A Petition to ReUnite Off Topic

[Valka D'Ur]

Exactly. There is a loud minority that want a high-brow discussion, on a gaming forum meant for 13 year olds. They have been given multiple outlets for their discussion, and all have choked on inactivity.

This minor population, is being given excessive attention and causing a negative impact on the flow of the website.
We have to stop pretending CFC is something it is not.
We have to stop being personally offended by that notion.
YES, I know you are an intellectual, I know you want to discuss your likes in a circle-jerk of admiring glances.
For that, go to a specialised forum.
CFC is a gaming forum first and foremost.
Its members are by a vast majority young teens.
Off-topic should be, just that; a hodge-podge of non-cfc discussions on a level that suits teenagers.
We can't branch off areas in a hope to avoid them, raise the entry requirements and end up discussing poetry to a doctorate level.

So you want the vast majority of discussions here to be brought down to junior-high level? Well, excuuuuuse those of us who happen to be over 40 (and 50, and 60)! If I wanted conversation with 13-year-olds that was vapid and shallow, I'd lift the age restrictions on my Cheezburger page and accept the friend requests from the ones who apparently think that "no friend requests from underage members" doesn't apply to them. Maybe Thunderfall should just fire the whole lot of moderators who are over the age of 20. That wouldn't leave too many to run this place, but then at least they'd know what's really important, right? Then they could set this place up properly and stop all these silly conversations that are at least on a high-school level or maybe university, because it should be all for "young teens."

Sheesh.

The OT here is a way for people of all ages to interact with each other, in a more balanced way. I have no problem conversing with a 13-year-old if it's an exchange of information on a topic of mutual interest. I was 13 once, and enjoyed conversing with older people. I learned a lot from them, and as long as I wasn't obnoxious, they didn't mind my being around. I extend the same courtesy in turn to the now-"younger generation."

Yes, there were a couple of early threads in A&E that were basically of interest to people who were Really Into Art History. It was super-intellectual stuff, and I personally found it boring as hell. But then I'm the sort of person who likes individual pieces just because I like something about them, not because of any intellectual reason. That doesn't mean the threads shouldn't have been there - the non-troublemaking posters in those threads were obviously enjoying themselves, and that's what the point of the forum is - to have a place to talk about that stuff.

 

[Takhisis]

Off-topic should be, just that; a hodge-podge of non-cfc discussions on a level that suits teenagers.
We can't branch off areas in a hope to avoid them, raise the entry requirements and end up discussing poetry to a doctorate level.

What the bleeding blazes are you saying? *falls back into chair, unable to continue, and clicks on post*

 

[Tsoate]

So you want the vast majority of discussions here to be brought down to junior-high level? Well, excuuuuuse those of us who happen to be over 40 (and 50, and 60)! If I wanted conversation with 13-year-olds that was vapid and shallow, I'd lift the age restrictions on my Cheezburger page and accept the friend requests from the ones who apparently think that "no friend requests from underage members" doesn't apply to them. Maybe Thunderfall should just fire the whole lot of moderators who are over the age of 20. That wouldn't leave too many to run this place, but then at least they'd know what's really important, right? Then they could set this place up properly and stop all these silly conversations that are at least on a high-school level or maybe university, because it should be all for "young teens."

Sheesh.

The OT here is a way for people of all ages to interact with each other, in a more balanced way. I have no problem conversing with a 13-year-old if it's an exchange of information on a topic of mutual interest. I was 13 once, and enjoyed conversing with older people. I learned a lot from them, and as long as I wasn't obnoxious, they didn't mind my being around. I extend the same courtesy in turn to the now-"younger generation."

Yes, there were a couple of early threads in A&E that were basically of interest to people who were Really Into Art History. It was super-intellectual stuff, and I personally found it boring as hell. But then I'm the sort of person who likes individual pieces just because I like something about them, not because of any intellectual reason. That doesn't mean the threads shouldn't have been there - the non-troublemaking posters in those threads were obviously enjoying themselves, and that's what the point of the forum is - to have a place to talk about that stuff.

Thanks for adding my 2 cents together and getting 5.

I mentioned that the forum is pg-13. I didn't say lets all talk like 13 year olds.
I didn't say high-brow discussion can't be had.
Where on earth you extrapolated there should be no adult moderators I haven't a clue.

I am really not sure what progress here can be had if you use such exaggeration and hyperbole when trying to discuss something.

Your middle paragraph I agree with. Teenagers arn't stupid, less those on a civilization forum. What I am asking is use your maturity to raise their game, participate in a united OT, and together, make CFC a thriving, interesting place to post in.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Thanks for adding my 2 cents together and getting 5.

I mentioned that the forum is pg-13. I didn't say lets all talk like 13 year olds.
I didn't say high-brow discussion can't be had.
Where on earth you extrapolated there should be no adult moderators I haven't a clue.

I am really not sure what progress here can be had if you use such exaggeration and hyperbole when trying to discuss something.

Your middle paragraph I agree with. Teenagers arn't stupid, less those on a civilization forum. What I am asking is use your maturity to raise their game, participate in a united OT, and together, make CFC a thriving, interesting place to post in.

Look, you're the one who started carrying on about 13-year-olds:

Exactly. There is a loud minority that want a high-brow discussion, on a gaming forum meant for 13 year olds.
...

CFC is a gaming forum first and foremost.
Its members are by a vast majority young teens.
Off-topic should be, just that; a hodge-podge of non-cfc discussions on a level that suits teenagers.
We can't branch off areas in a hope to avoid them, raise the entry requirements and end up discussing poetry to a doctorate level.

When I read the bolded part of your post, how could I not conclude that you think the forum should be run for the benefit of people aged 13-19, and the rest of us should either shut up or go away?

Since the forum obviously does NOT cater strictly to this age group, and IS run by adult moderators (if there are any underage mods, I'm not aware of them), you seem to be saying that the adult moderators don't have a clue what teenagers would want and insist on allowing "high-brow" and "doctorate-level" discussions anyway.

The threads that come immediately to my mind with those descriptions are the art discussions I mentioned (art aficionados and art history students would probably enjoy them, but they're pretty limited in their popular appeal) and Plotinus' theology threads. Those are quite popular, and the discussion level ranges all over the place. It's not an easy topic to discuss but it's one that nearly everyone, including atheists AND teenagers, have opinions about.

My wanting to keep A&E separate has nothing to do with the age groups of the participants. I've seen a 13-year-old discuss Frank Herbert's Dune novels, with the accompanying topics of science, history, and philosophy, with an impressive degree of maturity. I've also seen people three or four times this person's age attempt to discuss it and never get anywhere close to understanding even the basics of those books' themes. A&E is about the content and the creativity, not about the age of the participants or how far they got in school.

 

[Hygro]

Exactly. There is a loud minority that want a high-brow discussion, on a gaming forum meant for 13 year olds. They have been given multiple outlets for their discussion, and all have choked on inactivity.

This minor population, is being given excessive attention and causing a negative impact on the flow of the website.
We have to stop pretending CFC is something it is not.
We have to stop being personally offended by that notion.
YES, I know you are an intellectual, I know you want to discuss your likes in a circle-jerk of admiring glances.
For that, go to a specialised forum.
CFC is a gaming forum first and foremost.
Its members are by a vast majority young teens.
Off-topic should be, just that; a hodge-podge of non-cfc discussions on a level that suits teenagers.
We can't branch off areas in a hope to avoid them, raise the entry requirements and end up discussing poetry to a doctorate level.

Dude are you kidding? I joined here at 15 and I was definitely one of the youngest. Now at 26 I'm still not that old... I fell in love with CFC's off topic specifically because it, and civ in general, pulls a much older and more mature crowd. CFC does not fit into your semantic understanding of "gaming forum". It fits into a "civ" forum and that's a lot different than a Blizzard game forum or some FPS forum.

 

[Lone Wolf]

Yeah, I don't know where all this "CFC members are mostly in the young teen group" comes from.

 

[Kyriakos]

I would think that while CFC tends to have on average more debate on a decent/higher level than other game-forums, this is not really the case when contrasted to other main-historic-strategy-game forums, like TotalWarCenter or ParadoxForums. It is either on the same level, or maybe even a bit lower than that, while having similar numbers of members afaik.

 

[Takhisis]

Yeah, I don't know where all this "CFC members are mostly in the young teen group" comes from.

The overall median is quite young because of the constant influx of new players, but the more dedicated people (especially OT posters) aren't 12-year-olds whose parents have bought them their first computer game 'cos they're so yooooung.

 

[Tsoate]

Heh, lets see.

 

[Takhisis]

There's always one or more of those threads going on, do you really think the tens of thousands of CFCers will bother to post there?

 

[Tsoate]

No but it will give a good representation of who is active now.

 

[Takhisis]

No it won't, unless you force everyone to go and post there.

 

[Hygro]

Seriously, Takhisis?

 

[Takhisis]

Seriously what?

 

[Birdjaguar]

IIRC, typically an N of 30 is sufficient to provide reasonable assumptions of validity.

 

[azzaman333]

IIRC, typically an N of 30 is sufficient to provide reasonable assumptions of validity.

Assuming a randomly selected sample, which the poll is not.

Of course, it still is a valid comparison to previous polls because they're both measuring the same thing.

 

[Birdjaguar]

If determinism reigns as true (as free will does not), then the responders are not self selecting and might well be counted as random.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Shouldn't it be grounds for disqualification if a respondent hasn't been born yet? At the very least, it's rude to reply to a poll if you don't actually exist.

 

[Hygro]

Tak, he makes a poll to settle the answer and you're like "why should anyone bother" and "no it won't [mean anything]". Let's not get all unfriendly to tsoate just because he had a misconception. He actually put his energy where his typing fingers are, and even if the poll is redundant he even linked to the old one (in his new thread) that I failed to find when I searched on my own.

I think we should be appreciative of the effort.

Assuming a randomly selected sample, which the poll is not.

Of course, it still is a valid comparison to previous polls because they're both measuring the same thing.

Not only valid for that but it doesn't have to be a random sample. As we can see the public results, and we can see who we consider representative of the OT experience, and really we're trying to find out the age of those participating, which when checked against the aforementioned public results, we find it's pretty much the right people anyway.

 

[Takhisis]

I was just stating that it won't work, and it never has.