A lot of the discussion in the thread about a new Egyptian civilization is about Arabia. I'm starting a new thread so I can contribute my two cents without derailing the topic further. ~ In my opinion Arabia is a blanket civ. A playable entity that represents a multitude of Muslim entities from the past that not rarely were at odds with one another. With the introduction of new playable muslim civilizations the original characteristics and UHV's are up for reimagination. ~ Things I really liked about the Original Arabian civilization. 1. The attempt to forcefully convert Europe to Islam (hence the original UP of spreading islam to a city upon conquest) 2. The crusades. Stomping a huge stack of hostile units into the ground and gaining lots of Great General points was fun, albeit a bit distracting. Things I didn't care so much about. 1. Empire building. Although I liked it how the ai sprawls over the map I don't really care too much about copying that behaviour myself. The conquest UHV's felt arbitrary. (I understand they represent the extent of influence of a certain dynasties, I don't identify too much with them. I am leaning towards the opinion that in an ideal world a mod about the middle ages should be more about familial ties than countries, as nationalism was not yet an invented concept back then, but I guess there are certain limitations to achievable concepts with Civ4 as a modding platform.) 2. The religious bonus. Faster growth is nice (even if you receive most of it when you don't really need it anymore) but the bonus to military production is negligable. Arabia has relatively poor production and rich commerce. Imho hiring mercs is way more efficient than building the units yourself (even with a bonus to production) Things I felt were missing. 1. The projection of Arabic power during the middle ages. (the completion of the two conquest UHV's are but a pale imitation of what the muslim clans achieved/threatened to achieve) 2. Arabic intellectual superiority over medieval Christian Europe. 3. The Mongol conquests. (Baghdad is not on the map, but an event to narrate about the fall of Baghdad, accompanied by some refugees/free citizens/free specialists in exchange for money and/or faith would have been nice to accompany the few Mongol units I faced) ~ I understand to historically simulate the height of the Muslim Power there are only thirty turns ingame. Personally I'd prefer to give them more time (than they had in history) to project their power over setting a more modest goal. (I derive a certain sense of satisfaction outperforming history. But I am well aware others like to try to replay history more.) Also it seems like a nice opportunity to grant Arabia some (perhaps restricted to early play) unconventional abilities. Paradropping units (or a variant thereof) comes to mind. (paradropping in contrast to increased movement needs not run into engine limitations (it is already implemented for the AI in vanilla Civ4)) ~ I'm looking forward to learning what others liked about the Original Arabia and what they'd like to see in the post Egyptian introduction one.