Allow "No Barbarians"?

Do we want to allow Barbarians to be turned off for the Civ 5 Hall of Fame?

  • Yes, make "No Barbarians" optional.

    Votes: 46 26.9%
  • No, make "No Barbarians" an illegal option.

    Votes: 102 59.6%
  • Does not matter to me.

    Votes: 23 13.5%

  • Total voters
    171
I'm undecided. Lean towards don't allow it, since it does change things a bit. No barbs also doesn't seem to be the big difference it was in 4.

Based on the little bit I've played to date, I won't switch them off myself.
 
Which is not so different from picking Netherlands & Portugal for a global highlands map, no? That bit doesn't bother me.

But in past versions, the barbs felt like a tacked-on thing that were just an added pain, so no big deal switching them off. This time, the barbs feel more an integral part, they're far more involved in the game, so removing them feels similar to something like removing a victory condition. That's why I'd prefer to see them left in.
 
This time, the barbs feel more an integral part, they're far more involved in the game, so removing them feels similar to something like removing a victory condition. That's why I'd prefer to see them left in.

I agree. Even on the more advanced levels the territory stays unclaimed well into the game, meaning barbs are around for quite a while.
 
As someone who never played with barbs on, unless for a GOTM, i cannot see allowing no-barbs for HOF games. They are just so tied to the game this time around to completly ignore. They actually may be more beneficial in this game than a hindrance, due to the XP and gold AND influence they can provide towards city-states.
I have not played a no-barbs game in Civ5 and i intended to make my last game no-barbs. Only on a island heavy map have i ever though about turning them off.
 
Like the other posters, I feel that in V barbarians are too much of a necessary game mechanic and add to much to logistical considerations to consider removing them. If for no reason alone that the barbarians add to City-State interactions, and removing a way to get City-State influence seems unbalancing to me. I myself would never play with them off (and I never did in IV either) - but this year I can't see any reason to why it should be an option. They just add so much to the game from both a competitive and most importantly, a fun standpoint.
 
Which is not so different from picking Netherlands & Portugal for a global highlands map, no? That bit doesn't bother me.

Not really, the UA's in Civ V are far more unique and game breaking if a civ is handicapped into ot being able to use them.

In Civ IV, Willem's Fin and Cre traits still work on any map, as do Joao's IMP and EXP.

The other thing is that people turned barbs off in Civ IV because they were rather powerful and could capture cities. In Civ V, they can no longer capture cities, well, they can, but defending against them is really really easy.

Plus another thing to remember is that Barbs are useful for all civs in Civ V. Taking out encampments is easy and gives you gold, plus you get a lot of city state requests to clear barbarian camps for free and easy influence points.

I played earlier versions of Civ exclusively with barbs turned off because I always lost cities to them (I rarely build much military and rely on ecomomy and diplomacy). In Civ V however, so far I have not had any problems with dealing with them using just my starting warrior, even if I dont build any other units for ages.

Turning barbs off in Civ V is just incredibly pointless and detrimental to every Civ in the game, as opposed to being beneficial as it was in earlier Civ games. Theres no need for it as they are so weak, and leaving them on is very advantageous for free gold and city state influence.
 
"No barbarians" should be an illegal option, because without barbs, it isn't the same. How far I understand the mechanics of civ 5 it is really stupid witout barbs, especiall without city states. Without barbs, city-states won't send messages how they need you to protect them from barbs and that's one whole mechanic and it wouldn't be a real civ 5 without barbs. I hated barbs in civ 4 and I would always turn them off, but now, I can't imagine game without barbs ( well, except MP:cowboy:), so it should definitly be an illegal option to turn off barbs. :king:
 
Turning off barbarians wouldn't bother me. You're giving up easy gold, experience for units, experience for great general generation and city-state influence if you turn them off. Probably isn't any worse from a balance perspective than turning them off in Civ IV.

On a related note, does Raging Barbarians cause encampments to spawn faster? If so, that is probably is more exploitable than No Barbarians.
 
Turning off barbarians wouldn't bother me. You're giving up easy gold, experience for units, experience for great general generation and city-state influence if you turn them off. Probably isn't any worse from a balance perspective than turning them off in Civ IV.

On a related note, does Raging Barbarians cause encampments to spawn faster? If so, that is probably is more exploitable than No Barbarians.

I think it's less to do with how the absence of barbarians can directly affect the human player as how it can affect certain other AI civs. Turning off barbarians and then specifically choosing Songhai and/or Germany as an opponent negates their UA, which can provide an indirect advantage to the human player.
 
I think turning off Civ IV was more of an advantage than it is in Civ V. I've yet to see barbarians take over my city or steal my workers and the gold and influence from them is more of advantage. If someone wants to handicap themselves by taking barbs off then I don't have a problem with it.
 
In support of "No Barbarians" option:

It would be a disadvantage to select "No Barbarians". It would obviously make it impossible to gain Influence with a City State for dispelling a particular Barbarian Encampment. Also, the Barbarians in Civ V seem to be far more tame than in Civ IV, especially at higher levels like Immortal.

I don't understand why anyone would be so vehemently against an option (No Barbarians) that is clearly an disadvantage due to missed opportunities as mentioned above. The "No Barbarians" option may permit some Grand Strategies that seem unfair, but does that really make up for the disadvantage?

Seems to me that allowing "Barbarians" is more of an exploit than allowing "No Barbarians".

Civ V Birth is Premature:

Frankly, Civ V needs another year or two of development to make it stable enough, work out the severe Gameplay imbalances, etc. to support a Hall of Fame where Competitors can be fairly compared.

Sun Tzu Wu
 
If no barbs is illegal, I think raging barbs should be as well, especially if it causes encampments to spawn more frequently. This could be to the player's advantage - keeps the AI from expanding as quickly and provides more plundering opportunities (and XP to a certain extent, although there is the barb XP cap)
 
I'm going to have to try playing with No Barbs on before really trying to understand the situation, but right now I find that barbs are an advantage to have on the map. If you're lucky they'll steal CS workers, and get targetted by CS making it really easy to ally with certain CS (that's worth about 500g right there). The flip side is that No Barbs maybe the AI will be slightly better at low levels, meaning you get more cities to capture making it easier to win, as well.
 
I have to agree with others here; barbarians are much more integral to Civ V compared to Civ IV. Not only does "no barbarians" sometimes make it easier for weaker military nations to win non-domination victories, but it drastically changes how rapidly a scouting nation can advance early in the game since they can find all the ruins / wonders for upgrades / bonuses more rapidly.

Plus, without barbarians, unless you're at war, it's often completely safe to send out settlers, etc. unprotected making expansion much easier.
 
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