Airship: the moost ridiculous unit in the game?

[Quagga]

but how can they be used for sub-spotting if nobody's heard of subs themselves for another two techs?

20,000 Leagues Under the Sea was written long before anyone could build a submarine. In other words, the concept well preceeded the actual unit. (And I'm sure that Verne didn't even invent the concept.)

Besides, if it's in plain site, I'll spot it regardless of whether I know how to build it. Remember that non-nuke subs spend most of their time surfaced.

 

[gunter]

Remember that non-nuke subs spend most of their time surfaced.

Wrong,they surface just the time necessary to recharge batteries despiting they are old style or new hydrogen ones.

That was true for WWII submarines only.

 

[GIO888]

Airships are excellent for the time they appear in the game.

They are great for neutralising enemy shipping, especially Privateers, teamed with Frigates/Ironclads you can get a top class Veteran Navy real quick.

Oftentimes I get Airships while my Riflemen/Redcoats are up against Macemen or Musketeers - collateral damage from Airships swings the battle and helps take cities.

I have a piece of a Zeppelin airframe taken from one shot down over London in 1917. These things weren't a joke to the people of London, Dover, Portsmouth and Southampton who were bombed by them!!

 

[Quagga]

Wrong,they surface just the time necessary to recharge batteries despiting they are old style or new hydrogen ones.

Thanks for bringing me up to the modern age. I should have realized that some countries might build non-nuclear subs even today.

Regardless, it doesn't change my argument much, if at all. The subs are on or very near the surface when the airship spots them. Spotting them doesn't require any technology more advanced than Optics.

 

[KMadCandy]

Besides, if it's in plain site, I'll spot it regardless of whether I know how to build it. Remember that non-nuke subs spend most of their time surfaced.

sorry, i can't remember what i don't know. my entire knowledge of history is limited to what happened in 1066, 1492, and 1766. i had the worst history teachers in the world that's why posts are so dumb about this type of stuff!

 

[jkp1187]

Okay, speaking as someone who wants to add a dose of realism to the unit without changing its essential nature, nor overly complicating things, how about this:

1.) Allow the unit to be constructed with physics, as it is currently.

2.) Leave unit attack strength/ability/basing as-is, but change movement range to TWO (2). Basically, just like a hot-air balloon, it can move a little bit, but no more of this long-range recon. The attack value will remain for hitting land/naval units that are adjacent to its base (and to leave the 'fun' playability value of the unit as-is), but the units primary role will be that of recon in border/sea areas. No more long-range bombing runs on incoming macemen and knights.

3.) Once COMBUSTION is discovered, restore the range to its original value (what is it -- 7?) using the same mechanic where naval unit movement is increased +1 with discovery of REFRIGERATION. This represents the 'realistic' fact that with combustion, long-range dirigibles are possible, and it also gives the player an air unit just when the good naval units are becoming available. (Not sure how the XML is set up on this, might have to create a new unit class just for airships....)

4.) In light of the fact that flight is quickly available after COMBUSTION, (and in light of the fact that fighters have a shorter range,) perhaps it would be good to leave airships available for construction until ADVANCED FLIGHT? (I am reluctant to allow them to upgrade to bombers, just allow them to die out, so to speak.)

Opinions?


P.S. @ Kmad -- I thought that all air units, when performing recon, could spot subs....

 

[bardolph]

I think reducing their range to 4 would rein them in.

If more is necessary, then take away their +100% vs Navy, and perhaps even give Infantry a chance to intercept Airships.

That should do it.

 

[KMadCandy]

P.S. @ Kmad -- I thought that all air units, when performing recon, could spot subs....

nope. try it out in WB, give barbs a sub. you'll see that's one advantage to not upgrading all your airships when you get the chance. of course you have to find a place to store 'em...

 

[Ricci]

Something for the experts in airships (being a marathon player never had a chance to try them yet).
I would like to know how good/efective these airships are against destroyers? Which whould be the strategy to follow for this matter? Thanks in advance..

 

[goony]

I reckon just push back the airship to combustion or something (or at least a tech forward from physics) and make it upgradeable to bomber. Combustion is still a pre-req for flight isn't it? (that way, people couldn't have fighters before airships)

Or if we must have airships at physics, have two airships: one at physics for recon only, and one at combustion that acts as a bomber (give it collateral damage, bombardment etc.).

I mean think about it, first airships to have the sort of capabilities as depicted in game weren't developed until the late 19th century, and the internal combustion engine needed to power those kind of airships was first patented by Samuel Brown in the 1820's (1823 i think?)

 

[Endwar 005]

While i agree that airships thouroghly suck, there are solutions to make them better.

Like to make fighters unlock with another tech, and airships w/ flight.

 

[ezwip]

I vote the gunship is ridiculous time after time. It's a waste of space.

 

[Quagga]

They probably should unlock with Chemistry, not Physics. The table of elements and atomic weights and refining of gasses is all about Chemistry.

Flight is heavier-than-air flight and is definitely not the right tech for airships.

 

[ezwip]

I like how you can launch a spaceship to Alpha Centauri without advanced flight.

 

[lutzj]

Didn't Napoleon (I) want to invade Britain with some kind of airship, in addition to tunneling there from France?

don't we all?

My main objections to airships are their extensive range

isn't their extensive range and ability to scan large areas a result of their needing almost no power to stay aloft and very little power to move?

 

[ditchhook]

Okay, speaking as someone who wants to add a dose of realism to the unit without changing its essential nature, nor overly complicating things, how about this:

...
2.) Leave unit attack strength/ability/basing as-is, but change movement range to TWO (2). Basically, just like a hot-air balloon, it can move a little bit, but no more of this long-range recon. The attack value will remain for hitting land/naval units that are adjacent to its base (and to leave the 'fun' playability value of the unit as-is), but the units primary role will be that of recon in border/sea areas. No more long-range bombing runs on incoming macemen and knights.

3.) Once COMBUSTION is discovered, restore the range to its original value (what is it -- 7?) ...
Opinions?
QUOTE]

I have not have the chance to use airships yet, but here's a wild suggestion:
Considering how vulnerable airships are to weather/winds, give them not X range, but a randomly generated 1 to X+1 range each turn. The total would be hidden from the user. This would make them still useful for recon work but unreliable for combat operations. Once combustion is discovered, give them a range of X-1 to X+1, thus making them a little more useful. As far as the AI goes, provide it with the randomly generated range (for that turn) so it can plan its attacks better.

An even simpler to code revision might be to have "high winds" ground them every few turns, again making them unreliable.

 

[Sinapus]

20,000 Leagues Under the Sea was written long before anyone could build a submarine. In other words, the concept well preceeded the actual unit. (And I'm sure that Verne didn't even invent the concept.)

Actually, there were some subs used before Verne. They used muscle-power for propulsion, though...

It's probably more accurate to say Verne came up with something that sounds like the nuclear-powered submarines of today.

 

[Robert Can't]

back onto airships I think that if you get them befor anyone else they can be used to kill enemy units but you can only use them in ofensive roles from your most reacently took city because of short operational range

 

[Ekmek]

DOes anyone know what I have to do to make the Airship only do recon missions? the xml does have the fields clearly labeled as perform airstrike, airbombard, interdiction, or recon.

thx

 

[bonafide11]

Airships are terrible... Never should have added them