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AI has huge Army @ turn 75?

Discussion in 'Civ5 - General Discussions' started by Jethro31, Aug 20, 2012.

  1. Jethro31

    Jethro31 Chieftain

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    Playing yesterday and after selecting an early liberty policy which granted a free settler I founded my city a little closer to Catherine than she would have liked.

    A few rounds later she rolls up and declares war on me with 4 unit of Warriors and 6 units of Archers.

    I couldn't believe the size of her army that early in the game, fortunately they decided to attack in between my 2 cities, so I was able to get extra attacks from the cities themselves.

    How is it even possible for other civs to have such a large early army?
    If she did nothing else she would have been cranking out a unit every 7 turns.

    I know she had a settler too, because I recovered it from a barbarian encampment.

    Her entire empire was about 13 or 14 tiles, she shouldnt have been able to even afford it.
     
  2. AiTenshi1

    AiTenshi1 Warlord

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    What difficulty?

    In general, the AI is given various cheats that get larger with each difficulty. The worst is the gold because it is cumulative from Chieftain onwards, and almost everything in CiV depends on gold (except wonders).

    Aside from gold, the AI gets boosts to production, maintenance costs, happiness (doesn't really exist for the AI... well, unhappiness, that is).

    7 turns sounds quite normal. I had spies in place in AI capitals by midgame in one game and made an effort to actually watch the AI production of units, wonders, etc. They almost always took 6 turns or less even for wonders. The highest I have ever seen production of a wonder for the AI is about 14 turns late game.

    If you play at the highest levels (Immortal and Deity) you'll see some really crazy things.
     
  3. bcaiko

    bcaiko Emperor

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    On certain difficulty levels, the AI starts with extra warriors and the AI does get a free archer upon reaching archery. If the AI knew it was going to do an early rush and focused on that, then the size of this army seems plausible.

    But, yes, the AI is definitely cheating. It's what the AI does.
     
  4. Jethro31

    Jethro31 Chieftain

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    Ah, so I'm not crazy. This was on difficulty level 5.

    Luckily I had an extra archer from weapons I found in some ruins.

    After I held off the attack and gave a peace treaty I focused on my army and eliminated russia.
    Everyone one else got pissed at me so I have to eliminate the celts too.

    300 turns later and I still have the diplo penalty for doing what had to be done.

    Lucky for me I have a big chunk of continent to myself now with a natural (maybe 15 tile) choke point, so noone gets through! Rome tried and got crushed.

    Diplo penalty aside, clearing other civs off my continent early game was the exact right thing to do.

    Now if I could only convince someone to trade with me....
     
  5. Tabarnak

    Tabarnak Cut your lousy hairs!

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    With some practice you can get yourself 6-7 composite bowmen and 2-3 melee units around turn 60.

    The army you described can happen as soon as turn 40 in deity(difficulty 8) games.
     
  6. Callonia

    Callonia Deity

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    Yup, i took deity for a spin to see how it is, ramesses threw a warrior rush against me which was 15+ warriors and 2 catapults against my capital and defending force of 4 warrior and 1 scout and 1 scout archer.


    Needless to say.. ramesses got splattered and been butthurt for the whole game. I didn't even lose that scout at all which was at furthest reaches of my border which was used in adjunct with another two warriors to funnel the egyptian troops down to my capital.
     
  7. GhostSalsa

    GhostSalsa Emperor

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    Also, tribute. Cath probably had funded some units by bullying one or two CSs that you might not even have met yet.

    The CS's should really tough that kind of thing out. What do they think Cath is going to do with that money? Just buy more army! Dumb CC's.
     
  8. AiTenshi1

    AiTenshi1 Warlord

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    The downside to domination is that you lose much of the diplomatic options (e.g., it's unlikely that other civs will trade with a bloodthirsty warmonger :) ) You have to plan out what you want to do in order to maintain a balance or not undermine future opportunities.
     
  9. Mesix

    Mesix One of Porg

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    I hate it when Ramses decides to go for an early rush because if he is busy building units then he has fewer wonders for me to liberate in my counterattack :sad:
     
  10. Roboe

    Roboe Chieftain

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    Sounds like an early game I had (as Russia), where Arabia showed up with 5 warriors and 3 archers at a very early point. I could survive it, but it basically meant beelining straight for warriors and archers, setting me back pretty badly. It didn't help either that it was a small'ish island, with room for a max of 3, possibly 4 cities - and we had a CS there too.
     
  11. hobbsyoyo

    hobbsyoyo Deity

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    Or just conquer the cities with the luxuries you want.:mischief:
     
  12. greetswithfire

    greetswithfire Chieftain

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    i got ran over by rome yesterday before i reached currency..not exagerrating the AI had 7 ballistas, 3 legions, 5 horseman and 3 comp bows..no idea how so much iron was available
     
  13. hobbsyoyo

    hobbsyoyo Deity

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    Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think ballistas require iron. Catapults and Trebuchets don't need iron anymore after G&K at least.
     
  14. greetswithfire

    greetswithfire Chieftain

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    that makes alot more sense
     
  15. Tachii

    Tachii Procrastinator

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    > Build less wonders, build more archers.
     
  16. greetswithfire

    greetswithfire Chieftain

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    i had atleast 7 composite bows and walls on my cities...unlucky start being close to rome and was being squeezed by city spam early...rome denounced early due to me settling a prime spot with lux's and nat wonder...the only thing that probably could have saved me was the city garrison policy on tradition tree but like i said, the guy had an insane amount of ballistas early..i should have taken a screenshot of his army it was ridiculous..pretty sure i even took protection pantheon
     
  17. Tachii

    Tachii Procrastinator

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    If I had at least 7 CBs I would've DOW as soon as I got those before his ballistas had the luxury time to come up near my cities and then get DOWed. Unless, of course, you had another neighbour who also have a decent army ready to sneak attack you if you leave your borders.


    Speaking of which, I had a recent Immortal game with Sweden once, got DOWed by T81, by Cathy and Sejong, who JUST made a peace treaty between each other. That was definitely the most ridiculous turn I've experienced in CiV for a long, long time. Cathy had 7 swordsmen (god I hate her UA), a few spearmen, and archers while Sejong had like at least 8+ spearmen with a buttload of archers. Both had an army "that can wipe me off the planet".
    Civ5Screen0026 copy.jpg
    I had like 5 archers at that point and practically begged for the Incans to give me enough gold to upgrade to CB. Didn't build any wonders as I was trying to get at least 2 spearmen and 2 warriors for additional meat shield to protect my CBs. The only fortunate thing was Korea came up late as I took my sweet turns wiping at least 4-5 Swordsmen, while allied with Florence to cushion the Russian sword swarms.
    Civ5Screen0027 copy.jpg
    The end result was great, but my science is awful and the Incans have build 8+ wonders at this point with the best lead in science. Stockholm have bad production which means the NC is put off at an indefinite time and I've still yet to research Education. Going to be a pain later on when I have to face the Incans.
     
  18. whyidie

    whyidie Emperor

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    Just had one like this tonight. Huns and Celts are duking it out. They declare on Byzantine. I'm friends with Byzantine. As soon as our friendship is up, Byzantine settles with the Celts and declares war on me. Within 5 turns the Celts and the Huns declare on me. Once the treaty with Celts and Byzantine is expired, they're back at war. The entire continent is a hornets nest.

    I've got a great tech lead due to somehow avoiding the early wars, but no access to steel, with a nice mix of swordsmen and battering rams headed for my city.
     

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