suffer multiple improvement/trade route loss. We have to just agree that warmongers have invested in war stuff and should benefit from it.

 

[pineappledan]

If the bonus is on resistance then it is functionally only for partisans. Same as the no move to pillage.

The intent is to make Partisans stronger specifically because they are being spawned in response to warmongers.

 

[Tekamthi]

Maybe on first move they only get 1/2 moves if they can act immediately. Is that possible?

IMO Withdraw from melee is the lesser impact compromise to draw out their survivability without anything too OP. Also suits the style of fighting and tactics I imagine partisans would employ, these aren't the kind of forces that are gonna hold a front line against the full brunt of enemy regulars...

 

[azum4roll]

Something that needs to be confirmed: are rebel and partisan spawning using the same code?

The free units from Self Determination also seem to use the partisan code if implemented based on its proposal.

 

[Recursive]

Something that needs to be confirmed: are rebel and partisan spawning using the same code?

The free units from Self Determination also seem to use the partisan code if implemented based on its proposal.

Rebel units and Barbarian Partisans spawn using CvBarbarians::SpawnBarbarianUnits(), which selects the unit type using CvBarbarians::GetRandomBarbarianUnitType().

Partisans belonging to the previous city owner spawn using CvGame:: DoSpawnUnitsAroundTargetCity(), which selects the unit type using CvGame::GetCompetitiveSpawnUnitType().

The free units from Self-Determination spawn in CvPlayer:: DoLiberatePlayer(), and call CvGame::GetCompetitiveSpawnUnitType() directly, but with different values for the arguments, which affects the possible units that can be chosen.

 

[Recursive]

Timestamp post to arrange all the threads in a neat order.