AI's DoWing when impossible

[obsolete]

I've noticed time and time again the civ spec-sheets for what leaders can DoW at what status is simply in error, or the game is just full of further bugs that still need to be fixed.

Every time I point out another leader that just DoWed on me when relations made it impossible I keep getting told that I must have missed something. That I must have let them go wehorn before, and somehow missed it, etc.

This is nonsense, as I've always gone back to recheck.

Anyhow, here again it happened. Boudica is not allowed to DoW when she is pleased, yet she will DoW the next turn. There is no event possible that can cause this.

I've noticed a long time ago that many AI's who are friendly or pleased with you, drop down a level during THEIR turn, but then it always pops back up right when it's your turn. When the map bogs down heavily and slows down you can notice this if you look carefully at the score-list.

It's my belief this is what causes the AI's to do ilegal DoWs.

Here's the save so I don't have to keep hearing how I must have MISSED a wehorn routine.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

I rarely look at other bug report save files, since I don't have any influence that could change things....but I'm taking a look at this one. Certain aspects of this game still bother me...

Edit: How can you even check WHEOOHRN in a 1 v 1 situation? Boudica is the only person you've met. Maybe BUG will still show you, but I'm not sure how one would do it without that (which, if that's the case, BUG needs a patch too).

I would have to imagine that some form of rank change could be the culprit here too - depending on how the AI is ranked relative to someone it grants a hidden modifier, depending on leader. It's hard to imagine that occurring in this scenario though.

There's one final thing that might be causing this, although it's probably hopeless to know without asking a code diver like DanF - some AIs can use a "dagger" strategy early in the game. This causes them to behave differently than normal diplo would dictate otherwise. I don't think it's coded to declare at impossible dispositions, but it can declare without WHEOOHRN.

So, my guesses here:

1. She was WHEOOHRN for a while, and you had no way of knowing/checking
2. Disposition drops in between turns such that she could declare
3. "dagger". I really don't know the details of that code...

 

[obsolete]

Alright, I think I see what you mean, that if there is only 1 known AI, it should be impossible to tell if the AI is in wehorn or not because there is no other AI t check its status again.

That makes sense, except for all the other games where I got DoW'ed on by AI's who knew everyone else but still decided to do an illegal DoW.

It's quite possible then this is a legal DoW because of the 1v1 situation, so I'll just forget about it for now. I'll bump this one up during the next case when more evidence comes to light in the other manner.

 

[r_rolo1]

AI in Dagger mode ( aka ruthless and cold backstab ) can definitely DoW without warning........ but your play year seems too late for Dagger strategy... Deity or Immortal, I assume? ( can't load the save now )

 

[Ai Shizuka]

No wheoohrn when isolated with a lone rival, I'm 100% sure.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

He's playing deity, but boudica is the only person he knows.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

I just discovered that it is, in fact, possible to have an AI declare on you when it is already at war, without anything like the AP causing it, in the classical age. I think it was tied to a refused request and that AI's power being really huge, but it declared on me on its own (not bribed) while at war with a weak sauce AI.

Justice was served...I stole all its recent conquests, wrecked its invasion SoD, and capped it eventually . Still, interesting to note.

 

[r_rolo1]

I had the same experience yesterday..... maybe we're playing the same game