Ancient City Ruins

Calavente

Richard's voice
Joined
Jun 4, 2006
Messages
2,864
Location
France
well, consider that ball of flames are really really hot... and stone ruptures under the heat.
point over.
wooden gate burns, support beams burns, and the stone wall collaps
earth-made structurs becomes ultra dry and becomes friable.
defenders on the walls can't come neard them as some random stone explodes and the floor is mighty hot...etc

As for city ruins...
how do you know their is a whole city in the forest ?
maybe it's just a cave, or your hunter fell in a hole leading to a chamber... showing their was a city nearby.
or maybe their are some few remnants. if those were cities, there can always be some few appearing remnants. And we do not have ghost cities but RUINS... it can be 2 ruins of a wall that show the hunter he may be interested into digging here.
maybe enough for a scout/hunter to see it and have the idea to come back and dig a bit more.
end of discussion (no needs of dicussion on physics...Etc).
 

Jabie

Wanted in Monte Carlo...
Joined
Dec 16, 2003
Messages
1,024
Location
Southampton, UK
I like the City Ruins, as this adds flavour, but I'm not so keen on them being treated as lairs. I think it'd be better if their lair effects were fairly weak. Find some cash, find nothing, find a Goblin. I kept finding Angels and Champions or getting zapped by poison gas.
 

Valkrionn

The Hamster King
Joined
May 23, 2008
Messages
14,450
Location
Crestview FL
I like the City Ruins, as this adds flavour, but I'm not so keen on them being treated as lairs. I think it'd be better if their lair effects were fairly weak. Find some cash, find nothing, find a Goblin. I kept finding Angels and Champions or getting zapped by poison gas.

Oh, I agree. I'll be adding unique effects for them, actually. EXTREMELY easy with the new exploration system.
 

Cheezy

Chieftain
Joined
Jul 11, 2010
Messages
12
I once killed an AI by exploring city ruins. Literally.

I had a Trackless and kept exploring the city ruins. Powerful enemies spawned from them and killed the AI opponent close. Lol.
 

Tsathoggua

Warlord
Joined
Sep 28, 2009
Messages
127
"Erebus is flat lol"

If it has gravity - all evidence suggests it - then glacial and flood mechanics there are the same as on Earth. It can be otherwise only if gravity on Erebus much weaker, of which i haven't found any evidence and what should be asked of Magister Cultuum or Kael himself. And also it's "one moon" adds tidal factor to the mess.

If we actually think it's flat, then we have to explain why gravity is the same strength at all points on Erebus, and positing a moon that produces tides becomes rather difficult to explain from the grounds of "Prime Material Plane" physics.

I never play with x-wrap off. I don't know why it's the default anymore -- the original FFH Erebus maps were never meant to represent an entire world at once.
 

Tsathoggua

Warlord
Joined
Sep 28, 2009
Messages
127
I once killed an AI by exploring city ruins. Literally.

I had a Trackless and kept exploring the city ruins. Powerful enemies spawned from them and killed the AI opponent close. Lol.

I'm on my way to killing two AI by exploring ruins. The effect is just delayed because my Chosen of D'Tesh and my Aeron's Chosen Assassin have to walk to their destinations. :p

Since the AI doesn't seem to grow beyond one city anymore unless they're Expansive, I expect the kill count to rise.
 

Tsathoggua

Warlord
Joined
Sep 28, 2009
Messages
127
With the amount of mass that fire posseses it would have to be going at an appreciable fraction of the speed of light to contain enough kinetic potential(Force) to do what that jet of water does. Which means you'd not -see- it as a ball of flame.



Unless, of course, you accept that in a universe rife with magic, certain aspect of physical laws can be circumvented, such as the apparent mass of an object. Which is determined by gravity. Which doesn't function in the same way as it does on Terra 'cause otherwise a 30 ton lizard would not be able to fly.

I really don't want to come down on this Rainbow guy's side, but classically, "fireballs" are rarely "balls of fire" but are typically "balls on fire", that is, spheres of stuff that burns.

Frankly it's quite conceivable that it's as mundane as a ball of napalm, which is actually quite a bit denser than water. While the sorcery required would still be pretty impressive in terms of the physics it circumvents, you don't need to sling a ball of napalm anywhere near the speed of light for it to carry sufficient momentum to punch a hole in a stone wall.

Add in explosive force and the effect of extreme heat on rock/concrete, and it becomes feasible. Provided you've already accepted that some dude in a robe made that thing appear out of thin air in the first place. :p
 

Aoleleb

Warlord
Joined
Jun 30, 2007
Messages
160
<-- Is amused at physics arguments taking place within the context of a world where you can keep yourself alive by killing yourself, heat up the sun in a localized area, teleport, and summon sentient, self-contained beings of water that keep physical form.

I think we threw not only physics, but science out the window from the word "Go". A Wizard Did It. Stop asking how a ball made of pure fire explodes and just accept that it does. If we can give granite sentience I'm sure we can make fire explode.
 

EugeneStyles

Prince
Joined
May 21, 2007
Messages
307
If we actually think it's flat, then we have to explain why gravity is the same strength at all points on Erebus, and positing a moon that produces tides becomes rather difficult to explain from the grounds of "Prime Material Plane" physics.

I never play with x-wrap off. I don't know why it's the default anymore -- the original FFH Erebus maps were never meant to represent an entire world at once.

It's actually circular, with the North Pole at the center, and an Antarctic Ice Shelf around the edges, and is travelling upward with a constant acceleration of 9.8 m/s^2. Cf. Flat Earth Society.

This is also why I always play with x-wrap on. (I also don't know why it's off by default I hate playing without x-wrap, and worse Civ doesn't save the preference so I have to turn it on every time.)
 

Celeborn

Silver-Death
Joined
Apr 7, 2003
Messages
488
Location
Where I am
I really don't want to come down on this Rainbow guy's side, but classically, "fireballs" are rarely "balls of fire" but are typically "balls on fire", that is, spheres of stuff that burns.

Frankly it's quite conceivable that it's as mundane as a ball of napalm, which is actually quite a bit denser than water. While the sorcery required would still be pretty impressive in terms of the physics it circumvents, you don't need to sling a ball of napalm anywhere near the speed of light for it to carry sufficient momentum to punch a hole in a stone wall.

Add in explosive force and the effect of extreme heat on rock/concrete, and it becomes feasible. Provided you've already accepted that some dude in a robe made that thing appear out of thin air in the first place. :p


Now the "ball of napalm not flame" hypothesis -can- work because of the addition of mass, and also allows for the deadly burning the ground and rock that fireballs often seem to have. Pure heat still doesn't cut it in my mind though, because bear in mind that it takes a tremendous amount of heat to rupture stone, and then it still doesn't happen instantaneously. And if it -does- happen instantaneously the sheer heat would kill all the mage's allies and it flew past them (Not the mage, obviously 'cause he used a Circle of Protection: Red).



But the last part of your post is actually the crux if my own point. The laws of physics are being put through the wringer constantly, so expecting the laws of gravity on Erebus (or any fantasy realm) to adhere to the same strict rules as those of Terra is... Well... A bit silly.



Edit:

<-- Is amused at physics arguments taking place within the context of a world where you can keep yourself alive by killing yourself, heat up the sun in a localized area, teleport, and summon sentient, self-contained beings of water that keep physical form.

I think we threw not only physics, but science out the window from the word "Go". A Wizard Did It. Stop asking how a ball made of pure fire explodes and just accept that it does. If we can give granite sentience I'm sure we can make fire explode.


Which is exactly what I'm getting at! :D

A Wizard Did It
 

Viatos

Prince
Joined
May 27, 2008
Messages
341
There's an old adage about bringing real-world physics into fantasy worlds: every time you do it, the Octopus Overlords eat a catgirl.



Go ahead, talk about appreciable fractions of the speed of light. You're pointing a loaded tentacle right at her head.
 

Tsathoggua

Warlord
Joined
Sep 28, 2009
Messages
127
It's actually circular, with the North Pole at the center, and an Antarctic Ice Shelf around the edges, and is travelling upward with a constant acceleration of 9.8 m/s^2. Cf. Flat Earth Society.

This is also why I always play with x-wrap on. (I also don't know why it's off by default I hate playing without x-wrap, and worse Civ doesn't save the preference so I have to turn it on every time.)

This is stupid. By now we'd be moving at close to the speed of light. What maintains that acceleration?

The turtles?
 

EugeneStyles

Prince
Joined
May 21, 2007
Messages
307
This is stupid. By now we'd be moving at close to the speed of light. What maintains that acceleration?

The turtles?

It might be turtles, yes. We don't know what maintains the acceleration, all we know is that everything in the FfH universe is accelerating directly upward at a rate of 9.8 m/s^2. That the universe is not travelling faster than the speed of light after the Age of Ice is due to relativity (if you observe it from outside, the acceleration would be slowing down as velocity approaches the speed of light, but from inside, you seem to be constantly accelerating).

Actually, if you ever read up on the Flat Earth theory, you'll find it more or less unassailable from a physics standpoint (unless you're really an expert). It's actually very interesting that a completely bathorsehocky theory can be constructed that conforms pretty well to observable physics. The "obvious" fallacies in the theory are explained away pretty well. It's when you get down to things like the far-reaching conspiracy that has faked every spaceflight and satellite photo for decades that it really breaks down.
 

Celeborn

Silver-Death
Joined
Apr 7, 2003
Messages
488
Location
Where I am
There's an old adage about bringing real-world physics into fantasy worlds: every time you do it, the Octopus Overlords eat a catgirl.

Go ahead, talk about appreciable fractions of the speed of light. You're pointing a loaded tentacle right at her head.



Wait.... So your saying I can get rid of catgirls by taking about real world physics in a fantasy setting?


Well damn. I should have started doing it sooner then!



PS.


MAGIC!
 

Jheral

Prince
Joined
Apr 29, 2009
Messages
502
Wait.... So your saying I can get rid of catgirls by taking about real world physics in a fantasy setting?


Well damn. I should have started doing it sooner then!



PS.


MAGIC!

It would certainly explain why there are never any catgirls in the fantasy settings I tend to construct. :p
 

Tsathoggua

Warlord
Joined
Sep 28, 2009
Messages
127
It might be turtles, yes. We don't know what maintains the acceleration, all we know is that everything in the FfH universe is accelerating directly upward at a rate of 9.8 m/s^2. That the universe is not travelling faster than the speed of light after the Age of Ice is due to relativity (if you observe it from outside, the acceleration would be slowing down as velocity approaches the speed of light, but from inside, you seem to be constantly accelerating).

Actually, if you ever read up on the Flat Earth theory, you'll find it more or less unassailable from a physics standpoint (unless you're really an expert). It's actually very interesting that a completely bathorsehocky theory can be constructed that conforms pretty well to observable physics. The "obvious" fallacies in the theory are explained away pretty well. It's when you get down to things like the far-reaching conspiracy that has faked every spaceflight and satellite photo for decades that it really breaks down.

The Greeks figured out that the Earth isn't flat by looking at the moon. I don't need to be an expert in physics -- though I could make such a claim that I am -- to follow their thinking.

So much to "conforming pretty well to observable physics".

There's a lot of other observable physics that utterly falls apart under the Flat Earth hypothesis, but I'd need LaTex to write most of it out for you. This is also true of the "Electric Universe" theory, "Lattice Physics", "Intelligent Design" and various other hokey theories whose proponents generally spend more time declaring that they are right than they do explaining why. As a student of physics myself, I have a morbid fascination with quackery. :p
 

Valkrionn

The Hamster King
Joined
May 23, 2008
Messages
14,450
Location
Crestview FL
The Greeks figured out that the Earth isn't flat by looking at the moon. I don't need to be an expert in physics -- though I could make such a claim that I am -- to follow their thinking.

So much to "conforming pretty well to observable physics".

There's a lot of other observable physics that utterly falls apart under the Flat Earth hypothesis, but I'd need LaTex to write most of it out for you. This is also true of the "Electric Universe" theory, "Lattice Physics", "Intelligent Design" and various other hokey theories whose proponents generally spend more time declaring that they are right than they do explaining why. As a student of physics myself, I have a morbid fascination with quackery. :p

As do I. :lol:

Well grounded in pretty much all sciences, was studying to be a chemical engineer up until switching to computer science for programming (and ultimately game design :p) ;)
 
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