Legen
Emperor
- Joined
- Sep 13, 2015
- Messages
- 1,498
Counterproposal to (7-41) Remove Inquisition, New Reformation "Underground Sects".
Related to (7-41a) Inquisition rework.
Proposal
Rationale
My concern with the original proposal (7-41) is that Reformation beliefs can share their effect to other civilizations, which can result in the Spy effects (especially the Spy points) being granted to any other civilization you spread your religion to. These Spy effects are better kept restricted to the religion's founder/owner, which is the case for Enhancer beliefs.
The extra Spy Points is kept from the original proposal, as this Enhancer may be earned before Renaissance; having a base addition of Spy points means this belief won't be locked behind a tech requirement in order to work. The exact power of the extra Spy Points is still in flux; the Espionage rework is recent and the current balance is off as a result; other proposals exist to adjust (often downwards) the benefit of Spies, so the Spy Points are likely to have less power in future patches.
The addition of
Gold from having Spies operating in foreign cities is meant to ensure this Enhancer has a reliable benefit regardless of the state of Espionage balance, and is stronger than the current Inquisition, which the original proposal pointed out to be weak at the moment.
This proposal can co-exist with proposal (7-41a) Inquisition rework, as they aim for very different Enhancer beliefs with no overlapping effects. As such, should that one also pass, this one is changed to add a new belief, instead of modifying the Inquisition belief that proposal (7-41a) reworks.
Related to (7-41a) Inquisition rework.
Spoiler Inquisition enhancer belief :
Inquisitors cost 33% less
Faith, and generate 25
Gold per converted
Citizen when Removing Heresy. Your Spies exert +52 Religious Pressure on the Cities they occupy (Standard Speed), and +2
Happiness if stationed in a foreign City.




Proposal
- Inquisition renamed to "Underground Sect", with the following changes:
- Remove the cost reduction on Inquisitors and the gold for converting citizens with Remove Heresy.
- Add "Receive 100 Spy Points".
- Spies in foreign cities also grant +5
Gold.
Spoiler How the belief will look like :
Underground Sect (Enhancer belief)
"Receive 100 Spy Points. Your Spies exert +52 Religious Pressure on the Cities they occupy (Standard Speed), and +2
Happiness and 5
Gold if stationed in a foreign City."
"Receive 100 Spy Points. Your Spies exert +52 Religious Pressure on the Cities they occupy (Standard Speed), and +2


- If proposal (7-41a) Inquisition rework passes, this proposal adds a new enhancer belief with the above text and effects, instead of changing the Inquisition belief.
Rationale
My concern with the original proposal (7-41) is that Reformation beliefs can share their effect to other civilizations, which can result in the Spy effects (especially the Spy points) being granted to any other civilization you spread your religion to. These Spy effects are better kept restricted to the religion's founder/owner, which is the case for Enhancer beliefs.
The extra Spy Points is kept from the original proposal, as this Enhancer may be earned before Renaissance; having a base addition of Spy points means this belief won't be locked behind a tech requirement in order to work. The exact power of the extra Spy Points is still in flux; the Espionage rework is recent and the current balance is off as a result; other proposals exist to adjust (often downwards) the benefit of Spies, so the Spy Points are likely to have less power in future patches.
The addition of

This proposal can co-exist with proposal (7-41a) Inquisition rework, as they aim for very different Enhancer beliefs with no overlapping effects. As such, should that one also pass, this one is changed to add a new belief, instead of modifying the Inquisition belief that proposal (7-41a) reworks.