A new idea for a leader

[Imuratep]

By having a leader that can be chosen by more than one civilization and a leader that switches randomly his traits, I think we could open the game up for some more unique ideas.

My idea would be a leader that starts out with no trait except adaptive, but that can choose two traits when adaptive triggers (If you want to make him stronger he gets charismatic as his fixed trait after turn 96, another trait after turn 196 and his last trait after turn 296) Flavorwise he could be a shapeshifter that has infiltrated a civilization or works with it together (I'm especially thinking of the Sidar, which at this point only have one leader and he would fit their flavor). So if you chose him you could either select a random civilization or the Sidar.

But why should you limit this to traits? This leader could also have the choice if he wants to be a man or a woman. If you linked to him a relation bonus to the opposite sex it would even have a game meaning. At the beginning (until you choose his traits and his sex) his picture should look quite indefinite, unimpressive and androgynous, but after you have chosen his sex and his traits he should have the picture of an incredibly beautiful man or woman (because he has managed to adept himself to the human ideal of beauty).

 

[Marnok]

I volunteer to be the male picture.

 

[Kael]

I volunteer to be the male picture.

Ill be the unimpressive and androgynous model

 

[Psycho_Ivan]

By having a leader that can be chosen by more than one civilization and a leader that switches randomly his traits, I think we could open the game up for some more unique ideas.

My idea would be a leader that starts out with no trait except adaptive, but that can choose two traits when adaptive triggers (If you want to make him stronger he gets charismatic as his fixed trait after turn 96, another trait after turn 196 and his last trait after turn 296) Flavorwise he could be a shapeshifter that has infiltrated a civilization or works with it together (I'm especially thinking of the Sidar, which at this point only have one leader and he would fit their flavor). So if you chose him you could either select a random civilization or the Sidar.

In a sense he'd fit their flavor, but in another he totally contradicts what the Sidar do with their time. They become extremely affixed to who they are and don't change very much. Certainly doesn't fit the idea of a shape-shifter style leader.

 

[Annex]

Also, the Sidar have little to do with the affairs of others. They just want to be in thier area and be left alone.

 

[xienwolf]

It could be mildly interesting to have a leader who starts with only 2 traits: Permanance & Adaptive. The only effect of Permanance being that you maintain any trait selected by Adaptive as a permanent trait. So at the begining of the game, you would essentially have NO traits. 100 turns later, you can select a single trait, 100 turns later you add another trait to the list....



Would start weak, but would eventually be a sheer powerhouse, if the game lasted that long.


Mechanics-wise, you would probably ACTUALLY have 3 traits at the start, with one of them being a "hidden" trait that adaptive triggers on. Then you slightly tweak the Adaptive trait mechanic to add a new trait to the player rather than replacing the "hidden" null trait if they also have Permanance.

 

[Kael]

It could be mildly interesting to have a leader who starts with only 2 traits: Permanance & Adaptive. The only effect of Permanance being that you maintain any trait selected by Adaptive as a permanent trait. So at the begining of the game, you would essentially have NO traits. 100 turns later, you can select a single trait, 100 turns later you add another trait to the list....

Would start weak, but would eventually be a sheer powerhouse, if the game lasted that long.

Mechanics-wise, you would probably ACTUALLY have 3 traits at the start, with one of them being a "hidden" trait that adaptive triggers on. Then you slightly tweak the Adaptive trait mechanic to add a new trait to the player rather than replacing the "hidden" null trait if they also have Permanance.

That is a pretty cool idea. But it may be easier to separate it from adaptive entirely and create a new trait that allowed you to pick a new trait every X amount of turns. But thats just implementation jargon, the idea itself is pretty cool.

 

[Ethric]

Some sort of evil psionic-type civ, maybe. So the reason the leader gets more and more is that he absorbs the minds of others and add their knowledge and power to his/her own. It could work with souls too. Could be an undead leader, or demonic, or just someone who meddles in dreadful and eldritch knowledge Man Wasn't Meant to Know Of!

If evil isn't wanted (*grumble*), it could be a neutral leader who have access to some sort of device or ritual that increases his power. But that's not as cool as a soulsucking braineater

 

[TheJopa]

That is a pretty cool idea. But it may be easier to separate it from adaptive entirely and create a new trait that allowed you to pick a new trait every X amount of turns. But thats just implementation jargon, the idea itself is pretty cool.

Learner trait? For boy king (While keeping him sprawling) or Varn

 

[thomas.berubeg]

Some sort of evil psionic-type civ, maybe. So the reason the leader gets more and more is that he absorbs the minds of others and add their knowledge and power to his/her own.

COugh! Cough! perpentach Cough!

 

[Blackmantle]

Be Warned though. Arcane, Spiritual and Charismatic might be way! over the top for Sidar (especially the last one of the lot...) with raiders being no XP-booster anymore thats an option for them now (but still a very high-powered one so it might still be inapropriate for the sidar...)

Other Traits which are really good usually like financial (quality + yields of tiles are less important from midgame on for them, that last ~ 100 commerce just don't do that! much of a difference...),
organized (support really shouldn't be an issue, even though the command-posts are very powerful for Sidar so that might! be a bad example. But here as well an example were another aspect of the trait really matters.)
ingenuity (in early game you just need many cheap units. Later on gold shouldn't be a big problem anyways.)
or creative (culture really is no problem for sidar right from the early game...) on the other hand are less than impressive for them...

And defender as bad as it looks offers much synergy with the Sidar in nearly all its aspects (its still a weak trait leaving them with 2 rather weak ones, but the civ more than makes up for it imo.). Archery line still sucks but that might! change with the lairs + other improvements. We will see...


So overall a nice idea but you have to watch out quite alot if you make a new leader with the Sidar especially, since the traits often have a different value for them than for most other civs...
(All combat-related traits are strong ones for sidar especially after the changes to raiders and agressive to effect most unit-classes and philosophical whould be a very strong one for them.)



But on a slightly related note (regarding the sidar) Mercantilism imo should still be reworked to offer +1 hammer/gold/research (and +2 in case of culture from Bards or +1/+2 Priest GPP in case of priests) to specialist strong-yields really (in addition to its current effect). That whould make it more competative and make it a real and distinct option unheard of before in the economic category as it is now + better reflect its late place in the tech-tree (while still handing out some trade-offs...).
All the other options (save decentralisation of course. Or should that be enhanced as well? Seems not soo important with Aristocracy, Conquest and Foreign trade all so early) are really really viable in comparison in many (for conquest, agriculture) or at least some (in case of GoN and foreign trade) situations and mercantilism really can't hope to stand a chance allmost in any situation imaginable... It whouldn't even if it went along at the beginning of the tech tree. (perhaps one small idea might! be to have it replace decentralisation as starting one and not require any tech? Then its current effects might at least work out as something! valuable and the drawback is not all soo bad. Liberty and the free Merchant could well be placed elsewhere i am certain. Whould still like it more as an Specialist-enhancing civic...)
I know its a little threadjack but whenever i read suggestions for sidar that issue springs to my mind.

 

[Ethric]

COugh! Cough! perpentach Cough!

I was thinking something a bit more primal and deliberate than just a mad wizard with a knack for mind-magic. Perpentach doesn't seem to have that much control, since he can't keep all he aquires at once. Someone who did it more metodically, adding more and more yet staying in control, could be interesting.

 

[Blackmantle]

Thats what you think...

Don't mess with the king of jesters.
He may run crazy puppets all over your lands or take over your body. Its not really sure if his craziness is all so much of an impedement to his skills really...

All speculation anyways until a mind-archmage tries to get into Perpys mind and is there to tell the tale.
Something not! reccomended.

 

[Annex]

Perpentach doesn't seem to have that much control, since he can't keep all he aquires at once.

Read up on his lore. I think it would fit Perp very well lore wise, but may be too powerful to give to the Balseraphs

 

[CypherKnight]

What about a shapeshifter or a shapeshifter society. Can't build settlers initially or at a higher cost but can eventually infiltrate and subsume power from a city. Sounds interesting.

In a sense he'd fit their flavor, but in another he totally contradicts what the Sidar do with their time. They become extremely affixed to who they are and don't change very much. Certainly doesn't fit the idea of a shape-shifter style leader.

Sidar could be the anti to this civilization or there could be a kryptonite type effect.

In fact you could use a similar mechanic to the Sidar. Once a unit hits level six or such it could change it's type or maybe switch between types or choose to produce a UU great person who can infiltrate the an enemy city.

Once this shapeshifter society has X number of UUs into the civilization it could assume one of it's traits.

Have no idea how you'd teach the AI though to play this.

 

[Zechnophobe]

Decius changes to:

Organized, Pretender

Pretender: After you finish off a civ, you may gain one trait that leader had.

As a Pretender to the throne, there seems to be an odd rightness there.

 

[Domingo]

I would really like to see a neutral Svartlfar leader, maybe to balance out the 2 neutral Ljosfar (sp?) leaders. A "permanence" type trait might be fitting for a race as long-lived as the elves.

 

[Imuratep]

You're right, Psycho Ivan, he should not lead the Sidar (because an incredible beautiful leader would contradict their flavor), but he could be storywise on their side. So random civ should be generally the best (perhaps if that's possible to get the Sidar). Svarts had the problem that a male leader could never lead them (They are a matriarchy, aren't they) and I can't think of another civ for which the leader could work for. So either he is a Sidar or a complete new civ (but we can't have that for FFH II, can we?)

 

[Ethric]

Read up on his lore. I think it would fit Perp very well lore wise, but may be too powerful to give to the Balseraphs

I've only read his ingame biography. But while what I suggested has similarities with Perpentach on the surface, it doesn't mean it should be implemented similarily. Quite the opposite in fact.

A leader with only one trait at the start, Devourer or something, that enables a new permanent trait every once in a while under certain conditions (passage of time, rituals, size of empire, conquest, a combination, or something else), would play quite differently than Perpentach. And of course, said leader wouldn't lead the Balseraphs.

And Pretender sounds like a good idea.

 

[Skitters]

...how about an "Assimilation" game mode where a player start with no traits, but for each civ they kill/vassalise they can choose one of their traits?