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Across the Atlantic 1526

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Scenarios' started by Morholt, May 6, 2009.

  1. Morholt

    Morholt Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2006
    Messages:
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    Location:
    Swedish Empire
    Based on Dieter VonClam's North Atlantic map. For BtS 3.17.

    Version 1.10!
    Base Scenario
    Mod (you also need the scenario)

    This is a scenario made to be playable unmodded, or modded however you like. New nations are made using creative renaming and leader/civ combos. There is, however, an optional mod that adds "proper" new nations as well as changes the religions. This is recommended if you do not intend to play it with any other mod, although the changes are for the most part purely cosmetical.

    In order to play out realistically and get the AI to colonize the new world, all nations that historically held some form of colony, start with a "colonial capital" (city with FP and courthouse) in the new world. With this, the AI does actively colonize the new world, mostly Spain, England, and France.

    The scenario also uses the following options:
    • Marathon Speed (don't worry, there's still a lot going on)
    • 500 turns
    • No Tech Brokering
    • No City Razing

    This is in order to make the game play at a comfortable pace and to give time for lots of interaction with the New World. The No City Razing is to preserve the historical cities placed at the beginning of the scenario. Ideally, every new city founded should be in the New World. Because of this, civs have had their citylists replaced with "colonial" ones.

    As for the religions, I didn't want to simply have "Christian" and "Muslim". So:

    Christianity represents Catholicism.
    Taoism represents Protestantism.
    Confucianism represents Orthodoxy.
    Buddhism represents Reformed churches.
    Hinduism represents Mesoamerican polytheism.
    Islam represents itself, as does Judaism.

    In the mod-version, all religions have proper names and graphics.

    The cast (more on this next post):

    Colonial nations:
    England
    France
    Spain
    The Netherlands
    Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth
    Prussia (Brandenburg-Prussia, to be exact)
    Denmark
    Sweden
    Portugal
    Scotland
    Holy Roman Empire (representing various non-Habsburgian German minors) (non-playable)

    Non-Colonial nations:
    Russia
    Venice
    Ottomans
    Austria (Habsburgian realm, what would become the Austrian Empire)
    Italian Cities (non-playable)

    Natives:
    Maya
    Native America (non-playable)

    Base Scenario
    Mod (you also need the scenario)

    Version history:

    1.10 (After 433 downloads):
    *Mod Version added
    *The Caribbean expanded
    *Bothnian gulf squeezed - there is now a land bridge between Sweden and Finland
    *Riga now Prussian again
    *Sweden not at war with Poland
    *Venice only at war with Ottomans
    *More barbarians in New Spain
    *Barbarian uprising in Sweden
    *Some renamings, Budapest is now Buda
    *Native American Leader is Montezuma; Sitting Bull with Montezuma personality in the mod
    1.02 (After 155 downloads):
    *The Balkans are now Orthodox
    *Orthodox holy city moved to Moskva
    *Fur is now more rare in the Old World, wine exists in the New World
    *Cleaned up some rivers and terrain
    *German city names now in German
    *Custom city lists for all new civs
    *Spanish Leader is now Philip II
    1.01 (After 89 downloads):
    *Gave Riga to Sweden and put them at war with Poland.
    *Changed the color of Venice as it was the same as Poland.
    *Changed a few city names, notably Västervik is now Linköping.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Morholt

    Morholt Chieftain

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Swedish Empire
    On the nations:
    Leaders different from normal in parentheses. Changes in the mod version in italic.

    England
    Leader: Elizabeth
    You start out somewhat behind in infrastructure and colonies. You have excellent land, however, and excellent colonial opportunities. Growing your colonies and not interfering in Europe will take you far. Of course, sooner or later you might have to deal with the natives, or with the scots..

    France
    Leader: Louis XIV
    You start out with a decent army, but somewhat exhausted from the Italian Wars. Your colonial opportunities are as good as Englands, but of course since you are in continental Europe you will have to contend with your neighbors as well.

    Spain
    Leader: Philip II (Hannibal of the Spanish) (Mod: Isabella personality)
    At the start, you are basically everywhere. You have a huge head start in the colonization race, with much of central America and the Caribbean already settled, not to mention your North African possessions, and sardinia, and sicily. You are lacking, however, in infrastructure, and your upkeep is very high. The first hundred or so years will be rough, and you might have to give up a colony or two to keep upkeep at bay, but if you manage to pull through and get your economy in line, you will be virtually unstoppable. Don't forget that you can export goods from the New World for a profit!

    The Netherlands
    Leader: Willem of Orange
    You start with only two cities in Europe, but with excellent infrastructure and a good economy nonetheless. Your production isn't the best, but at least your colonial prospects are fairly good. Consider an early war against Sweden or Scotland to seize their colonies.

    Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth
    Leader: Sobieski (Alexander of the Greeks) (Mod: Himself)
    You start out with a huge empire, but lacking in infrastructure and somewhat spent from the wars with the Muscovites. Your colonial prospects are fairly poor - you might be better off getting rid of it so you can build you FP at home. Your economy is also in bad shape, expect to do a lot of cottaging. That said, your position has great potential with all its difficulties. Can you restore and preserve the Polish-Lithuanian empire? In the mod, the UU is the Winged Hussar, a Cuirassier with first strike, and the UB is the Sejmik, an expensive courthouse that also gives experience to mounted units. If you time it right, the synergy from these might give you an opportunity to expand.

    Prussia (also representing Brandenburg and Mecklenburg)
    Leader: Frederick
    The Teutonic order is all but broken, and would be secularised some years later. The union with Brandenburg, however, gives some new possibilities. One of these is ruling all of the german world. Of course, you start out small and not too strong. An early war against Poland or possibly the HRE might give you the production base you need. Your colony might seem useless, but if you can get only one more, you would have access to all kinds of luxuries, which could come in great handy.

    Denmark
    Leader: Christian IV (Ragnar of the Vikings) (Mod: Himself)
    The Danish lost control of Sweden not too long ago, but their position still holds some potential. You might not be able to retake Sweden right away, but at least you have a colony to build out of. You are skilled navigators and your ships sail farther than others, take advantage of this!

    Sweden
    Leader: Gustav III (Washington of the Babylonians) (Mod: Himself)
    The Swedish half of your kingdom might be relatively secure, but the Finnish half certainly is not! Sooner or later, the Russians are going to come.. unless you take the fight to them first. You start with a somewhat strong army, an early war against Russia or Prussia is definitely in order. After that, it's going to take all the running you can do just to stay in one place! Your colony is decent, but might get walled in by the other powers. Sending a settler or two there once you can build Galleons might be a good idea. In the mod, the UU is the Light Cannon, which has a bonus to its retreat chance, and the UB is the Bruk, a smithy which increases military production. Sweden has to warmonger to survive.

    Portugal
    Leader: Joao III (Joao II)
    You start out with excellent infrastructure, and Feitoras in Portugal proper. This will be badly needed since you have Spain for neighbor! You are in the process of conquering the Moors of Marocko, their land is poor but at least it will add to your production base. Your starting colony is ok, your colonial prospects are good but be prepard to build "inbetween" other nation's colonies. In addition to your galleon fleet, you have a large number of carracks, so you will not run out of transport capability soon.

    Scotland
    Leader: James V (Brennus of the Celts)
    Probably the most difficult of the European countries to play as! You have a (somewhat disappointing) colony, historically this only lasted a few years, but who is to say history can't be changed? You will of course have to contend with the English, luckily they are not often aggressive. Consider an early war to grab some better colonies once you get galleons, or if you feel daring, try taking York right away..

    Russia
    Leader: Peter
    You start out huge, and with the FP pre-placed. Your infrastructure may be poor, but you have a ton of resources and your growth potential is huge. Consider conquering Poland-Lithuania. As long as you keep your economy from crashing and burning, you will be unstoppable.

    Ottomans
    Leader: Suleiman
    You start out as #1, but your fortunes may soon turn. Your empire is way overstretched, and your jannisaries aren't as powerful as they once were, now that europe has adopted musketeers of their own. Attempt to build the FP ASAP and consider giving away some of your more far-flung possessions. Another option is conquering Mecca, the shrine income would be greatly needed.

    Venice
    Leader: Gritti (Hammurabi of the Carthaginians)
    Your serene city is a jewel, but the rest of your empire is mostly so-so. You are at war with the Ottomanians, and locked up in the Italian Wars. Consider making peace in the west as soon as possible, and attempt to take Greece and Moesia from the Ottomans. You do not have any colonies: but what if? If you can get a Great Engineer early, consider shipping him with a settler to the new world and rushing the FP. Conquering the natives might give you a nice population base to work with. Alternatively, try to unify Italy! The shrine income from Rome would be huge. In the mod, the Venetieans have the Galleas as UU. It is a rennaisance-era warship with some transport capability that can rule the Mediterranean until frigates show up but cannot enter ocean. Take advantage of your naval superiority.

    Austria
    Leader: Maria Theresa (Victoria of the Byzantines)
    Earlier this year, the King of Hungary and Bohemia was killed in the catastrophic battle of Mohacs. As luck would have it, you inherited him! You might have to play defensive against the Ottomans for a bit, but eventually you should prevail. With the former Ottoman land under your belt, you might truly become a Great Power. You do not have any colonies, but you might not need any. Instead, consider expansion wars in Europe. When you are done with the Ottomans, Poland might be a tempting target..

    Maya (Challenge game!)
    Leader: Canec (Pacal of the Maya)
    You are the last of the Maya. You are almost two ages behind the europeans tech-wise, and surrounded on all sides by New Spain, who happen to be at war with you. If you can unify the Mayans, you might have the population to whip an army to overrun New Spain when the spaniards are busy elsewhere.. or maybe not. The Mayans are not intended as winnable - consider yourself a winner if you can survive!
     
  3. Agent327

    Agent327 Observer

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    Downloaded, played a bit; will comment later.;)
     
  4. nutnut

    nutnut Budding Modder

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    Location:
    Spain
    Quite cramped, but that's a fault of the map, not of the Scenario. I started playing as Austria and found it tough (only on Noble). The Ottomans seemed to have an endless supply of troops and my army was just too backwards to contend. When Venice signed a peace deal with them I was forced to do likewise (ceding the city with the wierd name east of Budapest to them). After that I stayed peaceful and focused on technological advancement and money-making. Pretty soon I convinced enough other nations to fight against the Ottomans with me and soon I was No 1 on the leaderboard by a long shot. Overall a very good scenario (playing as the Austrians at least). Might give the English a shot next, recreate Pax Britannica.
     
  5. Morholt

    Morholt Chieftain

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    I intended Europe to be quite cramped; the New World is where the settling opportunities are at! The New World is actually ridiculously resource-rich, to make up for the fact that it's far away and starts off unimproved.

    Austria might actually be one of the trickier positions to play. The Austrians basically start out as the weakest colony-less nation (tied with Venice, but they have a more defensible position), you have to fight the ottomans, and unless you go free religion you might have to deal with poland in time as well. That said, they do have decent land and a shrine to help supplement their income, and the AI usually does fairly well as Austria.

    I think England might be the most "easy" nation, if not the most powerful. They start with a great colony, no maintenance costs to speak of, and no strong enemies.
     
  6. Maaximillus

    Maaximillus Vice Admiral

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    Awesome scenario. I played as Austria and Prussia and was writing here a story how everything went but not once but TWICE I deleted all by some stupid mistake :(
     
  7. Morholt

    Morholt Chieftain

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    New version, 1.01!

    I noticed that Venice and Poland have the same red color, which has the odd bug of not showing any border between them, should they end up next to each other! So Venice is now a darker red.

    I also changed a few cities, Vastervik -> Linköping and added a few umlauts here and there.

    Finally, since Sweden was involved with a war against Poland at the time and actually controlled Riga in 1526, they start with Riga and at war against Poland. This seems to help Sweden out a bit, who previously would lose Finland to Russia around 1600. Note that this might make Prussia much more difficult to play as, on the other hand with Poland preoccupied with Sweden it might be easier to attack them.
     
  8. Maaximillus

    Maaximillus Vice Admiral

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    Good that you fixed that bug. Oh and in next update you should add orthodoxism to balkans since ottomans just had conquered them and orthodoxism as still there.

    Also why cant we play as Holy roman empire or Native empire?
     
  9. Agent327

    Agent327 Observer

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    IMO the HRE would be way too powerful; remember that the Empire had an elected head and never amounted to much anyway after the first couple of 100 years. The Natives might give an interesting gameplay, but I reckon the scenario is about Europe. (But if you really want you can set PlayableCiv=1 in the WBS.);)

    Good show! :goodjob: (If you're planning on adding more historical accuracy: Philip II became king of Spain in 1527 and the Netherlands were a Habsburg/Spanish vassal until the start of the Dutch Revolt, Eighty Years' War or the Revolt of the Netherlands (1568[1]—1648)).;)

    You can write up a text, save it (or not) and then post (or copy) it here.
     
  10. Morholt

    Morholt Chieftain

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    The motivation for the unplayable civs was mostly that they serve more as "umbrella civs" than a specific power, and giving control of them to a single person would represent a centralized power that didn't exist at the time. As for the Native Americans, they would really not be playable at all - they are simply too backwards. Try the Mayans instead, they're intended as a challenge game.

    About the Netherlands, I wanted to make sure that they would be independent later on, but I'll experiment a bit with starting them out as a vassal.
     
  11. Mao Tse Tung

    Mao Tse Tung bum

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    never mind got it to work.
     
  12. Agent327

    Agent327 Observer

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    That's cool.;) (Although Dutch independence might have failed or simply have come about in an entirely different fashion.)
     
  13. dankok8

    dankok8 Elected World Leader

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    This scenario is just cool and one of the best no doubt. I do have a few things to suggest as easy changes though.

    1) The Dutch
    - it is historically inaccurate to have them independent at this time (perhaps a vassal of Spain like people suggested)
    - their state religion should be Protestantism and not Roman Catholic and Willem should hate Spain while liking Britain (changing religion should do it automatically)

    2) Balkans (Serbia, Bulgaria, Greece) should be under Christian Orthodox and to a smaller extent Muslim influence, not Roman Catholic. Constantinople and much of Middle East should also have Orthodoxy.

    3) Colonies - I understand you put them in for fun, but not country except Spain had colonies in the New World at this time in 1526. Correct me in case I'm wrong. Jamestown, Virginia for example was founded in 1607. You don't really need to change this.
     
  14. Agent327

    Agent327 Observer

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    Generally correct, but with this comment:
    Protestantism in the Netherlands only became the state religion in the course of the 80 Years War (1568-1648) - and then only in the Republican North (i.e. Holland, not Belgium); prior to 1555 Spain and Austria were united under Charles V, also the Habsburg emperor of the HRE. So, correcting my earlier remark, in 1526 both Spain and the Netherlands should perhaps be vassals of Austria (homeland of the Habsburg dynasty). King of Spain could/should be Charles I (emperor Charles V = Charles I of Spain).
     
  15. Morholt

    Morholt Chieftain

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    It seems that no matter what, if the Netherlands start out as a vassal of Spain they will remain so for the rest of the game. The power difference is just too big, plus Spain keeps showering the Netherlands with gifts, so that they stay at friendly relations even if they get an attitude penalty.

    Because of this and some other reasons (the Netherlands really don't need to start out at war with France), the Netherlands will be independent also in the next version. For the same reason Spain and Austria will not have any special connection either - having Venice and Austria at war with each other would really kill their chances against the Turks, even if this is somewhat ahistorical.

    It is true that the non-Spanish colonies weren't founded until much later, with the Brandenburg colony being founded last, in 1685. The colonies are placed at the start to encourage somewhat historical colonization, and as it is now it works out fairly well. Besides, since the non-Spanish colonies start out small, unimproved, and with very little buildings, they will not really take off until the 17th century anyways.
     
  16. Zygmunt

    Zygmunt Chieftain

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    Seems very nice. The map is lovely.
     
  17. Morholt

    Morholt Chieftain

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    New version up, featuring improved religion placement, city names, and more.
     
  18. Agent327

    Agent327 Observer

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    Downloaded!;)
     
  19. peapd

    peapd Chieftain

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    Really neat scenario, just played through it ... took 12 hours!

    One suggestion I'd make is either developing all of the land with tile improvements or giving 1 worker per city to all of the civs.

    It breaks the feel of of the scenario to have to wait to build workers first in most of your cities, especially on marathon ... they take a while.

    Also, noticed that the descriptor adjective for Sobleski (sp?) is "Greek", not Polish or whatever it should be. Probably left over from using the leaderhead.

    Very nice work.
     
  20. Morholt

    Morholt Chieftain

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    The land really needs to be undeveloped, or civs like Poland and Ottomans will just run away with the game. And I wanted to make sure that the non-Spanish colonies stay undeveloped until the 1600's, when they were historically founded. I'll experiment a bit with worker placement, though.

    The descriptions in log messages and at game start are coded in the game afaik, and cannot be changed without making a mod.

    By the way, would there be interest in an optional mod? I've been thinking of making one. It would be small, only changing civ descriptions and religions, possibly leader traits as well.
     

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