Any Civ fans enjoyed any of the modern "mini" 4X games? (Polytopia, Ozymandias, etc)

[bmaupin]

There seems to have been a recent trend of "mini" 4X games: 4X games designed to be completed in much shorter sessions, often no more than 1-2 hours.

While I love a long session of Civ that's not an option for me right now, so I think these games are appealing in principle.

• The Battle of Polytopia seems to be one of the first and most popular. I bought it but found it's so extremely simplified that it didn't scratch the Civ itch for me.
• Ozymandias dropped the eXploration from 4X altogether: no random maps, no fog of war, etc. I didn't even bother trying it.
• Hexarchy has an interesting twist: it uses cards and deck-building to constrain the available actions per turn. A lot of thought went into this game and I tried the demo a couple of times but once again, it just doesn't feel like it's scratching the Civ itch.

Now Yield! Fall of Rome just hit 1.0 a few days ago. Some of the reviews compare it favourably to Polytopia and Hexarchy, but there's no demo available, and I'm hesitant to give it a spin after bouncing off the other games. So I was curious if any Civ ... fanatics found any appeal in any of these games or other similar mini 4X games. Maybe my expectations for these games is too high?

In the meantime my solution has been to try to mod Civ itself to be able to play a full match in one sitting, with varied results

What I wish is that Firaxis would just release CivRev for PC (apparently they built it on PC according to Sid Meier) but I don't expect that will ever happen. Seems they've got their hands full with Civ 7.

 

[The_J]

I've played the demo of Ozymandias, and I quite liked it (also some others of the staff, but some others not).
I'm not anymore much of a gamer, so short time frames appeal to me, which can be squeezed in between. I actually had not thought that a short 4X game would work, but for me Ozymandias works quite well.
I think part of the basic 4X appeal is to optimize your empire over the map, depending on the terrain, and that it does well. Other parts are obviously simplified, and you should not expect to get 100s of hours of of them, but ... well, I think a 100 should still be possible.

Another game for this category is PocketCiv, https://store.steampowered.com/app/1532240/PocketCiv/ .

 

[Pedro P]

Well, my favorite civ related experience was hundred hour long campaign of Civ 4 Caveman 2 Cosmos. I am a lover of bloat and more content than I can swallow. So you can guess my opinion on mini 4x and other minimalist games like Old World.

Would be more neutral on it IF I also got my mega bloated games. But nope.

 

[Thrasybulos]

Haven't tried any of them, so can't help you, sorry.
I'm considering pulling the trigger on Ozymandias, though. The first "X" is the one I care the least about, but then again I'm apparently one of the rare people who'll replay the same Civ map again and again (first to beat it, then beat it better, then beat if differently).

Now, one thing I don't understand...

4X games designed to be played in short sessions

I know that it's the terminology employed on those games' pages... but it makes no sense to me.
They're games designed to be completed in short sessions.

A standard game of civ can most definitely be played in short sessions: just play a few turns at a time.
It might take a month to complete a game, but where's the problem ?

 

[The_J]

Haven't tried any of them, so can't help you, sorry.
I'm considering pulling the trigger on Ozymandias, though. The first "X" is the one I care the least about, but then again I'm apparently one of the rare people who'll replay the same Civ map again and again (first to beat it, then beat it better, then beat if differently).

I can't find it on Steam, but on GOG there is still the demo available https://www.gog.com/en/game/ozymandias_bronze_age_empire_sim_demo .

 

[bmaupin]

So you can guess my opinion on mini 4x and other minimalist games like Old World.

I've never heard of Old World described as minimalist. My understanding is it's just as complex as Civ and games last just as long. I wouldn't consider it a mini 4X at all and I'm not aware that it claims to be such.

I know that it's the terminology employed on those games' pages... but it makes no sense to me.
They're games designed to be completed in short sessions.

Good catch, I updated my post to fix the wording.

 

[bmaupin]

I've played the demo of Ozymandias, and I quite liked it (also some others of the staff, but some others not).
I'm not anymore much of a gamer, so short time frames appeal to me, which can be squeezed in between. I actually had not thought that a short 4X game would work, but for me Ozymandias works quite well.
I think part of the basic 4X appeal is to optimize your empire over the map, depending on the terrain, and that it does well. Other parts are obviously simplified, and you should not expect to get 100s of hours of of them, but ... well, I think a 100 should still be possible.

I finally tried Ozymandias and I like it! I was turned off by the lack of random maps. Some have argued it's not a true 4X because it lacks exploration (all maps are historic and fully revealed) and indeed it does feel much different to me compared to Civ. But in a weird way it works. Polytopia feels much more like Civ but it's so watered down it feels unsatisfying to me, whereas Ozymandias feels much different, a different take on a turn-based historic strategy. It has some of the map painting vibes of Civ and also reminds me a little bit of some of the Civ scenarios that have fixed historic maps.

I too appreciate the much shorter play time. I miss Civ and I wish they would release a different game mode or another CivRev, but for now Ozymandias has become my go-to Civ replacement.

I can't find it on Steam, but on GOG there is still the demo available https://www.gog.com/en/game/ozymandias_bronze_age_empire_sim_demo .

Thanks for sharing the link to the GOG demo. I like to try games before buying.

 

[danjuno]

I haven't tried any, which would y'all say is closest to Civ IV?

 

[Quintillus]

I haven't tried any, which would y'all say is closest to Civ IV?

I agree with bmaupin, I would not call Old World minimalist at all, but it does have strong Civ IV vibes, just being limited to antiquity.

Beyond that, Ozymandias is the only one I have tried, but I liked it quite a bit. There are quite a few scenarios (I eventually picked up all the expansion maps), and they can play quite differently depending on who you play as. And the games are short enough (30-45 minutes) that it's possible to try again and employ a different strategy.

In some ways, I think the smaller scope makes it easier to wind up with an elegant design, as well as a competent AI, than games which have a great breadth of scope.

Yield looks interesting, although I'll probably skip Hexarchy as non-physical deck builders have never appealed to me.

The other "mini 4x" that I've played is 50 Years. It's very limited (including clearly dated visual design), yet has just enough that I came back to it a number of times, trying to win as a different civilization with a different bonus - and especially on higher difficulties, making use of the civ-specific bonuses is important. I like Ozymandias more, but 50 Years predates Polytopia by more than three years, and with 89% positive reviews, shows that there was interest and some success in the genre by 2017.

To me these games target a different part of my interest in games than the epic scope of Civ, Old World, Total War, and the like. They target the board game itch. Something that lasts a partial hour to a couple of hours, and can be played multiple times. They don't wind up with the epic narratives that the longer-scope games can, but neither do the die down into tedium in the later stages. And there are times that is what I want.

 

[bmaupin]

In some ways, I think the smaller scope makes it easier to wind up with an elegant design, as well as a competent AI, than games which have a great breadth of scope.

I thought the same thing; I find the AI in Ozymandias pleasantly difficult and more competent than some of the later Civ games.

I haven't tried any, which would y'all say is closest to Civ IV?

This is a tough one to answer. I started looking into mini 4X games as a replacement for Civ games but as Quintillus mentioned, they end up playing quite differently.

My suggestion would be to try them for yourself. I strongly favour games with demos that let me try them first so I'm only going to highlight those:

• As already mentioned, Ozymandias demo is available on GOG
• Hexarchy has a demo available on Steam
• Polytopia doesn't have a demo but is free on mobile apparently

A couple honourable mentions:

• Ironically (because it gets so much flak compared to mainline Civ) in some ways Civilization Revolution is closest to Civ. In particular it shares the same engine as Civ IV and in many ways feels the most like a shorter version of Civ, even though matches can still be a few hours long. But unfortunately it can be hard to acquire and play without emulation.
• Offworld Trading Company isn't a 4X but an RTS, but I mention it because it was designed by Soren Johnson (designer of Civ IV) and also it fits into the category of games designed to be played in sessions of less than an hour. It's not well advertised but the multiplayer client is free and includes tutorials so it also serves as a demo. You can get it by signing up for Mohawk's mailing list; see here for more info: Offworld Multiplayer is now FREE!