1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

Archipelago starts are too dependent on luck

Discussion in 'Civ4 - General Discussions' started by morchuflex, Oct 15, 2007.

  1. morchuflex

    morchuflex Emperor

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2004
    Messages:
    1,389
    Location:
    Paris
    Hello.

    I mostly play archipelago because I like exploration, peaceful building, and don't want too many land wars.

    But unfortunately, more often than not, I get so poor a start that i have to restart.

    Typical, frequent poor starts are:
    - Being too far away from anyone prior to Astronomy. You're pretty much dead, unless you have a great island on your own. Which isn't that frequent.
    - Starting near the pole, with mostly ice and toundra around you.
    - Being stuck on a small island that you must even share with a neighbour, while nearby another civ enjoys three times as much space by itself (extremely frequent).
    - Low resource starts. It is common for me to have neither copper, nor horses nor iron within reach. Or no luxury resource whatsoever.

    I really wish archipelago starts would be more balanced.
     
  2. Elandal

    Elandal King

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2006
    Messages:
    870
    Location:
    Finland
    All starts are luck dependant, regardless of map.
    - Isolated starts aren't specific to Archipelago.
    - Tundra starts aren't specific to Archipelago.
    - Potential territory for easy peaceful expansion varies and variance isn't specific to Archipelago.
    - Low resource starts aren't specific to Archipelago.

    I like Archipelago maps too. And I find resource issues, for example, to be just fine on them - no harder than on land maps.
     
  3. Cookie Crumbs

    Cookie Crumbs Emperor

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2006
    Messages:
    484
    If you're isolated just go into builder mode and crank out wonders, that's what I did in my latest game. I built the Colossus and Great Lighthouse just to deny them for everyone else, because I didn't have any international trade routes and got to Astronomy early.
     
  4. morchuflex

    morchuflex Emperor

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2004
    Messages:
    1,389
    Location:
    Paris
    Granted. But bad starts are more painful on archipelago, because more often than not, you don't have the option to rush a neighbor and take better land.
    If I spawn on a remote, iced part of a pangea, I have at least some chance to get horses or copper nearby and rush the nearest neighbor. Not true on most archipelagos.
     
  5. thelibra

    thelibra Future World Dictator

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2007
    Messages:
    323
    Location:
    Somewhere, TX
    Have you tried changing the Archi Options? I mean, there's Snaky Continents, Tiny Islands, and actual Archipelago. You might also consider lowering the water level to give you a few more land connections.
     
  6. Elandal

    Elandal King

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2006
    Messages:
    870
    Location:
    Finland
    Tiny Islands with High Water level is the way to go - then colonize the tiny spots and savour each and every tile of land you have - it will never be cottaged as it can be made into hammers. Oh yes - no Dutch. Even if Dikes are quite long into the game, they would still unbalance that setting.
     
  7. peter450

    peter450 Prince

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2006
    Messages:
    392
    use a low sea level settings the islands spawned will be a bit larger an more productive
     
  8. sabo

    sabo My Ancestors were Vikings

    Joined:
    May 29, 2002
    Messages:
    4,116
    Location:
    Minneapolis, City of Lakes
    Or you could play continents and have really BIG islands.. :lol:
     
  9. lulu135

    lulu135 Warlord

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2007
    Messages:
    135
    What about the "balanced resources" option? Some of the map scripts have that.
     
  10. Elandal

    Elandal King

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2006
    Messages:
    870
    Location:
    Finland
    "balanced resources" is cheap - you'll never have to war for that one specific resource or whatever.
     
  11. Carabodes

    Carabodes Timid Viking Warlady

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2007
    Messages:
    229
    Location:
    Bergen, Norway
    Try out "Islands". Set it to "Several extras", "Low Sealevel" and "Many Tiny Islands" (if I remember correctly).

    Then you'll most of the time get one island all to yourself, as do the other civs and there will be some spare islands (where the barbarians rule - go get'em :trouble:), and normally there will be so many tiny islands that you can actually circumnavigate with a workboat very early - but so can the other civs, and they really are early out there, so make haste.:eek: I've only had one game when one of the civ's were out of reach untill I had caravels, and that was Shaka, and I can honestly say that I didn't mind a bit that he was isolated and totally backwards.:lol: And if isolation strikes your own civ, you can always reload.:crazyeye:

    Island maps are great if you like exploring and settling early in new territory whilst you have time to expand peacefully (most of the time, but not always) on your own island. With "standard resources" you may find yourself lacking metal or horse (so get into a boat), with "balanced resources" you'll most likely (but not always) have metal and horse on your own island.

    I find these maps fun and challenging. They do make sailing and writing priority techs, though, and even if you start alone, you can't neglect your military (and especially not your navy), 'cause the other civs will find you just as easily as you find them. :D And the barbs have plenty of galleys, with units aboard!
     
  12. kazapp

    kazapp Emperor

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2006
    Messages:
    1,058
    This sounds like a great start!

    (Neighbour = free second city! ;) )
     
  13. Carabodes

    Carabodes Timid Viking Warlady

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2007
    Messages:
    229
    Location:
    Bergen, Norway
    According to your latest epiphany (loved the story:D), changes do not always help! :rotfl:
     

Share This Page