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AI fun

Discussion in 'Civ4 - General Discussions' started by dante alighieri, Oct 4, 2007.

  1. dante alighieri

    dante alighieri Warlord

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2006
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    Location:
    Oberammergau, Germany
    Ok, I'll admit it, I'm bored at work. I have stuff to do, but its not a big rush for once. Which made me think about some of the stuff the AI does that drives me crazy . Some things I don't understand at all.

    Like when you first meet an AI and open borders is redded out. I understand that with Tokugawa. Heck I don't mind when it says "We don't like you enough". But what gets me is when I first meet a civ and open borders isn't an option because "I'm their worst enemy". I just freakin' met you! How can I be your worst enemy? Talk about predestined. I guess we won't be making lucrative trades.

    This behaviour is almost but not quite as frustrating as the old "Don't trade with our worst enemy". I love this. Civ A which is on another continent wants me to stop trading with Civ B which I share a border with and have gotten along with all through the game. Why in the name of sanity would I do that? Usually civ A already hates me anyway, won't trade or open borders and offers nothing in return anyway. Idiots.

    I don't actually like trading techs with the AI. Even if i start off the game being generous, by midgame no one wants to offer me anything close to a fair trade. I'm especially amused by trades like the one I got offered last night...Civ A wants to give me mathematics for theology. The Hanging gardens had already been built. But they also wanted 750 gold too! So let me get this straight, Mister Dumb A$$, you want me to give you an important religion-founding/ wonder enabling tech, for a tech that I can actually research in like 3 or 4 turns myself and the major benefit of has already been taken by someone else. Not to mention you want 750 gold. If I were a real ruler I'd have had that messenger executed.

    But sometimes the AI tips its hand too early. I would have hopefully been ready for an amphibious attack anyway, but yesterday Caesar...who didn't have optics at that point....made one of those dumb threats from his continent. When i told him to go jump in the rubicon, he made that vague 'You don't know who you're messing with" threat. yeah, i do, Julius. I'm dealing with a guy that can't even get here. By the time you're even able to muster a reasonable naval force i'll have battleships and bombers waiting. Why threaten me, anyway, nimrod? There are a bunch of weaker civs on YOUR CONTINENT! :lol:

    You know if caesar had shut up, he might have surprised me.
     
  2. DrewBledsoe

    DrewBledsoe Veteran QB

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Cheering For Mr Sanchez
    Hah good post :)

    Some of my favs:-

    "Cyrus has adopted Theology, Cyrus has adopted Vassalage":- he likes me least of all civs. Why doesn't he just send a messanger saying we will be attacking you when we have built enough troops. Talk about a flashing neon sign that gives you plenty of time to get ready......

    I have just met a new continent of 4 nations. All at at war with one another. I get 4 immediate requests to join various wars. Erm hi there loonies, but I know nothing about any of you, I don't even really know where most of you live, and for friks sake, I don't even have Astronomy yet, so couldn't send any troops even if I wanted to..........and now you all equally hate me :crazyeye: .....

    And my personal favorite:- (with BTS agg ais)...I have Infantry, Artillery, Destroyers and Aeroplanes. Random Psycho on another continent sends 12 galleons full of top notch medievel stuff :mischief: and makes a shock amphib attack on a backwater city of mine with say 5 infantry in it. He loses 35 maces and knights, and just takes the city with the last guy. I take it back the same turn, but now Im really pissed off with the cheek of it, and the other couple of hundred infantry in my other cities aren't too pleased either.

    What did it achieve? Really annoying a much, much more powerful and tech advanced nation, he'd have been better off disbanding the troops and begging to be vassalised, at least he'd live that way. Pure ai insanity.......
     
  3. Stylesrj

    Stylesrj Tabitha SEAL

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2006
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    4,311
    Location:
    New LA, Planet Mira
    My favourite:

    Monty went to war with the Germans. He sent a massive stack at Germany.
    Now, I built two Axemen and had them at Monty's borders. I was planning on building more for my own raid.
    Monty takes over a German city near my borders and moves his stack away. Last time I hear of it, I think it got defeated and Germany was liberating its cities back.
    Just then, Monty demands that I join his little war. I say no.
    A turn later, he declares war and sends his "numerous minions" at me.
    A Horse Archer!

    The only danger that posed to my Axemen was that he was on a Forest tile. Monty chose a really good flank to attack: Right next to my Axeman! He didn't attack it and my Axeman defeated his horse archer.
    Great, I had my incentive to go to war. Two turns later, another Horse Archer is sent, 2 squares above my Axemen, on a forest tile. I defeat him as well and I rush a couple of Macemen and invade Monty.

    I'm telling you it was madness.

    There was also another time where Monty sent a huge stack of Chariots and Horse Archers at a Barbarian city defended by a few Archers. He loses his ENTIRE stack to the barbarians and does not get the city. Just then, a single Warrior is sent down and he declares war on me. I rushed an Axeman and intercepted his Warrior.

    Total damages done: 1 lost Gold mine (well I did have to shift the Axeman guarding it elsewhere as I saw Monty was preparing for a raid. He did do good with that I'll tell you) but I easily rebuilt it, but his whole stack of doom was just a Warrior, because he was set on one path and got distracted and lost his might
     
  4. Arlborn

    Arlborn Legendary Noob

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2006
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    1,939
    I love when the AI do it! :lol:

    I also love when the AI wants me to declare war on their vassals! :rolleyes:
     
  5. Mupetti

    Mupetti Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2004
    Messages:
    20
    Location:
    Finland, Tampere
    I don't understand why Monty is so aggressive. Ok, I like that there's leaders that DO declare war, but he's just madman, not even trying to win the game, he's there just to delay others from developing their own plans. Toku goes in same category.

    I played as Shaka, large hemispheres map, on monarch, going for domination win. I quickly built couple of good cities and began building swordmen, I even got the swordsmen quest. Now, when I had something like 15 swordmen with combat II + city raider I from the quest, ready to invade Toku, Monty declares war on me. He's attacking force contained something like 5 axes, couple of archers and chariots. I crushed him without blinking an eye.

    Why on earth he declared war on me? We shared the same religion, I had quite great and very powerful army, much more powerful than his. And there were plenty of weaker civs right next to him.

    Well, then I just destroyed him, and began building a bit larger army to invade Toku. A few turns before I have the most greatest and fearsome army which has walked upon the earth, guess what ol' Toku decides to do? Declares war on me! Didn't bring any friends with him, just his own death. Hmh, at least I didn't get the reputation hit from his friends!
     
  6. Asperamanca

    Asperamanca Chieftain

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    Sep 24, 2007
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    25
    Well, if you are the first civ they met, then you must be, by definition, their "worst enemy". ;)
     
  7. dante alighieri

    dante alighieri Warlord

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    Oberammergau, Germany
    Sometimes i'm not the first. I think theres something in the game that makes it so a certain amount of AIs have to hate the human player.

    I ran home for lunch and played a few turns before coming back. Zara contacts me asking for electricity. For free. He has medicine and railroad, but medicine is red. Still, he wants electricity. FOR FREE!

    Electricity can build what, 3 wonders? What makes anyone (AI wise) think I'd give that up for free? When I turn him down I get the old 'We won't forget this *******!". Yeah, neither will I ya stingy so and so.

    But thats what I meant about the AI offering crazy half-a$$ed deals. Seriously, is there anyone that would have accepted that?

    Besides I'm sure that the AI is cheating or something. I know people will say the AI doesn't cheat, and it probably doesn't. It just gives itself (all the AI's favorable deals amongst each other then. Thats the only way Zara could have all of a sudden leapt so far ahead when he was so far behind awhile ago. I may not give into insanely stupid deals like the one mentioned but i do trade with the AI and check to see what they have and what they may be researching. So while some AIs obviously won't do a fair trade with me, they don't mind practically giving stuff away to each other.
     
  8. Gibsie

    Gibsie Warlord

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    And moreover, the AIs don't get angry at each other for refusing deals or demands to go to war, stacking the odds against the human player...
     
  9. LegionSteve

    LegionSteve Motörhead

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    1,127
    Location:
    England
    The AIs do some very odd things. Sometimes it seems like they can use the Annoying Palace effectively, and sometimes it seems that they don't understand it at all.

    The other day Cathy built the AP and was elected resident, everyone loved her and she won the vote easily every time it came up. Late in the game, she put forward defense pacts with everyone. I was about 35 turns away from a cultural victory and the AIs were nowhere near so I thought why not? It passed, unanimously I think. The next turn she declared war on the greeks who she has shared a continent with happily for the whole game, and was then at war with most of the world, including 3 of her 4 most powerful rivals :crazyeye:

    At the start of the war she was slightly ahead on points, by the end of it her 3 capitulated vassals had been freed, her willing vassal exterminated, most of her cities were mine and she was my vassal :D
     
  10. Nelgirith

    Nelgirith Chieftain

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    Location:
    Strasbourg / France
    Turn XXX starts :
    Willem requests Open Borders
    Isabella requests OB
    Catherine requests OB
    etc... with all the AI civ I met

    Then when the diplomacy madness ends, I get the message that I dicovered Writing ... Oooooh Oooookaaaaaay ! I didn't notice :lol:
     
  11. dante alighieri

    dante alighieri Warlord

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    Yeah, i've had that happen, myself. its like a neighbor you hardly speak with showing up on superbowl day with a sixpack and a pizza because he "heard" you had a wide screen plasma TV put in yesterday.
     
  12. hoopsnerd

    hoopsnerd Prince

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    Civ4
    I actually notice something along these lines since BtS and espionage came out.... You know how when Hatty will pop up and be like "I offer 74 Gold, you offer Metal Casting, Deal???" Well, since espionage I've started taking those deals quite often. What happens is that Hatty has 1 turn left on Metal Casting research and wants to get it sooner. I always thought it was just REALLY ridiculous trading attempts. Maybe the AI in the OP's game already researched most of Theology?
     
  13. eric_

    eric_ Emperor

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    The most recent aggravation was actually a measure of AI sanity and good planning. I was mopping up Monty with a vulture rush in my current game, and I took what I thought was his last city. Once I had it, though, he was still in the game, which confused me. I was like, "damn, he probably has an island city somewhere, somehow. But, wait, where are those Aztec workers going? Hrm...let me follow them in to this unexplored area WAY over on the other side of Joao." Well, lo and behold, Monty had dropped a city at least 20 tiles away from the edge of his original territory. Evasive bastard! I was pretty impressed, but not enough to let him stay in the game.
     
  14. Premier Valle

    Premier Valle FF: Babylon 5 Mod Team

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    Ich bin in Mexico Stadt
    Answer: Monty is mad!!!

    Who else would carry a skull like a hat! :lol:
     
  15. Imrahil91

    Imrahil91 Prince

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    Location:
    Norway
    I recently played a large continent map with 34 civs, aggressive AI on.
    When the AI had astronomy, I really experienced their naval invasion tactics. Many of them sent had impressive navies, often stacked with weak units (my riflemen had a good time fighting chariots).
    BUT I managed to kill vast armies with just a few strong units because the AI had to attack Omaha Beach style.
    If they just had waited one turn after landing next to my cities, the -50% for amphibious landing would be gone, and they could bombard my defenses. I didn't have railroads, so I couldn't send reinforcements. Instead they lost lots of units and had to suffer war weariness (I had the statue of Zeus) because I waited as long as possible to discuss peace.
     
  16. Bushface

    Bushface Deity

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    A while ago, I had just acquired a load of gold from a trade mission to Thebes. Up pops Ramesses at turn end, asking for Replaceable Parts and 3000 gold. Of course, he got miffed when I said "No"., but what in Sid's name did he expect ?
     
  17. dante alighieri

    dante alighieri Warlord

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    I know what you mean. If a guy I like asks me to give him five bucks I might consider it. If he asks me for 500 bucks and my car I'm gonna tell him to get lost. :)
     
  18. r_rolo1

    r_rolo1 King of myself

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    The problem is the only chance that the AI have to ask for that kind of unreasonable demands is with the human player ( AI-AI deals are automatically negotiated, ergo no Failed AI-AI deals ( a thing that Firaxis should had changed a long time ago, because it has a strong game effect: it makes the AI sour with the human player far easier than the level diplo handicap would make...)). If you were in they shoes, wouldn't you do the same? :lol:
     
  19. dante alighieri

    dante alighieri Warlord

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    So what you're saying is the AI never turns down deals with each other?
     
  20. Ethric

    Ethric Warlord

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    I think what he's saying (without me knowing much about it on my own), is that AI-AI deals are either accepted or never asked in the first place. So either both AI's consider the deal good and make it, or they don't ask. All AI's are run by the same system, so each know precisely what the other will accept and only ask then.
     

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