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Another health-related question

Discussion in 'Civ4 - General Discussions' started by SmartMuffin, Dec 14, 2005.

  1. SmartMuffin

    SmartMuffin Chieftain

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    I remember reading on this forum that it was a good idea to intentionally stagnate growth in cities in which additoinal growth would create unhappy citizens (because those citizens eat food, but contribute nothing, effectivley starving your populace).

    I just noticed while playing last night that I have been doing the same in terms of health. That is, if a city is 9 Health - 9 Unhealth, I've been stagnating it. Should I not be doing this? What exactly does unhealth do? What is the major risk in having a very very unhealthy city?
     
  2. The Last Conformist

    The Last Conformist Irresistibly Attractive

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    Excess unhealth eats extra food (if you've got 5 health and 7 unhealth, the city consumes two extra food in addition to whatever the population eats). So, what unhealth does is essentially slowing growth. I don't see any advantage in stalling it.
     
  3. MrCynical

    MrCynical Deity

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    There isn't any risk in having an unhealthy city, and I frequently do. Each point of unhealthiness simply gives a penalty of 1 food per turn to the overall city output. If your city has loads of spare food there's no problem with growing it well into unhealthiness, since the penalty IS that the city stagnates earlier than it would if it was healthy. City with lots of floodplains in particular can often be 6+ points into unhealthiness before they stagnate. Therefore you should never stagnate a city for unhealthiness reasons.
     
  4. SmartMuffin

    SmartMuffin Chieftain

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    Seems kinda odd with Floodplains. They have additional food, but cause additional unhealth. So basically they cancel each other out and become a grassland right?
     
  5. Skippa

    Skippa Noble

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    Not If you have enough health buildings, resources and other bonuses. ;)
     
  6. SmartMuffin

    SmartMuffin Chieftain

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    But those things just add to health, they don't detract from unhealth.

    The flood plains tile still cancels itself out, you just then cancel out the negative part of it, if you get my drift.
     
  7. MrCynical

    MrCynical Deity

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    No, it doesn't work like that. If you add up all the cities health bonuses and subtract all the health penalties (this is done at the top of the city screen) and end up with a positive number, then your city has no food penalty. So say if you had two flood plain squares and an aqueduct, and no other health modifiers you'll have no unhealthiness. Then the flooplains are effectively giving you 2 more food than you would have if they were grassland.

    Adding to health is by definition detracting from unhealth.
     
  8. SmartMuffin

    SmartMuffin Chieftain

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    But if the tiles were grassland, you wouldn't need the aqueduct.
     
  9. MrCynical

    MrCynical Deity

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    But you wouldn't get the extra 2 food if they were grassland. I regard the aquaduct as well worth building to in effect get faster growth, and eventually a higher population maximum. To take another example, If you have a city with +8 to health and -4 for unhealth with grassland, then you'd be better off if two tiles were flood plain so you get two extra food. You're in effect having to get health bonuses from civics or buildings or whatever, so that your city can grow bigger with flood plain than grassland. In any case where the limiting factor on your city's growth is not health (e.g. happiness is the problem), then floodplain is better than grassland, because it gives the extra food, and doesn't push the city over the crucial limit into unhealthiness.
     
  10. Jimbo30

    Jimbo30 Prince

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    If they were grasslands and you built the aqueduct it would be useless and you'd be making 2 less food.
     
  11. CyberChrist

    CyberChrist You caught my attention

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    Flood plains only cause 0.4 unhealth each. This means that you need 3 flood plains within workable city radius for them to cause +1 unhealth (+2 with 5 flood plains, +3 with 8 etc.)
     
  12. SmartMuffin

    SmartMuffin Chieftain

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    To clarify the original question...

    Each citizen normally eats 2food/turn, except unhealthy citizens continue to work (in the fields or as specs) as normal, but they eat 3food/turn.

    So a healthy city with a population of 10 would consume 20 food. A size 10 city with a health rating of -2 would consume 22 food. Am I right on this?
     
  13. MrCynical

    MrCynical Deity

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    The rule of 2 food per turn for a normal citizen and three for an unhealthy citizen holds as long as your net unhealthiness doesn't exceed the size of the city. Your example is quite correct.

    Floodplains do indeed only give 0.4 unhealthiness each, I had them mixed up with something else. Jungle gives -0.25 :blush: . My apologies (though even if flood plains were -1 they'd still be worth having).
     
  14. SmartMuffin

    SmartMuffin Chieftain

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    How could you even do that?

    The vast majority of unhealth comes from population. I suppose if you had a size 2 city, you could reach 4 unhealth with a factory and a forge...
     

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