Apostle promotions

[Abaxial]

It seems to me that one can divide the eight apostle promotions into four good and four bad:

Debater - best
Translator - good
Orator - good
Pilgrim - good

Martyr - useless (I don't intend my apostles to get killed)
Indulgence vendor - mostly useless
Barbarian conversion - useless in the late game when you actually have apostles
Medic - useless

It also seems to me that whenever you get a choice of three promotions, while you would expect to get an even break of good and bad, almost always get either one good and two bad, or three bad. I wonder if this is deliberate?

 

[kaspergm]

Proselytizer - good

Also, depending on circumstances, Martyr can be worth it.

 

[Rosty K]

If I am a suzerain of Yerevan I end up only picking Proselytizer and Debater promotions.

 

[Scaramanga]

Heathen conversion can be used on barbarians that spawn from low amenities.

And martyr is not bad if it's not your religion and you like relics.

 

[Laurana Kanan]

Heathen Conversion is great when used on Partisans. In one game I created three tank armies and two helicopter armies with minimal faith costs for a few apostles. Chaplain can come in handy early in the game before Medics are available. For Martyr I like to use up all the Apostle's charges except one and then go on combat spree until they die to create a relic.

 

[Art Morte]

I wouldn't call Debater the best. You only need a few of them if going for religious victory and much more of those that give 3x spread strength, extra spreads and 75% elimination of other religions.

Medic is theoretically very good, a medic for military units with 4 movement. The problem there is that it's very rarely needed given how bad the AI is at combat.

 

[Temppu]

It seems that the division you made is to groups: (i) Reigious victory oriented and (ii) geared towards other types of victory conditions.

Martyr - Reliquaries and Tourism victory.
Heathen conversion - free Caravels!
Medic - well, a Medic indeed.
Indulgence vendor - Yeea, this is crappy crap.

 

[Scaramanga]

Indulgence vendor: the city has to size 1 or converting in less than 10 turns.

 

[eleven11]

The only 2 promotions that are mandatory are Debater and Proselytizer. You need at least 1 debater for home turf protection. After the first or maybe the 2nd they aren't so important. Proselytizer is the best for spreading mid and late game. Hit a city once with a Proselytizer and finish it off with missionaries. None of the other promotions are even really needed. Ever.

 

[Trav'ling Canuck]

Debater, Proselytizer, Translator, Orator, Pilgrim - all good for spreading your religion; which is best depends on the particular circumstances

Martyr - as pointed out, great for tourism

Heathen Conversion - good for non-domination games as a way to supplement your military; can sometimes get you units that help with a tech boost; as pointed out, grabbing a free Caravel is often very useful

Medic - great for domination games, helps your units recover and press forward much more quickly than they otherwise would

Indulgence Vendor - when is gold bad? basically, always worse than a promotion that matches your victory type, but better than a promotion that doesn't


Although I'm not a fan of the way religious spreading/combat has been implemented in Civ 6, I think the developers did a good job with the promotion options for Apostles.

 

[kaspergm]

Indulgence vendor - Yeea, this is crappy crap.

Indulgence Vendor could use a minor buff, something like: Gain 100 gold every time you use a charge on a city following another religion (+/- for the first time). That way, at least you wouldn't have to micromanage it quite as much.

 

[Trav'ling Canuck]

Indulgence Vendor could use a minor buff, something like: Gain 100 gold every time you use a charge on a city following another religion (+/- for the first time). That way, at least you wouldn't have to micromanage it quite as much.

Change it to Televangelist after you research Radio and station him/her in a Broadcast Centre to generate gold each turn from neighbouring foreign cities?

 

[Kakdaddy]

Kongo would like to have a word with you about your insults to Martyr.

 

[Abaxial]

If your apostle dies in debate then your religion takes a hit in nearby cities, which is counterproductive, assuming you have a religion that gives you benefits from having followers around the world. Winning debates is a better way of converting cities than actually using spreads (though you have to do some spreading). Never use an apostle's last spread - keep him as backup for your debating team, and keep them tight together with a couple of gurus. Then religious victory is probably the easiest of them all..

 

[kaspergm]

Kongo would like to have a word with you about your insults to Martyr.

Well, Khmer would like to have a word with you about your defense for Martyr. There are always special cases ...

 

[RealHuhn]

In my current game as Sythia, I converted 12 barbarian swordsmen and 4 crossbowmen in 5 turns with one apostle (he also had the 2x additional charges promo) right before the musketmen upgrade. Needless to say, my neighbour had a bad time.

Also, how is medic useless? xD

 

[Abaxial]

I forgot about Proselytiser in the OP, which is a good promotion. So with five good ones, how is it I always get at most one out of three good?

I don't rate medic as I train apostles to go out and spread the Word, not trail after the military (who are just doing garrison, me being a peaceful soul - most of the time).

 

[kb27787]

Well, Khmer would like to have a word with you about your defense for Martyr. There are always special cases ...

Simple... You cannot suicide missionaries since they cannot attack.
I find that the AI is smart enough to avoid attacking your martyrs (sometimes... I find they just ignore them and run their apostles straight for their target city). With apostles you can just ram them into whatever (missionary, inquisitor, etc.) you come across.

 

[Scaramanga]

Maybe you could martyr an apostle near your own city to earn a nice holy war Casus belli.

 

[Rosty K]

Maybe you could martyr an apostle near your own city to earn a nice holy war Casus belli.

Not that getting someone to convert your city is a problem though.