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Alternative Timelines

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Caveman 2 Cosmos' started by Hydromancerx, Sep 12, 2011.

  1. Hydromancerx

    Hydromancerx C2C Modder

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    ------

    Post your alternative timeline ideas in this thread.

    Here are some old posts I hd on the subject ...

    "Punk" Types ...

    - Prehistoric Era = Stonepunk
    - Ancient Era = ?
    - Classical Era = ?
    - Medieval Era = Cogpunk
    - Renaissance Era = Clockpunk
    - Industrial Era = Steampunk
    - Modern Era = Dieselpunk
    - Trans-Human Era = Cyberpunk / Biopunk / Nanopunk
    - Galactic Eras = ?
     
  2. Hydromancerx

    Hydromancerx C2C Modder

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    Some Ancient Techs and Exotic Weapons that could be added.

    - Greek Railroad (Sailing Ships on Tracks)
    - Kite Bombs
    - Da Vinci Tank
    - Da Vinci Ornithopter
    - Da Vinci Screw Helocpter
    - Da Vinci Pyramid Parachute
    - Da Vinci Organ Guns
    - Da Vinci War Machine
    - Chinese Un-Manned Crossbow Chariot
    - Wind Car (Land Sailboat)
    - Paper Armor (Lamellar Armour)
    - Rhino Hide Armor
    - Meteor Hammer
    - Flying Crow
    - Ancient Roman Super Watermills
    - Dock Traps (Spiked Under Water Taps)
    - Ancient Chinese Steam Turbine
    - Baghdad Batteries
    - Japanese Horo "Arrow Catcher" (Silk cape/balloon)

    More to come ...
     
  3. philipschall

    philipschall Chieftain

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    I love the idea of a post-apocalyptic world, ala fallout or <shudder>waterworld</shudder>. I could see it as the player or the AI has to complete a world project to save everyone from the brink of destruction. Failure to do so massively terraforms most of the world to be inhospitable, but the players can go through the post apocalyptic "rebuilding civilization" period until they reach back at the industrial age and go from there.
     
  4. rightfuture

    rightfuture Chieftain

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    Ok here we go. Love the ideas. I am amazed at what you've come up with. I can't wait to see where else we can go!!
     
  5. rightfuture

    rightfuture Chieftain

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    I think the post -apocalyptic world scenario could be a random option triggered by events, like the dark ages in the medieval time period. Droughts affected whole civilizations and could change the course of history.

    classical era - leverpunk -
    ancient era- wheelpunk
     
  6. 45°38'N-13°47'E

    45°38'N-13°47'E Chieftain

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    Just wonder...
    Very cool ideas; I especially like the Post-apocalyptic-->Dark ages idea. But is it feasible? AFAIK, there's no way to "unlearn" a tech; I think it's somehow hard coded inside the game, isn't it? It would be very cool to "unlearn" techs after a worldwide apocalypse (nuclear war, an event such a meteor impact, an alien invasion, a deadly epidemic) and then have to re-discover techs. If such a thing is somehow possible, it would be cool to unlearn some techs while keeping bits of other techs. Unfortunately I don't see how is possible to do it. :(
     
  7. Koshling

    Koshling Vorlon

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    The main issue with unlearning is that the code assumes all ove the place that things you can do don't go away, so it has no capability to disable units or promotions or buildings etc. Due to techs being lost. None of it would be rocket science, but probably it would need a large number of changes all over the place, so in pracise it would be a matter of watching out for bugs and fixing them as we came across them.
     
  8. 45°38'N-13°47'E

    45°38'N-13°47'E Chieftain

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    Just wonder...
    Well, do you mean that if I've lost for example "Flight" I can build Airports anyway? Is that what you mean? Or do you mean that if I've lost Flight, Airports I've built previously still remain in the game? Because the first one could be a problem, the second one isn't really, IMHO: even if I lose the tech, that doesn't mean that everything that I've achieved with that tech should go away; it would mean simply that I can't replace those things (in case I lose them for some other reason) without re-discovering that tech.
     
  9. AIAndy

    AIAndy Chieftain

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    Apocalyptic events are a great idea. Too much nuke usage or building? Might trigger an atomic apocalypse.
    Lots of the world gets terraformed, lots of destruction, loss of a lot of technological knowledge and therefore also equalization between advanced and not so advanced civs. Remaining advanced units are now quite powerful in comparison but get the remnant promotion which prevents all or most of the healing of the unit.
    Then a post apocalyptic tech line that gets available after the apocalypse and helps dealing with the consequences like fallout and keeping some of the old units going. Like scavenging apocalyptic city ruins to heal them.

    The terrain slowly transforms back over many years to a hospitable world and the post apocalyptic tech line gets lost again.
     
  10. Hydromancerx

    Hydromancerx C2C Modder

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    Yeah there is a whole post-apocalyptic mod which we could pull units from. If such a thing could work I would be totally for a Post Apocalyptic Era.
     
  11. Koshling

    Koshling Vorlon

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    I meant the latter, but as you say that's not really a problem case. The problem cases are things like techs that give bonuses to improvements (plough adding to yield from farms for example), which I don't think any code would remove, but which you'd get again when relearning the tech, meaning farms would then get the plough bonus yield twice. Each such case should be easy enough to fix, it's just that it's unlikely we'd pick them all up in advance, so it would be a question of patching things up with bug fixes as we realized they were issues.
     
  12. steampunk1880

    steampunk1880 Chieftain

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    How might one trigger the Ancient Golden Age and how would it differ from the Dark and Middle ages. From what I understand the Dark Age would be characterized by massive decentralization of power and a return to illiteracy as the population of Europe reverted to survival mode as Rome receded, towns and villages developed early fortification as they could no longer count on a powerful central government to protect them with armies. The Middle ages were characterized by the growing power of the landed aristocracy, the further development of fortification techniques and the development of philosophies that legitimized the power of the nobility.

    - Units learned from the Dark and Middle ages might focus on defensive footmen early on (men-at-arms and medieval spearmen such as the guisarmier stolen from RFCEurope before the aristocracy's lancers overtake them culminating in the powerful knight unit. Defensive --> Offensive. Allowing for the creation of empires in time for the Renaissance and Imperial ages.
    - Buildings learned from the Dark and Middle ages should be powerfully defensive with high walls, keeps moats and such being exclusive to this line. But the civ should suffer greatly with science and culture with something like a medieval upgrade to the monastery being the only science building learned during the age, and the limited Cathedral being the only culture focused building learned until renaissance theaters.
    There could also be exclusive medieval upgrades to free xp buildings similar to the Knights Stable that emphasizes the martial training of the era. A Manor House building available early on might ease maintenance, produce a defensive bonus and give free xp at the expense of a fair amount of food. This is to to symbolize the era. It should become obsolete in the middle of the renaissance.
    - Civics learned from the middle ages are pretty obvious, aristocracy, absolute monarchy, manorialism.

    Guilds don't appear until renaissance right?

    An ancient golden age, however it's triggered (maybe by a national wonder that is only available towards the end of the iron age before being made obsolete by the first couple dark age techs) should in many ways be the opposite of this by preforming very well in science and culture but having a generally terrible offense, defense and mobility so that, as a Middle ages Civ and an Ancient Golden Age civ exit to the renaissance the Caesar or High Councilor of the ancient golden age civ should, all other things equal, be mincemeat for a well prepared King or Warlord coming off the middle ages.

    - Units learned from the Ancient Golden Age should in all cases be slightly to moderately weaker than their Dark and Middle age counterparts starting with some decent on attack weak on defense evolution of the Legion and ending up with a slow decent city defender that won't be able to do much against a knight on open ground. (I suggest something like a Polybolos type heavy repeating crossbow guard adapted from the chu-ko-nu art or something. If memory serves knights are immune to first strikes and flank attack siege units. Make Polybolos a siege unit with lots of first strikes and have have more base power than any other AGE unit so Medieval Knights usually get to attack it first.)
    - Buildings learned from the Ancient Golden Age should be heavy on the marble columns and, like i said, focus on science and culture (Academy of this, University of that) that said there should probably be no new defensive structures until late renaissance early imperial age star forts.
    - Civics learned from the Ancient Golden Age could go two ways. I was thinking there could either be a utopian return to republic with a AGA unique civic that compounds the science and culture bonus already gained from the buildings OR some kind of militaristic Super Caesar civic that greatly mitigates the bonuses from the buildings in exchange for making you not quite such a fragile butterfly (free xp, bonuses on defense, speedy unit training, -33% science, -33% culture). Also maybe early access to Guilds since those evolved from Roman institutions.

    and it should all be mostly mutually exclusive.

    ...anyway that's my two cents on the Ancient Golden Age.

    I think I've thrown random suggestions about Steam Punk before. My ideas can probably be summarized by like this: ++ Science ----- Health. Giant polluting steam powered mechanical computers, a variety of speedy but fragile airships and probably a land leviathan for a slow early tank and most everything requires a special workshop that pumps out even more pollution. Stuff and their pollution should start going obsolete around the time of electronic computers.
     
  13. rightfuture

    rightfuture Chieftain

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    There are some theories that the Dark Ages were triggered by a global cooling period, that was almost a mini mini Ice age.
    Some think it was caused by a set of meteors, or volcano's which could have some environmental effects.
    The Clovis culture in North America has been theorized as possibly being seriously affected by such, as well as the extinction of megafauna.
    Triggering events could also be viral, or biological. Could also be caused by cultures moving into new areas and challenging the status quo. Many extinction events are caused by a new species being introduced by a land bridge opening up. Viruses could spread that way as well.
    Dark ages could also be an age of ignorance. America is sure toying with the idea with some of the ignorant anti-science attitudes some politicians are throwing around. Maybe a technology is forgotten or outlawed and there is a consequence in a country.

    Golden ages could be triggered by a new technology, an inspired leader, or a new civic being introduced, or a philosophy. The Renaissance Age could be considered a Golden Age (maybe an automatic one is triggered). I like the idea of a golden age being a triggered event that opens up benefits and maybe new tech opportunities.

    Dirigibles / Airships did not have to go out of style at a given point.
    Hydrogen explosions made them go out of style, it didn't have to happen.
    There is a recent NASA news article this week that talks of a research project to bring back blimps for transporting freight cheaply. The television show Fringe speculates on a modern alternate earth in which airships never went away.

    Likewise automobiles could have spawned earlier with steam technology.
    Maybe a triggered Alternate Technology Era like event, like a Golden Age is triggered now, could be a selectable Alternate Timeline option that may allow for a technology like gunpowder, or automobiles, or airflight being discovered early or out of sequence?

    An Apocalyptic Era, could be a triggered event that cause all nations to have a dark age, where a set of technologies are randomly forgotten or dropped a full era. If done randomly it could be interesting. Post- Apocalyptic technologies for recovery could be introduced. Events or Goody huts for lost technology could be reintroduced.
     
  14. Mega Nix

    Mega Nix Chieftain

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    I'm more thinking that you have the option to start this alternative ages but at a cost. The researches gives you an advanced compared to others who chosses the linear researchtree. But at a time you cant advance further and have to get back to the linear researchtree, then you get back, many of the previous alternative technologies gets disabled. So you are now crippled compared to the other Civs
     
  15. EldrinFal

    EldrinFal Chieftain

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    @DH

    Can you post or link here how to turn on/off your alternative timeline "fantasy" units? I think that info belongs in this thread for people to reference. :)
     
  16. Dancing Hoskuld

    Dancing Hoskuld Chieftain

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    @Hydro, please add the following to the first post.
     
  17. Hydromancerx

    Hydromancerx C2C Modder

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  18. EldrinFal

    EldrinFal Chieftain

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    Thanks guys.:goodjob:

    Is "Dangers of the Deep" not in v17? Didn't see that subfolder.
     
  19. Dancing Hoskuld

    Dancing Hoskuld Chieftain

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    I have not tested it yet so it is not there. SaibotLieh just released a mermaid and has some other fantasy sea critters somewhere. How could I resist. :D
     
  20. strategyonly

    strategyonly C2C Supreme Commander

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    ahaha, i was wondering if you'd see that:p

    btw, did that last PM i sent you work on that project "we" were working on, Hydro said his worked, but EldrinFal said his still crashes?
     

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