Discussion in 'Civ4 - Modpacks' started by abbamouse, Nov 17, 2005.
mirorred at http://civilization4.filefront.com/
I seem to have found a bug: if I convert to Zoroastrianism then there's no icon next to my name on the scoreboard but there is an empty space instead (assuming I founded it). If the AI converts to Zoro. after I found it then their entire name vanishes, leaving just their score (which can still be clicked on to bring up the diplomacy interface).
How could I reverse the icon changes so that Zoro. uses the Confucan icons? That would be a temp. fix for the problem and it would also make it easier to spot which cities have converted to Zoro. because the icon included is hard to distinguish against the city background, especially if there are lots of icons there already.
There is a slight problem with judaism and islam..
If some other religion decides to bombard you with missionaries, you're pretty much screwed, no?
no there isn't. the holocaust, you know?
that has to be the least correct statement EVER in this forum.
the poles were and still are rabid anti-semites. radio marija, a catholic station, routinely issues statements that would land them in jail in countries that forbid racist remarks, like germany and austria.
and, R-A-N-M-A, your statements on the christian faiths are a complete invention. orthodox christianity and ROMAN catholicism (catholic does NOT equal roman) developed from the same roots, where did you GET your "was invented in greece" theory?
Catholic means "universal" in greek, and refers to the nicene creed of 325, "a Christian statement of faith accepted by the Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, Anglican, and most Protestant churches." (wikipedia). so, the "catholic church" INCLUDES the orthodox one.
SEVEN HUNDRED YEARS later, a change made to the nicene creed, called the filiolique (more here) caused the split of the roman catholic and the orthodox church, the great schism of 1054.
Umm...I was wondering if you could include UUs for each religion, other than the missionary unit. Maybe Crusader, Warrior monk...ect.
I'm kinda late here coz I didn't realize civ4 could be modified before they released the modifying tool in "early 2006", how did you do that anyway?
Ok first I'm a Moslem living in Egypt, and I suggest the name Da'eiah (which means an "outreacher") or the name Shaikh (which is essentially someone high-in-religion in its religious meaning). People call me Sheakh -Egyptian dialect for Shaikh- because I'm growing my beard
Btw the word Imam means leader, and it serves for both the one who prays infront of a group of people (in mosques or other places, and can very be a "normal Moslem"). Or the Caliph, who is the leader of the Moslem nation as a whole.
I suggest.. no, I INSIST on someway to make ethnic cleansing and remove undesired religions from your cities on a cost of unhappiness (maybe even riots or destruction of state-religion buildings in some other cities?) + Other civs adopting the persecuted religion might declare war on you or at least hate you alot ---> Which the AI learns to use properly so it's fair!
Also there's a small problem about the general idea of your patch: if a city has, say, 4 relgious-temples in it including hinduism. Then, in that case, cows shouldn't have much of an effect coz hindus compose about 1/4 of the citizens only. I think it should refer to STATE RELIGION to do all these effects... not simply having a temple in the city
This can actually result in some of your cities ending up without Judaism.
How about just making them cost twice as much as the missionaries of other religions?
Ranathari -- I'll work on this. I had noticed this as well but I hadn't connected it to the mod (I thought it was a bug in the game). I'll test it out to see what's going on. I have noticed an odd text bug here or there in the building descriptions and I need to hunt those down and squish them.
Cyberchrist -- I'm OK with Judaism being somewhat limited in size, but I agree that there has to be a better way. Perhaps I could give Judaism a few free missionaries when first founded. I could call them the Maccabees or something. I'm still working on play-balance so I'm open to suggestions.
Others -- Many of these suggestions will have to wait until someone who can program better than I rewrites large parts of the python (or perhaps until the SDK is released in 2006). I do intend to pursue the religious UU option, though -- but expect it to take a while before I am able to release a version with them included. I have other bugs to fix first (Taoism is behaving oddly).
Please add a documentation file to the mod.
Zoroastrism could come with Monarchy or Writing - these techs are a bit earlier than Code of Laws.
was wondering about mroe ancient religoins like druidism and shaminism could these be included?
The Islamic missionary could be called "alim." Alims (or Ulama for the proper Arabic plural) were religious scholars but Medieval:Total War uses alims as a way to spread Islam. I'm a Muslim, too, btw.
Abba, what happens if we enter the lines of changed health and happiness into the GameInfo CIV4ReligionInfo.xml file? Would this make the effect for all cities in a civ embracing a certain religion?
'alem, plural 'olama' would rather mean "religious scientist", and he teaches Islam to Moslems not to non-Moslems. The ones responsible for spreading Islam (like Ahmad Didat -may Ullah have mercy on his soul-) are Do'ah, single Da'eiah
And while we're coming up with completely opaque terms for missionaries that probably won't make it into the mod, makriv would perhaps be a Jewish equivalent, or shali'akh (dati) according to my dictionary.
I would propose Da'yeh which is the name Muslims give for some one who teaches the religion with the prurpose of educating people or speading the faith.
Imam is more of a mosque leader who mainly heads the prayer and preach the Friday Prayer.
Sheikh on the other hand is more of a title that is commonly given to religious people whether they have a functional rule in the religion or just being religiously spiritual.
I am a Sunni Muslim myself, though I am confident that the same naming is followed by Shiite Muslims, yet I am not quiet sure if the functionalities are the same.
BTW, good mod you have got there
@Kaenash: Why would Intelligent Design neccessarily favor christianity?
Almost all religions have some sort of creation story that goes against evolution.
Egypt had one, Islam has one (Bahamut isn't just from Final Fantasy ), Judaism has one, even Hinduism has one. Not so sure about Confucianism, Taoism, or Buddhism, but they were around a long while before Darwin, so they probably have creation myths as well.
If you're going to have Intelligent Design as a wonder, you should have it benefit all those religions as well.
And before you ask, personally I believe that evolution is an intelligent design.
I like Da'yeh -- I'll have to make sure it doesn't mean different things to different Muslims before I make the change. My initial term was Alim, but this can refer to any Muslim scholar so it didn't seem quite right.
Wait until we get to the proper names for religious UUs
Fachy: I don't think that will work. I played around with putting the info in different places and the game would never load correctly. It may be possible, but my guess is that something else -- a new schema, some Python changes, or work with the SDK -- will be necessary before we can dispense with the "Temple effects" method of representing religious difference.
Elmoro, you repeated EXACTLY what I said!
I just figured Islam's spread rate is 75 not 133! I hope that wasn't deliberate? I also think it spreads more as the rate increases not vice versa, since I found christianity was set to 25 not 400 (you said you'd make it spread slower on its own, but uses more missionaries)
Moreover, I didn't find the 2% extra cost in hurry production you said about the taoism temple! In which line is it?
I was wondering what could happen if we changed the line
Would this make the temple only built/effective under a certain state religion?
Question: Does the AI "realize" these changes? For example would a Jewish AI create a temple if it needs more health in a city having kosher cows? If it wasn't then the game wouldn't be balanced
Also abba, PLEASE don't use any prophet names for Islam, it's considared very atrocious to use any real prophets names on games or general depicting, having a great prophet called Mohammad for example (or even Jesus, Adam, or Moses..etc) will stab any Moslem which reads about it, including me
Actually, I don't think there is a prophet named Jesus in the game. What an odd coincidence, that they thoughtfully leave out the name that could be offensive to a relatively large percentage of their readership but happen to forget the ones that only Muslims will get offended at.
No there's no prophet named Mohammad in the game either. I was just warning abba of the consequences of modding that, whether it's Jesus or Mohammad or Lot.
There is, however, a prophet named Abo Bakr (who is the most prominent companion of prophet Mohammad) and I already sent 2k games an email about that
No, they haven't replied of course!!
IIRC, Abu Bakr was Arabia's leader in Civ3.
Was his status as a prophet the reason he didn't show up as a leader in Civ4?
Separate names with a comma.