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About employed citizens

Discussion in 'Rise of Mankind: A New Dawn' started by Wesley balestrini, Jul 17, 2017.

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  1. Wesley balestrini

    Wesley balestrini Chieftain

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    I have some buildings that are already obsolete (either by technology or by civic options), but still employing citizens.

    I believe that if the buildings does not work any more, it does not generate benefits, it also should not generate harms. Estou certo?
     
  2. Wesley balestrini

    Wesley balestrini Chieftain

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    Does anyone know why this happens? Can It Be a Bug?
     
  3. Vokarya

    Vokarya Chieftain

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    Which buildings are the problem? I just did a test with Estate. If I Worldbuilder an Estate, it still works despite not running Feudal. But if I switch to Feudal, build an Estate, then switch to another Society civic, the Estate shuts down and the building no longer consumes a citizen.
     
  4. Wesley balestrini

    Wesley balestrini Chieftain

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    At the moment, I only perceive this problem in my capital; But I do not remember if I came to build buildings that employ citizens in other cities (since the benefits did not compensate for the lack of a citizen).

    Currently my capital is employing citizen for the "Villa" and "Estate". It is possible to confirm this by hovering over the top marking of the city screen where it marks how many employees I have. I also did a manual count of all the fields worked and specialists; And I'm really losing these two citizens.

    It is worth remembering that I do not have the civic options of feudal, nobility and / or bourgeoisie; Which according to civilopedia, are necessary to activate these special buildings.
     
  5. Vokarya

    Vokarya Chieftain

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    Can you post a save game?
     
  6. Wesley balestrini

    Wesley balestrini Chieftain

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    Can you recommend some way to share this file? I've never done this in forums before.
     
  7. Vokarya

    Vokarya Chieftain

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    Make a post and use the "Upload a File" button to attach your save game to the post. If your save file is large, you may have to compress it first. I use 7-Zip for compressing and decompressing files.
     
  8. Wesley balestrini

    Wesley balestrini Chieftain

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    Follow...
     

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  9. Vokarya

    Vokarya Chieftain

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    I looked at your save game, and I can confirm what you said. In Timbuktu, Villa and Estate are still operating and consuming an employed citizen even though the civics are not active. The bonuses from these buildings are still working.

    If I do a recalc with Ctrl-Shift-T, then the Villa and Estate citizens are put back to work and the red fist appears on the city screen that marks a non-working building. (However, you also lose about 300 gold/turn income. This is a separate known bug.) Also, if I change civics, then the Villa and Estate stop working as well.

    My guess as to what happened is that something occurred when you changed civics that prevented the routine that checks for deactivating buildings from working. So your buildings continue to operate. What exactly happened is not within my capabilities. This is something that 45* would need to look at.
     
  10. Fozman

    Fozman Chieftain

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    I've had the same thing happen after capturing cities with civic buildings. They are still active despite the necessary civics not being on. I think I've changed civics since then, but not 100%. Regardless, I can confirm something unintended is going on here.
     
  11. Zeta Nexus

    Zeta Nexus Chieftain

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    Than you can view it as a bug.
    ...or a feature where captured cities retain some autonomy to keep their investments :)
     
  12. Fozman

    Fozman Chieftain

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    Do you work for Bethesda? :lol:
     
  13. Arakhor

    Arakhor Dremora Courtier Moderator

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    It's far worse - he's an independent mod maker! :shifty:
     
  14. aggri1

    aggri1 Chieftain

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    I've seen this problem quite a while ago. I can't remember exactly which buildings it affected but I believe that the Estate and Villa were involved. I had thought that the issue had been addressed.

    Personally I'd rather get rid of that mechanic entirely. I don't see any reason why a power plant should employ a tenth of the population of my (size-10) city, but a factory or university or Metropolitan Administration doesn't. Totally arbitrary and adding unnecessary complexity. There are plenty of other maluses which can be used to make a building less attractive or situation-dependent, I just don't see the need for this buggy and complicated and arbitrary mechanic.

    Cheers, A.
     
  15. Vokarya

    Vokarya Chieftain

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    It's still a bug in that the buildings should be shutting down when you switch civics and they aren't. I think you can balance "employs 1 citizen" as a penalty if you increase the bonuses high enough.
     
  16. Wesley balestrini

    Wesley balestrini Chieftain

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    I was able to solve the problem by changing my civility and going back to what I wanted. Now the buildings in question have been disabled.

    As for the known bug about the reduction in earnings; Is this true for new salves? If I start a new game, will I have greater difficulties with my finances?

    I had not thought that way. My capital has 4,200,000 inhabitants, does it mean that a simple hydroelectric plant (or forge) employs 125,529 (if I did not make the mistake)?

    The impact by employees would only be "real / simulated" if it occurred only in small cities, concluding that a small village in the interior would have few workers.

    My suggestion would be changes to the characteristic "employees" for insalubrity, unhappiness and / or cost to the national treasury.

    Considering that it should not be cheap to maintain a plant and that it normally causes environmental impacts (Coal pollutes the air), social (hydroelectric relocate the residents and impacts fauna / flora) and even political impacts (there is a lot of manifestation against the use of nucler energy, Because it would be a destructive "force" and an excuse to invest in this technology).

    Examples are for power plants, but logic holds true for other buildings. In summary, I think the idea of exclusive civic options buildings is a good idea; But we should change "employee citizen" for other penalties.

    Note: Sorry for the google english
     
  17. Vokarya

    Vokarya Chieftain

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    That only applies to recalculating. If you play a game straight through, never update, and never do a recalculation, you won't see that problem. (The alternative is the old save format, where any change breaks the save. So you would HAVE to play through before updating.)
     
  18. Wesley balestrini

    Wesley balestrini Chieftain

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    Thank you for your help.
    About my suggestion, is it already valid here or should I put it somewhere specific to the forum?
    Spoiler Suggestion :
    My suggestion would be changes to the characteristic "employees" for insalubrity, unhappiness and / or cost to the national treasury.
     
  19. Vokarya

    Vokarya Chieftain

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    That's a separate question. But trying to argue anything based on population values isn't going to convince me. The listed population is a color value that has no real game impact. The real question is this: Is the building in question valuable enough to be worth sacrificing a population point for?

    For power plants, I actually think yes. Power plants are far more valuable in AND than they are in regular BTS. Powering a city is a necessity for many Modern and Transhuman buildings, so I think it's okay if you have that sacrifice to take advantage of later buildings. Maybe for other buildings, no. Foundry is an example of "no, it isn't." Just make it a small upgrade over Forge and it's fine.
     
  20. Fozman

    Fozman Chieftain

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    In other words, is this building worth sacrificing the average tile yield or specialist that could be worked? In many cases, they are. If you look at it as an opportunity cost, the math is trivially easy.
     

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