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A closer look at the "War on Christmas"

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Che Guava, Dec 6, 2007.

  1. Che Guava

    Che Guava The Juicy Revolutionary

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    :xmas: Season's greetings CFC :xmas:

    As part of my penance for Pimpin' Santa Thread, I decided to start a new one looking at the alleged "War on Christmas" phenomenon.

    If you're not familiar with the issue, some media commentators over the last couple of years have running stories on how secularists and 'political correcters' in powerful places have been trying to take the religion and spirituality out of christmas, removing symbols of christianity, changing traditional greetings and the like. Some have even gone as far as to state that it is part of a larger conspiracy among the left/progressive/etc to remove religion from the American (or Canadian, Australian, etc etc) way of life.

    Critics of these commentators often say that the issue is overblown, that stories are misrepresented, and that, in short, there is no 'war on christmas' or conspiracy to do away with christianity.

    So.....why don't we try to take a closer look at this war on christmas and try to separate the facts from the BS...So here's what we do:

    *If you know of a story about the "war on christmas" (not an opinion piece, but an actual event or newspiece) post it here. News articles are better, but personal annecdotes are accepted as well.

    *Tell us why this represents either an affront to the spiritual roots of christmas, or if it is simply an overblown story. DEBATE SHALL ENSUE!

    *Try to make it as current as possible (i.e. from this year's season) but given that it's only Dec 6, you can use stuff from previous years as well...


    and let's try to keep the trolling and silly comments to a minimum, and just focus on the specifics o the stories presented. mmmmkay?
     
  2. Che Guava

    Che Guava The Juicy Revolutionary

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    ok, me first! This cxomes from a story in the BBC about British MP Mark Pritchard who is concerned about increasing "christianphobia" in the UK. Here is what he cites as an example of this:

    full article

    Personally, I'm not sure that fewer schools doing nativity plays is a sign of anything less than just respecting the secular nature of public schools. They're a public place that children have to go to, so it doesn't seem to me like the most appropriate place for such a performance...
     
  3. Leonel

    Leonel Breakfast Connoisseur

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    I'm not sure I care anymore.

    Speaking of which, I should put up some Christmas lights. :D
     
  4. brennan

    brennan Argumentative Brit

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    These people are just Satan Worshipping Capitalist Whores. Trying to rob this religious festival of it's meaning just so they can force everyone to buy more stuff. I mean if it's not religious then what objection can you have to it right?

    This stuff's even worse than Christmas.

    [/Scrooge]

    ;)
     
  5. Masquerouge

    Masquerouge Deity

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    :lol: try setting up Nativity plays in French public school, and we're on for one more year of rioting ;)

    Curiously enough, my impression is that the war on Xmas is a very US-centric debate (with, of course, the random UK lapdog trying to jump in). I don't think I've heard of any such stories happening in France.
     
  6. Bill3000

    Bill3000 OOOH NOOOOOOO! Supporter

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    Of course. You French are just a bunch of godless laïcité heathens.
     
  7. Huayna Capac357

    Huayna Capac357 Deity

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    In the US, we see Christmas, a holiday suppossed to celebrate Jesus' birth, and Jesus wanted people to giva away all their possessions, as an opportunity to buy stuff and eat stuff. One person I know think that we are suppossed to worship Santa!! That's a war on Christmas for ya'!

    (Though yes, I do think that it is Amero-centric...)
     
  8. Homie

    Homie Anti-Lefty

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    I didn't think this was something to be debated, it is obviously true. Well, it's not a "conspiracy", i.e. there are not a dusin or so men meeting in a secret location to destroy Christmas. It is, however, one of the outwardly obvious signs of the de-Christianization of Western society. There is no doubt that Western nations used to be as fervently Christian as muslim nations today are fervently muslim, but that that is no longer the case. It is also true that SOME atheists passionately hates Christianity, many of the Humanists really do (I tranlsated that from Norwegian, if they are called something else than Humanists, please correct me).
     
  9. Bill3000

    Bill3000 OOOH NOOOOOOO! Supporter

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    Nah, it's not necessary. Christmas secularized itself the moment it was made a secular holiday in the US.
     
  10. WillJ

    WillJ Coolness Connoisseur

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    Yep. 10char
     
  11. Verge

    Verge Let's hug it out

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    Whenever I see a media feature on the "War on Christmas" (it's usually from O'Reilly), it's usually about some trivial incident at a small business or municipality. Earlier this November, O'Reilly had a feature about the Fort Collins City Council in Colorado about deciding to put up white lights and plain garlands in lieu of more traditional colored lights and addorned garlands as according to Christmas traditions. This is supposed to be a problem? I honestly don't see the problem if the government of New Piddingtondale insists on calling their Christmas decorations "holiday decorations."

    The "War on Christmas" mainly exists because people care too much about it.
     
  12. Che Guava

    Che Guava The Juicy Revolutionary

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    But the point of this whole 'war on christmas' phenomenon is that commentators are saying that it is deliberate, it is a conspiracy, and that it will lead to a moral decay of society.

    From a segment of Bill OReilly in 2005


    link
     
  13. warpus

    warpus In pork I trust

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    Let's stop this madness and return Christmas back to its pagan roots, dammit.
     
  14. LesCanadiens

    LesCanadiens Deity

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    Christians are most responsible for the "de-Christianization" of society. As soon as you stop buying mass amounts of expensive crap to give to each other on Christmas and instead go out and help the poor waiting in line for a meal, then come back here and whine about the loss of Christmas.
     
  15. GoodEnoughForMe

    GoodEnoughForMe n.m.s.s.

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    He couldn't sound more stupid or archaic if he tried. "Secular progressive agenda"? WTF is that? Why is everything an agenda, or conspiracy, or war on this, war on that?

    Go Europe.
     
  16. Masquerouge

    Masquerouge Deity

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    Ahahaha great one!

    yeah it's really amazing the power of this Christian coalition, trying to push their anti-winter solstice agenda by conveniently having Christ born so close to 21-DEC... :mischief:
     
  17. GenMarshall

    GenMarshall Night Elven Ghost Agent

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    I am already prepared for the War on Christmas ;).
     
  18. WillJ

    WillJ Coolness Connoisseur

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    Oh my God, not HOLLAND!!!!!!!!
     
  19. GenMarshall

    GenMarshall Night Elven Ghost Agent

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    Give me the names of these people and I'll go after them and make them use the word "Christmas".

    Oh and be sure they have bounties on them ;).
     
  20. Homie

    Homie Anti-Lefty

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    Geez, I hate that juvenile argument that always came up in elementary school and junior high debates. "Christmas is really a pagan winter holiday" :rolleyes:
    I just can't roll my eyes enough to show my disappointment at seeing intelligent older men make this "argument". Obviously, according to tradition, Christians believe that Jesus was born in late December and so we celebrate his birth at that time. The fact that there used to be a pagan holiday at that time is irrelevant, even if that holiday was the very reason for celebrating Christmas at that time. As Christians, we are celebrating the birth of Christ, regardless of any history associated with the date. So why would this "winter-solstice" argument matter? Does it add anything to the discussion? That is a rhetorical question, because obviously it does not.
     

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