Air Defense Values

[tombohnstedt]

This is probably a dumb question, but maybe somebody would enlighten me, since the index/help in the Civ# Conquests editor doesent relly tell:

When creating or modifying an air unit like a Fighter tasked with Air Defense...Should I be using the box with "Air Defense Str" values, or is that for ground units only? Is the "Attack Str" value only what I should use for Air Defense fighters?

Thanks

 

[Taras Bulba]

as far as I know, attack and defense values for aircraft come into play when getting into a dog fight/air battle. The higher the attack the more likely it is to intercept the aircraft if bombarding, but the higher the defense the more likely the aircraft is to intercept an aircraft that is attacking it/the city its in or near it

if you check the the box to task Fighters to Air Defense, that just means that is how the AI will use that. It's partially why the AI uses bombers to bomb and fighters to fight (rather than the other way around) even though it seems pretty self-explanatory

I'm not 100% sure about all this though, so don't take my word as the ONLY way it can be

 

[tombohnstedt]

I appreciate the help. Looking at a "clean sheet" in the Conquests editor, "Flak", "Mobile SAM" and "Aegis Cruiser" each have Air Defense values, but "Fighter", "Jet Fighter", and "F-15" have zero value for that. SO I will assume that this particular value applies to surface units, and NOT air units like fighters. Thanks very much for the answer!

 

[DJ Bonebraker]

Correct: The "Air Defense" values are used to determine the chance that a ground unit will shoot down attacking air units.

 

[againsttheflow]

The higher the attack the more likely it [the fighter] is to intercept the aircraft if bombarding,

Wait, this is a little bit confusing. Does increased attack increase the probability of performing an air superiority mission?

 

[Taras Bulba]

Wait, this is a little bit confusing. Does increased attack increase the probability of performing an air superiority mission?

as far as I know, not the chance of actually intercepting the plane (as I believe that is determined in the General Setting Menu for the editor) but the chance of actually WINNING the air superiority fight they get in.

I'll try to give an example.

You know the AI has fighters. You have Jet Fighters (higher attack than fighter, IIRC)

You bombard with the fighter to hopefully intercept the fighter. The base value for interception 50% chance. Therefore, you have a 50% chance you will get to attack the fighter. Since Fighters have a defense of 2 (not to be confused with attack of 4) and Jet Fighters have an attack of 8, chances are your Jet Fighter will win the air fight if it happens.

If it happened the other way around, and the fighter attacked your Jet Fighter, since the Fighter has an attack of 4, and the Jet has a defense of 4, it would be an even fight (assuming both are the same Experience level, eg. reg., vet. elite)


Now I'm not 100% sure about this, but I'm FAIRLY certain that is how it works


EDIT: Thanks Hirako, and sorry tombohnstedt, I completely forgot about that value, Hirako is right

 

[r16]

ı was fond of using aircraft in Civ1 , they are more realistic in this game .I see ground units can shoot down planes , have the people in this forum found a way to destroy ground units by aircraft ? Even the cruise missile is practically useless .Bombarding can be useful ı agree , but ı would like to wipe out enemy ground units from air . ı guess it strays from the topic but ı feel ı should ask it .

 

[Delta_Strife]

ı was fond of using aircraft in Civ1 , they are more realistic in this game .I see ground units can shoot down planes , have the people in this forum found a way to destroy ground units by aircraft ? Even the cruise missile is practically useless .Bombarding can be useful ı agree , but ı would like to wipe out enemy ground units from air . ı guess it strays from the topic but ı feel ı should ask it .

To have an aircraft with the ability to destroy ground units simply highlight the lethal land bombard option in the Civ3 editor when creating your unit or modifying one.

 

[againsttheflow]

You bombard with the fighter to hopefully intercept the fighter. The base value for interception 50% chance. Therefore, you have a 50% chance you will get to attack the fighter.

Ok, one more. Is the 50% chance based on the city's garrison of fighters as a whole or each fighter individually? i.e. AI sends in bomber to my city guarded by 30 of my fighters on Air Superiority, does the rng role for each one individually or is it one roll to see if the radar operators were at there business? Essentially, would increasing my number of fighters increase my chances to intercept that individual bomber? or are they only good for trying to intercept the 30 bombers that may follow?

 

[Taras Bulba]

Ok, one more. Is the 50% chance based on the city's garrison of fighters as a whole or each fighter individually? i.e. AI sends in bomber to my city guarded by 30 of my fighters on Air Superiority, does the rng role for each one individually or is it one roll to see if the radar operators were at there business? Essentially, would increasing my number of fighters increase my chances to intercept that individual bomber? or are they only good for trying to intercept the 30 bombers that may follow?

AFAIK, having 30 fighters on Air Superiority in one city is only good for trying to intercept 30 bombers. Having 30 in one city does not increase chances of one intercepting.

Its just like having land units defending in your city, except for the air.

but, like before, I'm not 100% sure, so don't think that THIS IS HOW IT IS. I don't want to be made a fool when someone else comes who knows something more.

 

[r16]

thanks to Delta Strife ı will attempt to when ı am confident enough to try editors , but the standart games ( ı have vanilla ) probably won't allow it ı guess .

 

[Steph]

Every time a bomber attack a city, the interception chance is used to check if it can be intercepted, without any modifier (except if it's normal/stealth).
Then, the stronger defender should fight it, if it has not already intercepted this turn (and I think it shouldn't have bombard the previous turn either).

So if you have 5 interceptors against 10 bombers, it remains interesting. If you are lucky you can shoot down the 5 first bombers. But if you miss the 5 first, you could still get the 5 next. An interceptor is not "used up" by a non intercepted attack.

Although sometimes it's nice to bombard first with weak bomber but good fighters, hoping you can trigger an interception, damage the interceptor, and open the way for the bombers. Kind of escort mission.

 

[general-jcl]

To have an aircraft with the ability to destroy ground units simply highlight the lethal land bombard option in the Civ3 editor when creating your unit or modifying one.

Does it mean, all the stack is destroyed or just one unit?

And one more question, I read all the explanations in this topic, but I do not understand why we have a defense value for a fighter? Fighters can't bomb so they can't be intercepted...

 

[Steph]

Does it mean, all the stack is destroyed or just one unit?

Just one unit.

And one more question, I read all the explanations in this topic, but I do not understand why we have a defense value for a fighter? Fighters can't bomb so they can't be intercepted...

Because if you allow a fighter to bombard, with a low bombardment strength, you can still use it as escort, to "attract" ennemy fighters, and save the bomber that will come afterward.