Back the beg on t78. Now that HOF has been updated, I can reload as many times as I want. The 120
beg was denied, so I ask smaller amounts: 110, then 100... Finally, 90
beg is accepted! Actually, he will give me up to 99
.
Edit: Power ratio is 0.4013
Thanks
Anysense!
Your additional information is a big help for me trying to figure out if my begging formula has a fatal flaw in it.
Mansa's Soldier count was 63,000/0.4013 = 157,000 Soldiers.
I've got Begging_Ceiling being = Floor[(78-16+50) * 2 * ((63+100)/(157+100)) * 3] = 426
Gold_Beg_Ceiling would then be 426/2=213
, so 212
beg should have worked
Gold_Beg_Ceiling with Financial distress should be 426/3=142
, so 141
beg should have worked.
There is still uncertainty if the Human Player or the Computer AI being in Financial distress triggers the reduced beg amount.
Anyway, Mansa was Pleased, so there was no denial based off of being too weak.
Mansa gifted you free Masonry Turn 46 which costs the human player 135
on standard/deity/normal
T46 All of a sudden Mansa is feeling very generous. Thank you very much, Mansa!
Take 135
off the beg ceiling, and you get 426*(4/3)/2 = 284
beaker limit - 135
= 149 * (3/4) = 111
beg ceiling
Or take the 213
gold_beg_ceiling and subtract 135*(3/4) = 213-101.25 = 111.75 or 111
beg ceiling
110
beg or lower should work.
Your extra info indicates only 99
was accepted
Closer, but still needs work.
Off by 11
Maybe it has to do with how Deity AI values techs vs. how humans value them?
I'll build a mockup of Deity Mansa, know him for 62 turns, world builder enough troops to get a 0.4013 power ratio, activate land target, and test to see if I really can beg 212
That will at least test out the main begging formula.
Should take 10 minutes.
**Edit**
The test game recreation confirmed the begging formula still works.
Met Mansa on T16.
Moved forward to T78.
Got the Soldier count to match exactly. (0.4013 power ratio)
Made sure Land Target was activated.
Begged Mansa for 212
on T78.
Accepted
Begged Mansa for 213
on T78 after reloading the game.
Denied
Attached the test game in case anyone wanted to play with it.
The Masonry gift really messed the calculations up!
At least I know free tech gifts for sure affect the running beg amount total now.
I can't yet understand why the max beg became 99
and not 110
?!
Masonry must be valued differently when gifted than when it is purely begged by the human.
**Edit 2**
New Test.
Begged Mansa 87
+ Masonry.
Accepted
Begged Mansa 88
+ Masonry.
Denied
That helps narrow it down a bit.
Mansa can trade monopoly techs which are valued more than 100% of what a tech is usually worth.
In this case Mansa wanted 212-87 = 125
for the Masonry tech which costs the human 135
.
Let's see what happens when 1 AI besides Mansa knows Masonry.
It should reduce the cost?
Mansa + 1AI have Masonry.
Begged Mansa 92
+ Masonry.
Accepted
Begged Mansa 93
+ Masonry.
Denied
Up it by 1 AI
Mansa + 2AI have Masonry
Begged Mansa 97
+ Masonry.
Accepted
Begged Mansa 98
+ Masonry.
Denied
Up it by 1AI again
Mansa + 3AI have Masonry
Begged Mansa 102
+ Masonry.
Accepted
Begged Mansa 103
+ Masonry.
Denied
Ok, that is a bit weird.
It skipped straight over 99
Did the original game have 6 opponents or more?
Ah I see.
The test game has 6AI and the real game has 7AI.
That means in the real game, the discount for each AI knowing a tech is a bit lower.
In conclusion, I think Mansa gifted you Masonry on Turn 46 when 2 or more likely 3 other AI had it, and it caused your maximum beg amount on T78 to be 99 instead of the expected 212
I need to find that post where a guy was getting different amounts in the trade screen when the AI proposed something and when he asked the AI to reconsider.
Something about how AI's value things differently.