• 📚 A new project from the admin: Check out PictureBooks.io, an AI storyteller that lets you build custom picture books for kids in seconds. Let me know what you think here!

Abolish the cow award

Abolish the cow award

  • Yes

    Votes: 41 48.8%
  • No

    Votes: 16 19.0%
  • What is the cow award ?

    Votes: 27 32.1%

  • Total voters
    84

toller pretzl

A 1000 years of broccoli
Joined
Mar 12, 2004
Messages
388
I love the fastest finish awards, but I think that instituting the cow has been a mistake. It seems there is no skill involved in winning this award, just staying power. Most (or even all ?) people who have won this award report that doing so was extremely boring.

I would appreciate any input from people who like the cow award,
because I just don't get it. Thank you.
 
I hate the cow award.

I'd say that it requieres a lot of skill, as any other goal. And I think I remember one single person reporting it was fun.

I hate it because:
1.- It forces you to avoid other victories. That's unnatural, you should try to win as soon as you can.
2.- It is based on points and the current definition of points is far from perfect.
3.- It forces you to play to 2050AD, what a drag!


Regarding heptatlon, one step forward would be to substitute cow with gold. But I would prefer to abolish the cow and leave the heptatlon without a "points award" requirement.
 
I love the fastest finish awards, but I think that instituting the cow has been a mistake. It seems there is no skill involved in winning this award, just staying power. Most (or even all ?)

Not all, I think winning this award was extreamly fun. Maybe it was because the reason I won it was becase I was the only one to beat the AI on the GOTM :cool: .

/Thorrez - Still living of his Deity victory in GOTM10 a long time ago :lol:

P.S. I agree, get rid of it or make it a low award D.S.
 
/Thorrez - Still living of his Deity victory in GOTM10 a long time ago :lol:

Long live to the one and only winner!

I would trade 3 of my awards for having won that Deity game.
 
I so much hate the cow award I get bored after mere 20 hours of play and kill all remanining AI in a paroxysm of rage.
 
Infidel!!!
 
It shouldn't be needed for the eptathlon but it can still be there. No one would purposely go for it if you never needed it.
 
The cow award is perfect for those who want to have the biggest, most advanced civilization around, but not one that "dominates" the world.

Two people win the cow award:

1) people who have that as the only award left on their Epathalon; and

2) people who accidently win it because no one is specifically playing for it.

My vote is abolish it.
 
I say get it off the epthathlon requirement list, for sure.

Add it to the list of "low awards"? Maybe ... not sure that really matters much.

But once removed from eptathlon, I say keep it. If not part of eptathlon, the elites can simply ignore it. It should not bother them then.

I have actually pursued cow (and got it) once. Why? For a player learning the finer points of the game, getting a secure upper hand vs AI often occurs late in the game (19th century or later). Your Firaxis or "final" score is disappearing due to the exponential decay with time. You can, however, still build your base score. And there is something to be learned for the new player in how to maximize population growth and research while not expanding. And in the game I pursued it, there was nothing else useful to do with that game from a score or awards point of view. :lol:

The low awards, IMHO, are the most accidental of the awards. Has anyone ever intentionally pursued them in Civ 4? It seems that they made more sense in Civ 3 where scoring is different.

So I say make cow irrelevant to the top players, but leave it a prize that the low to mid players can shoot for.

Addendum: If all the current players with eptathlon agree with removing cow from eptathlon (would that make it the pentathlon?), I can't see any reason not to do that, at least.

dV
 
The cow award is perfect for those who want to have the biggest, most advanced civilization around, but not one that "dominates" the world.

Two people win the cow award:

1) people who have that as the only award left on their Epathalon; and

2) people who accidently win it because no one is specifically playing for it.

My vote is abolish it.

I vote to abolish.

Like others have said, I think the best move is to remove it from eptathlon but keep it there as an award.
By "abolish" do you mean banish it from the eptathlon? Or so you really mean do away with it entirely?

Because each of you seems to juxtapose the abolish sentiment with a statement or an implication that it should be kept in some form ... :confused: :crazyeye:

dV
 
Well, to vote in the poll you need to pick yes or no.

You are right, I don't see the need to do away with the cow completely. However, I thought by voting "Yes, abolish it" in the poll my sentiments about removing it from eptathlon would be conveyed better than if I had voted "No".
 
I vote, "No." Just because some find no attraction in it, doesn't mean it's not valid. I bet many of those who vote to get rid of it, have found themselves grateful for a space victory because they were ranked third behind 2 AI before.
 
@da_Vinci

I don't see a reason to keep the cow award if not part of the epathalon. Who would intentionally play for it?

On the other hand, I have no objection to keeping it as a minor award. I doubt anyone intentionally plays for the low awards or the ambulances either. The more minor awards, the more people that win something.
 
I so much hate the cow award I get bored after mere 20 hours of play and kill all remanining AI in a paroxysm of rage.
So the only difference between that and your fastest finish conquests is playing time? ;)

I'm all for eliminating the Cow award as a requirement for the eptathlon, if unanimity is required.
 
I had fun going for the cow when I was under doctor's orders to stay off my feet with a leg injury. I've never persued it while healthy though.

I voted for abolish. I mean that as others say- I don't mind if it stays, but it doesn't seem like much fun to compete for to complete an eptathlon. And anyway isn't it a vestige of the early Civ3 scoring system? Wasn't it instituted after the Jason system came out to reward people who scored well under the old system? That is how I remember it playing out anyway. The xotm has moved on a lot since then.
 
I like having the Cow Award around and I think that it requires players pursuing the Eptathlon to demonstrate a bit more balance with their overall game play.

Let's face it--winning the other Awards is mostly about dominating the game early on. The rewards of getting an early advantage are often the reason why a player can win a Fastest Finish Award.

The same method of succeeding early on is also the path that tends to lead to obtaining a Medal.

Sure, there's more to each of the Fastest Awards and the Medals than simply doing well in the ancient ages and each one of them has a different way to approach the game.

However, I appreciate how the Cow does not require a player to conform to this style of play. One can still obtain the Cow Award by not dominating in the early game. In fact, the average player can offer more competition to potential Eptathletes by winning the Cow Award and "denying" their claim to fame for yet another month.

Could it be, even to a small degree, that some players do not like the idea that a newer player could come in and beat them when competing for the same Award? Well, so be it!

Before playing XOTMs, my favoured playing style was to build as many Wonders of the World as possible. Each game was a challenge to discover which leaders I was up against and knowing which ones preferred to build which Wonders around which date, based on the difficulty level. I felt the greatest success and sense of achievement when I was able to make as many Wonders as possible. Yet, there wasn't really an Award made for me.

It wasn't overnight that I began offering competition for the Fastest Finish Awards, but I eventually got there by focusing on "improving" my early game play, which meant that I had to give up on my way of playing the game--the way which I, personally, found to be the most fun!

Since playing the XOTMs, I feel that my playing style has narrowed and I no longer feel that I have the freedom to play the game in ways other than those targeting an early success against the AI. I like the idea of being challenged to open my horizons for a game, try a different way of playing, and still be able to come out on top.

I'm not saying that one has to chase Wonders to achieve the Cow--what I am saying is that a lot more varied play styles can be used to achieve the Cow Award. There are many different ways to play the game and being able to come from behind and win a later victory is often as rewarding or even more rewarding for a lot of players than to "perfectly execute" a technological research path, a build order, a series of trades, and other factors which the players competing for Fastest Finish Awards will attempt to achieve for their games.

Winning the Cow Award isn't trivial for most players. In fact, for a lot of the player base, it's really nice to be able to survive to the Modern Age, slowly take down an AI or two at a time with advanced weaponry, claw one's way to the top of the in-game Score Board, and receive an Award that isn't an Ambulance or other Low Award.

If you're the kind of player that can win the Fastest Finish Awards, then you're also the kind of player who can probably have the AI begging for mercy early on. Winning the Cow should be a trivial matter for you, but so should winning any Fastest Finish Award. It doesn't cheapen the Cow Award that you may find yourself pressing the Enter key a lot any more, but perhaps you should step back and try and take a different perspective on the matter.

Forget trying to be the fastest, the most dominant early on in a game. Relax a little. Skip the micromanagement and appreciate playing the early game with less pressure. Know peace in your heart, throw off the yokel of stress, and you may find the way of the Cow. If you can't do so, then suck it up and press the Enter key a lot after conquesting most of the world--but please try not to ruin the fun for others by bashing a playing style that doesn't require you to play towards perfection in the early game. You might learn a thing or two about life, as well.
 
I voted to abolish, but after reading Dhoomstriker's post, I feel he has made some very good points. There are lots of ways to play and win this game, all of them valid in their own right. And the "low" awards offer something for everyone also. I just got my first award of any kind (lowest scoring cultural), but it was on that horrible tundra territory start, and I actually felt pretty good about how I played that one out.
 
Back
Top Bottom