(9-WD) Workers Can Improve (And Barbs Can Pillage) Sea Resources, Delete Work Boats

[Recursive]

Proposal:
- Remove Work Boats as a unit.
- Barbarians are allowed to pillage sea resources (they are currently disallowed from doing so).
- Workers can improve sea resources upon learning the prerequisite techs.
- Polynesian Melee and Gun units use the new build time for Fishing Boats (they currently build them instantly).

Improvement​	Build Time​
Fishing Boats	500 (6 turns on Standard)
Offshore Platform	700 (8 turns on Standard)

Rationale:
- It's not particularly fun to build Work Boats instead of Workers.
- Work Boats are a gamey, unrealistic unit. Why do we only have Civ VI style workers for sea resources and not land resources?
- It's weird that filthy Barbarians are disallowed from pillaging at sea. A comment in the code says that the reason why is that it would be too annoying, but I don't consider this a valid reason because Work Boats are now gone and because of my next bullet.
- Provides an additional reason to build ships early game to protect your Workers and Sea Resources.

Build times were chosen arbitrarily, just seemed "about right", but open to suggestions on changing them.

Interaction with hokath's proposal:
If https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/9-108-integrate-civilian-puppet-purchases.701556/ also passes, because Work Boats are deleted, only Workers can be purchased in puppets.

Implementation Notes:
BuilderTaskingAI might need to be updated to allow this. Work Boats remain in Community Patch Only so the logic for them should not be deleted.
Should keep the Barbarian restriction in Community Patch Only, probably. This could be a CustomModOption.

---

Amendment #1: Added "Polynesian Melee and Gun units use the new build time for Fishing Boats."

 

[Legen]

For completeness' sake, will this affect Polynesia's ability to improve sea resources with military units (build time)?

 

[Recursive]

For completeness, sake, will this affect Polynesia's ability to improve sea resources with military units (build time)?

I'm not seeing anything in the code about the build time. Is it instant?

 

[Legen]

If nothing changed recently, yes. Just like with work boats now, but without consuming the military unit.

 

[Recursive]

Amendment #1: Added "Polynesian Melee and Gun units use the new build time for Fishing Boats."

 

[FPXI]

One suggestion. If we do this, then workers should use the workboat icon when embarked (if this is possible). It'll be more immersive, and just sounds kinda fun.

 

[Recursive]

One suggestion. If we do this, then workers should use the workboat icon when embarked (if this is possible). It'll be more immersive, and just sounds kinda fun.

I have no objections, but it would require a UI wizard to do that.

 

[hokath]

Build times were chosen arbitrarily, just seemed "about right", but open to suggestions on changing them.

There are 2 issues to consider: 1) embark and disembark turns and 2) pillage destroys the improvement (graphic for pillaged work boat is no good and/or doesnt exist)
I arrived at 400 and 800. So pretty similar.

 

[Tekamthi]

Is there any sort of build-in-progress animation for either workers or workboats in a water plot? I am not aware of any... This may be a somewhat visible deficiency of this proposal (and possibly why they were implemented as instant build consume unit actions in the first place). This would be my main concern.

Beyond that, we need more naval content, not less. Let's fix workboats instead...

Counter-proposal posted at https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/9-108b-workboat-is-captured-on-pillage.701574/

 

[FPXI]

Is there any sort of build-in-progress animation for either workers or workboats in a water plot? I am not aware of any... This may be a somewhat visible deficiency of this proposal (and possibly why they were implemented as instant build consume unit actions in the first place). This would be my main concern.

Could change my idea to "use work boat icon when building" as a kludge, but I agree with you generally.

 

[Stalker0]

There are 2 issues to consider: 1) embark and disembark turns and 2) pillage destroys the improvement (graphic for pillaged work boat is no good and/or doesnt exist)
I arrived at 400 and 800. So pretty similar.

MAGI: @Recursive agree with this, how do you intend the improvment to interact with pillage? Does it work like today and it has to be completely rebuilt, or does it gain a pillaged version that is repaired like land tiles?

 

[usadefcon1]

Is this identical to the "Hokath's Proposals Misc Changes" mod with workable sea tiles? If so you should link it here so everyone can try it.

 

[pineappledan]

So the day has come.

Polynesia improving sea resources with melee units is kind of a stupid ability if it's not saving any production, isn't it? It has virtually no economic advantage now, so why wouldn't you just drop it?

Are you going to do anything about how this throws out nice animations?

 

[azum4roll]

I think the time required should be shorter. It already takes 2 turns for the worker to embark and disembark.

Preferably there are also pillaged states for the sea improvements so it doesn't take as long to repair them.

 

[jarcast2]

I have no objections, but it would require a UI wizard to do that.

In VP there are tables to convert units from land to sea domain but there were never used and most probably don't work.
If put to good use, we may keep the workboat unit but make it unbuildable and have this switch worker<=>workboat with the latter building the non-kill fishing boats.

-- Allows you to Convert a unit when it X plot is a different domain, e.g. A great general becomes a great admiral, etc.
ALTER TABLE UnitPromotions ADD ConvertDomainUnit text REFERENCES Units (Type);
ALTER TABLE UnitPromotions ADD ConvertDomain text REFERENCES Domains (Type);

 

[azum4roll]

That'll require teaching the AI about it. Plus there's no way to turn a work boat back into a worker outside of cities or canals since it can't disembark.

 

[Recursive]

pillage destroys the improvement (graphic for pillaged work boat is no good and/or doesnt exist)
I arrived at 400 and 800. So pretty similar.

MAGI: @Recursive agree with this, how do you intend the improvment to interact with pillage? Does it work like today and it has to be completely rebuilt, or does it gain a pillaged version that is repaired like land tiles?

Preferably there are also pillaged states for the sea improvements so it doesn't take as long to repair them.

I would like for there to be a pillaged state like with regular improvements. But are there any graphics for this, or is there anyone with the ability to make them?

 

[hokath]

I think maybe @jarcast2 knows how to add smoke for the pillaged state (so normal boat + smoke)
Currently there is no model, the boat disappears and the tile is marked pillaged but there is not visual indicator, if I remember correctly.

 

[jarcast2]

I think maybe @jarcast2 knows how to add smoke for the pillaged state (so normal boat + smoke)
Currently there is no model, the boat disappears and the tile is marked pillaged but there is not visual indicator, if I remember correctly.

Yes I can, but I cannot decide where it would appear and compared to land it would look funny to have smoke coming from the sea.

 

[hokath]

Is this identical to the "Hokath's Proposals Misc Changes" mod with workable sea tiles? If so you should link it here so everyone can try it.

Doesn't include the barbarians pillaging or the Polynesian change but yes, you can try it

[Extension] Thread 'Hokath's Proposals'

Jul 4, 2024

Since the special session of the VP Congress will delay new proposals quite a bit, I am jumping on the bandwagon and making my (database implementable) proposed changes to base VP available.

Please find attached a single mod with neat little folders you can delete as you wish.
It includes:
Corporations Changes

Now VP is so stable, and AI bonuses less front-loaded, I find myself playing almost every game to the victory screen.
It becomes apparent that Corporations as they currently stand determine, in large part, the outcome of the game. Yet, you cannot reasonably...

• hokath
• Replies: 356
• Forum: Mods Repository

• 

it's in Misc/Work_Boats.sql if you want to delete the other stuff