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A few questions from a newbie...

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by macmert, Sep 25, 2008.

  1. macmert

    macmert Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2008
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    Hey to you all, I am not actually a Civ newbie but new to the forums...

    I play Civ4 and all the xpansions for years but I never get to beat the game on harder difficulties, such as noble... I rarely beat the game by space victory on warlord difficulty... I have a few questions...

    1. Do you all play custom games or choose play now! option?

    2. How do you REX? I read every article in this site and just cant do it... The AI seems to dominate the land really well... the moment I have three cities, the AI has 6 or more! How the hell do you manage to REX? I even cant build with 50% settler building speed...

    3. AI doesnt cheat in that easy difficulty right? I manage to build my first city to a decent size and I see workers spinning around AI cities full speed with mines and such...

    Also I want to discuss something more... I think sometimes finding a religion is not a good thing, in one of my games, I was with Washington, Hammurabi and Napoleon... I founded Budhism and spread it continent wide... But with my incompetence, AI REXed me out and I was left with 3 cities... But I couldnt wage war cause Wash and H.abi was friendly with me... I didnt want to ruin the relations and since all region was budhist, I couldnt risk waging a war since I would be ganged by the other three brothers of faith...

    So any mini tips would be welcome and thanks for your interest
     
  2. Sian

    Sian Chieftain

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    don't be affaid of rushing an enemy early on ... don't be affaid of going below 50% science rate for some time ... try to block enemies so you can backfill cities instead of pushing them towards them
     
  3. macmert

    macmert Chieftain

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    Thank you so much... I try to backfill my empire but I rarely succeed... Well thank you for the tips
     
  4. ViterboKnight

    ViterboKnight Chieftain

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    Here's my experience (I play at Monarch, sometimes I win, most times I lose!).

    I REX when I'm Imperialist, and my target is: 6 cities for year 0 AD. Meanwhile, I try to have an income to maintain the cities, and this mean either cottages or a shrine (mostly cottages!).

    If I'm not imperialist, or if my neighbours are REALLY imperialist :) (as Catherine!), I try to found few and well-placed cities, and then try to expand by war.

    Don't start producing settlers and workers just after having found your cities. The production is faster if you let the city grow. A size of 2 or 3 is good to produce them at an accettable speed. Of course, there can be exceptions, if you NEED a city NOW, ABSOLUTELY. Besides, you can chop forests to speed up settlers/workers production.
     
  5. Orzio

    Orzio Chieftain

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    Rexing is about spaming settlers and cities. ONe key thing to remember is that gaining 20 breakers per turn on 20% science is better then geting 10 breakers per turn at 100%. Land is power in civ so eaven if you may get behind early you will soon catch up. I once rexed so mush that I lost 30 gold each turn at 0% science :D (15cities at 300bc on standard map) But it still became an easy victory after some courthosue whiping and gold trading i recoverd

    Ai "cheat" at all difficulties they just cheat more the further you go.

    I think most people play custom games.

    You right about relgion its often better to not found one and if you really want one steal it from someone else and dont be afraid to attack your friends. They can be your firend until you no longer need them then you backsteb them and take there land :D
     
  6. Sian

    Sian Chieftain

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    friends are those that want to trade with you before you conquer them :p
     
  7. macmert

    macmert Chieftain

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    Hmm I try to REX after the city pop reaches 3 or 4 but even that seems a bit late...

    I try to chop rush as much as possible... But sometimes I am beaten by luck... For example in one of my good start, in 25 th turn a barbarian uprising started and a stack of archers came in and destroyed my 2 fortified warriors and conquered my capital... or I get pounded by some aggressive AI who is not even my neighbor...
     
  8. MrCynical

    MrCynical Chieftain

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    1)Custom games - I like to be able to customize map types and so on.

    2)Bear in mind that REXing as fast as possible is near suicidal in Civ 4 - you'll bankrupt yourself. The one point you may be missing is the Slavery civic, which is a great help in the early stages of the game.

    3)At Noble the AI receives negligible bonuses. Below Noble the human player gets major bonuses compared to the AI, and vice versa above Noble.
     
  9. macmert

    macmert Chieftain

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    I dont really rush to bronze working but slavery is indeed powerful...

    So what is the optimum city numbers in standard maps and how quickly I need to get them?

    BTW MrCynical I read your article about The power of sushi and it is indeed a great article...
     
  10. ubenclagen

    ubenclagen Chieftain

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    I thought Noble was an even playing field. What sort of bonuses do the AI get on Noble?
     
  11. JujuLautre

    JujuLautre Chieftain

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    the AI gets bonuses on EVERY level, even settler. On maintenance, upgrades...

    However, some bonuses are neutral on noble, bonuses for the AI over and for the human below. Noble is an even field for production, science, starting techs, huts also I think, and I'm sure I forget some more.
     
  12. vicawoo

    vicawoo Chieftain

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    What's your build order? You probably aren't sticking to basics. If you want to REX fast, get a worker first, prioritize food, pump settlers/workers. after you grow to a decent size (how big? when you can work a lot of special tiles + mines). Don't build granaries or barracks early.
     
  13. macmert

    macmert Chieftain

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    Well I usually build one or two warriors and then start working on granary... Why not build a granary? Isnt it great for boosting the city growth?
     
  14. Elrohir

    Elrohir RELATIONAL VALORIZATION

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    I generally do custom games, because I like to add an AI or two, or mess with the map settings a little. It's not really that big a deal either way, though. Think of it as the difference between automatic and manual transmission on a car (If that helps) - one gives you a bit more control, but the other is easier, and they both get you where you need to go. ;)

    You probably aren't expanding fast enough. ;) How far do you usually let the slider drop before you take a breather to rebuild your economy? As a rule of thumb, I'd say let it drop until you're losing money at 60% before you stop founding new cities. You might even want to try to let it go all the way until you're in the red at 50% or 40%, so you can get a feel for rebuilding your economy. (Some people let it go all the way to 0%, and rebuild from there. But I'd be careful of that ;)) How many cities do you have at 1AD? What kind of cities do you normally found? What's your build order? etc, etc. It's kind of hard to give you specific advice without specific information.

    I think the AI starts to get bonuses at Prince....maybe Monarch? I'm not sure. But I know the AI has no bonuses at Noble or below.

    Yes, religion can be a double edged sword. However, in that case, you might have been able to declare war on one, and rely on your religious feelings to stay on good terms with the others. Or, you could try intentionally ticking one of them off in order to get HIM to attack you. (Cancel open borders, don't trade techs or resources with him, and make demands for money and techs every turn you can. He'll get mad really fast, I promise ;) He may not declare war though if he's a peaceful sort, so I'd try this with Napoleon or Monty or Shaka, as they're pretty insane)

    I hope that helps. :)
     
  15. Orzio

    Orzio Chieftain

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    Its almsot always best to start building a worker or a workboat if you can gain seafood.

    And the AI does always get bonuses there is no level where they arent getting some kind of bonus.
     
  16. JTMacc99

    JTMacc99 That's a paddlin'

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    The beginning of a game is a lot like the beginning of a chess match. There are a few different standard openings, and you should feel free to modify them as the terrain and your chosen leader requires.

    Having said that, none of the standard openings is Warrior, Warrior, Granary.

    I've become fond of WORKER first, even though it always takes something around 23 turns on Epic, and the city doesn't even think about growing until it is done with that worker. In conjunction with this strategy is my research path. Depending what resources I've got in the capital, I make sure to research accordingly. If there is a grain, I make sure I have agriculture so that my worker can do something when he is born. If I've got a gold or silver, you better believe I prioritize mining. Cows and pigs will put animal husbandry in the mix. Fish/clams/crabs? Not only do I make sure I have fishing in the very early order of research, but building a Workboat becomes a high priority. It may even trump building the worker first, but it would almost certainly be the second thing I build.

    Having said all that, one very other important thing you need to do at the start is to get Bronze Working. With bronze working, your worker can chop down trees, which in turn, can be used to build the warriors you normally build, your workboat, your second VERY important worker, and your first settler. Bronze Working also lets you use slave labor to build your granary (which is exactly the right thing to do for so many reasons.)

    Just so you know, everything I just said is conditions permitting, but generally speaking it is in your best interests to build a worker first, improve the food tiles around the capital, and gain the ability to chop trees and whip population to hurry production as soon as possible in every game.
     
  17. macmert

    macmert Chieftain

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    Well I usually go with a double warrior cause I feel the urge to defend my cities and use one of the warriors to scan the area... I go with a granary to speed up the pop increase... But what JTmacc99 what you say is right, go for a worker and start tile improvements immidiately...

    @Elrohir: I Generally leave tech slider to 100% until I start to lose money and slide down till I get to +min. money... I usually get 4 or 5 cities till 1AD, yea I suck badly :S, I tend to build my cities near resources and get near hills with resources, or coastal lines... But I never compete with AI about expansion, since they pop like mad... In many games I end up with 8 or 9 cities maximum but on average I get 5 or 6...
     
  18. vicawoo

    vicawoo Chieftain

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    Try worker first, warriors -> settlers and tell us how it changed your expansion speed.
     
  19. Joshua368

    Joshua368 Warmongering builder

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    Also early defense is not vital in single player games until barbarians start arriving, which won't be until after the first thousand years or so. (not sure the exact timing, it varies with difficulty levels) The AI won't attack you very early on, so there's no real need for protection. The barbarians typically give you a bit of warning first, hopping around outside your borders for a few centuries before actually entering.

    My first scout/warrior always goes out to scout the immediate area for a second city site. I will build a defender before my first settler... but the defender quickly goes out to claim the second city location to keep it safe. After my second city I'll usually start putting up a small actual defense force, because my people will start to complain. :lol:

    But basically early defense is a waste when you really need those workers/workboats/settlers, except to escort settlers outside your borders. No one's gonna hurt you...

    Also granaries are great but not vital for the very early game, a city will grow plenty fast early as long as it has a good worked food resource (as almost all capitals do). Basically you'll want one once you start slaving... having a granary be the first whip is pretty common.
     
  20. Krazula

    Krazula Chieftain

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    1. I always play a custom game, almost always with almost all random settings.

    2. In my experience the best ways to expand quickly are to prioritize bronze working (for slavery and chopping) and worker techs that you need to build on food resources. Slavery is a must for rexing because in the early game food is more plentiful than hammers, and you get more hammers than the food you lose with the population drop. Chopping is a wonderful production bonus, but I think its best to leave some forests standing so you can later get the bonus hammers from mathematics and/or a forge. I usually have a worker first or second in my build queue and will build a second worker before my first settler unless I feel that a prime city spot may be taken up. Depending on the map and the sea level you may be able to block an AI's access to a portion of the continent with your borders. If you have copper in your capitals bfc and know where a nearby civ is you may want to hold off on a settler and instead build a few axeman or early uu's and take the AIs capital, which is usually a good city spot and this not only gets you your second city but eliminates some of the competition for the rest of the land.
     

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