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American Conquer UHV Strategy

Discussion in 'Rhye's and Fall - Dawn of Civilization' started by TJDowling, Jan 9, 2019.

  1. TJDowling

    TJDowling King

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    What's your strategy regarding America's conquer UHV? Do you tend to attack right away and stay in a state of war until 1892 or do you build up an army beforehand? The hardest part I find is knocking out the single-tile settlements in the Caribbean since they require an amphibious landing and you can only cause collateral damage with the relatively weak Grenadier. I find you really have to attack right away or you risk the AI getting ballistics. One way to get around this is to request these settlements in international congresses but that's unreliable at best. Most recently I lucked out and was able to bombard and blockade the cities down to 1 population and timed my attack with an outbreak of the plague so the units were weakened and it only took 2-4 units to conquer each one.

    Unfortunately, I managed to completely forget that Newfoundland and Labrador counts in the European colony exclusion zone so after knocking out the French, Spanish, English and vassalizing the Mexicans I still failed because there was British St. John's and two Norwegian settlements.
     
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  2. Crimean Lord

    Crimean Lord Warlord

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    ОК...
    But What about SPEED and version of Map (big or current)?:)
     
  3. Leoreth

    Leoreth Friend Next Door Moderator

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    Why would anyone ask for strategies for a map that isn't even merged or playable yet.
     
  4. Crimean Lord

    Crimean Lord Warlord

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    But question about SPEED is reasonable - because in Marathon's format is much easier conquer territories before particular date!
     
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  5. Ballazic

    Ballazic King

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    I would say you need to prioritize getting riflemen, or even infantry if you can make it in time. I generally focus on mexico first as you can use artillery and superior production to overwelmn them with numbers. The islands are tricky, but as mentioned before if you swarm them with advanced footsoldiers you should be able to get the job done. Obviously navy to bombard the island cities are key. This is definitely the hardest american UHV conditions IMHO.
     
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  6. 1SDAN

    1SDAN Brother Lady

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    Technically it's playable, but on Hospital's modmod of your modmod.

    Though it's not fully balanced and still in active alpha development so I don't think now is a great time to start posting strategies just yet. What with how they're bound to become outdated pretty quickly.
     
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  7. Orbii

    Orbii Warlord

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    Agreed with all that's been stated thus far. My usual strategy is to zergrush the islands at spawn with your starting army, supplemented with the additional "defensive" stacks from a British DoW on flip. If the RNG doesn't work out I start again from 1776 AD. The hope is that you complete this before the Europeans upgrade to Rifles, which on Monarch is usually pretty feasible for at least 10 turns for the advanced powers (Britain, France, Netherlands). France seems to beeline it a bit more though. Note that I always play on the 1700 AD scenario, and on Monarch/Normal.

    Therefore, my priorities on spawn with the armies:
    • Starting Grenadiers and Cannons go to Toronto, capture it, and raze it to cripple the Canadians on spawn. I've noticed on recent revisions though that Toronto has a few more Redcoats, and you now need to send one or two defensive Minutemen to not have your invasion stack demolished. These units heal up in NYC and then get shuttled to Newfoundland/Halifax later.
    • The "defensive" stacks from the British DoW, along with the starting Minutemen, are loaded onto the ships you hopefully flipped from the British. Three Galleons is likely, and four is ideal. With the new Pioneer UU you can load considerably more units, as you don't need to send garrisons with your settlers now (although I have yet to test this).
    • The hope for the one-tile islands is your first suicide unit can deal at least 70% damage to the defender to guarantee the second's victory. The larger islands can be collateral'ed like any other city, as can the Central American cities.
    • I usually don't DoW France, as they usually have Rifles and their cities can be Congressed, usually. It's also nice to minimize the number of civs you've pissed off, so as to keep the Bad Relations malus down a bit until the other conquests are done.
    • The only other note is to protect your ships. Until the last few islands, it tends to be pretty easy to take advantage of the new(-ish) naval movement rules (all movement consumed upon entering warring civs' culture) to protect your ships, and the way the Caribbean is structured lets you land units on the same turn your landing ships lose all their movement points.
    This approach is successful on Monarch roughly 50% of the time. The main limitation is dice-rolls for the one-tile islands on the initial suicide unit; otherwise, it is not difficult to conduct.
     
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  8. Ballazic

    Ballazic King

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    The advantage to going for it straight away is you can focus more on founding and improving cities.
     
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  9. TJDowling

    TJDowling King

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    I always play 1700AD normal and monarch. I think in my last round I got pretty bad luck (other than the fortunate Caribbean plague situation). Britain did not declare war so I got no defensive stacks and I was unable to get French cities in two separate congresses (perhaps I declared war on too many civs). Also, I'm less inclined to cripple Canada for patriotic (not strategic) reasons, plus Canada tends to cripple itself by not settling the West but I think I will adjust my strategy to accommodate capturing Newfoundland early on as it will become too difficult/tedious later and I can even settle Labrador to keep the Norwegians out.

    Protecting ships is definitely something I've been bad at. I've started prioritising Washington/Boston as naval cities building drydocks then a couple Ships of the Line to help with escorting galleons and bombarding cities. The rest go to minutemen, grenadiers, cannons pioneers and workers to prepare for the Mexico invasion. Except New York which goes to commerce and the Statue of Liberty.
     
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  10. Orbii

    Orbii Warlord

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    As a Canadian I can understand the sentiment, but how else can one get back at those smug Torontonians if not by wiping their city from the face of the map in a modmod of a video game? God knows the Oilers aren't going to do it for us in hockey anytime soon :(

    Agreed. Even without razing Toronto, and taking no additional actions, Canada does not expand well to the West. Usually to even further stifle their development, I settle Thunder Bay three turns after their spawn (and thus on the turn on their flip). This complete strangles their expansion as they no longer have land routes west. Settling Labrador is also necessary to keep stray Settlers out, as you identify.

    For the first point, it's ultimately a luck-based thing, but one thing you definitely should avoid is making Defensive Pacts before the flip. Britain is very, very hesitant to DoW on spawn if you have a DoW with any European power, in my observations. On the second matter, I think New Orleans is coded to be favourable in the Congress, but anything past that is up to luck. My main strategy for dealing with the French is always to prep for eventual war and conquest because of that fact, and getting any cities past New Orleans through Congress is just serendipitous.

    With ships, I find the best way is usually (assuming OB with France or New Orleans owned):
    1. Load units in New York/Washington. Galleons wait in Charleston.
    2. Ships position 2W1N of Havana to land units on the west tip of Cuba. Spain tends not to have boats in the Gulf of Mexico.
    3. Ships move to Central American 1NE of the Silver hill.
    4. For the one tile islands, move through the Caribbean just north of land to suicide units by accessing the BFC 1 SW of the cities. This is the most risky part and thus what I leave for last, as the Brits almost always have boats which can reach these parts. The British BFC's provide protection against other boats, however.
    5. For Canada, Boston to Halifax works out well.
    Boston is honestly such a bad city that it does nothing for me but churn out Settlers/Workers early on. It actually is unable to do anything else but this. Charleston is a similarly terrible city that thus also pumps out nothing but Settlers/Workers. I find with good positioning of ships and a good initial flip you never need to build additional naval units, so Washington alone pumps out land units and everything else does infrastructure.
     
  11. TJDowling

    TJDowling King

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    You're right about Toronto smugness. It just seems a waste of resources considering Canada will flip Toronto before the deadline anyway and Britain rarely attacks from Toronto. I guess to reliably get St. John's you do need to get Halifax though to avoid your ships being dunked. Actually my previous game was a good start for that as when I spawned the British were only just about to settle Halifax.

    So you go after the Central American cities? That's probably a good idea but I've never done that because invariably Spain loses all it's colonies when Latin civs start to spawn. The only problem I encountered a little while back is I collapsed Mexico which flipped the remaining Central American cities back to Spain so this go around I just got Oaxaca down to within one heavily damaged unit and Mexico capitulated giving me control without risking the flip.

    You're right, Boston is pretty useless but you can at least get one Ship of the Line and churn out a few replacement Galleons if you lose any along the way. The problem is a lack of productive maritime cities in the beginning and since Boston and Charleston are mostly useless they can just (slowly) produce naval units. Even New York isn't very good but with the massive population it's better to prioritise for non-military use.
     
  12. Orbii

    Orbii Warlord

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    I mainly go after the various cities you don't (Toronto, Halifax, Central America) because they all tend to be easy targets: poorly defended, on flatland, and on the way to other targets. More importantly, they are not one-tile islands, and thus you can use your Cannons against them. As for why I conquer them and not wait for the colonial flips:
    1. As you noted, later collapses can flip the cities back to the Euros.
    2. It's easy to conquer the cities and this gets your units some XP (and thus your civ some GG points).
    3. Conquering these cities and killing the defenders in the process runs up the warscore, allowing quicker and better peace deals.
    I have three reasons for conquering Central America:
    1. Taking these cities means that Mexico cannot (at least while you are at peace), thus resulting in a weaker Mexico. I find invariably that as a result all that is needed to capitulate Mexico later is an amphibuous landing right next to Mexico City followed by conquest the turn after.
    2. These cities provide some happiness resources you're not getting elsewhere for some time: Bananas, Dye, and Silver, along with four additional units of health resources.
    3. Ciudad de Guatemala is a canal city. During the lull between waiting to be able to DoW Mexico and the initial conquests, I like to use it to ship my trained armies to Japan, and conquer Tokyo. AI Japan tends to garrison Kyoto and in any event does not have enough units to beat back trained Cannons/Minutemen. Tokyo has excellent resources in its BFC to aid your core, as well as being a superb city in its own right.
    Ultimately it's interesting to hear how much different you play the initial USA compared to me. I'll again highlight that they way I run it fails about 60% of the time due to the necessary dice rolls on the one-tile islands, but everything I've noted in this specific post is very reliable.
     
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