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Are F-15s all that bad?

Discussion in 'Civ3 - General Discussions' started by Lab Monkey, May 22, 2002.

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America's UU, what do you think?

Poll closed May 27, 2002.
  1. Yeah, I'll give it a chance.

    17 vote(s)
    22.1%
  2. No way, roll on the Delta Force unit!

    25 vote(s)
    32.5%
  3. Don't play America/don't care/don't know

    35 vote(s)
    45.5%
  1. Lab Monkey

    Lab Monkey Peace thru ultraviolence!

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    Everyone (including me) seems to regard the American UU as being rather useless. But is it?
    It's bombing power is admittedly bad, but this is against a city. Airstrikes against land units would be much more deadly, and the late triggering of a GA would put America in the lead in, say, a race to build a spaceship (just as they are in real life), wheras all the other civs have likely been over and done with their GA ages ago.

    Erm, this is just theoretical (I've never got past Industrial with America), but does anyone else have any thoughts on this?
     
  2. WarlordMatt

    WarlordMatt Emperor

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    The F-15 frickin' SUCKS!!!! It doesn't historically represent America as a civ. It should be the Minuteman of the Revolution! Replace the F-15!! (I wish I could post a smilie waving a protest sign here.)
     
  3. akinkhoo

    akinkhoo Biotechnologist

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    I didn't see the american building spacecraft to AC yet....
    and so far only the moon race was won,
    we haven't seen the mars mission neither..... :D
    (russia have many 1st just as the american, like the 1st satellite, animal, man, woman, space station, multi-module space station)

    beside, both russia and america were using
    german engineering design during the race.... :rolleyes:

    I do feel the US should have a paratroop as their UU.
    But the F15 will do fine....
     
  4. Lab Monkey

    Lab Monkey Peace thru ultraviolence!

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    Okay, so they only got to the moon (and that was probably faked), but let's face it, their late golden age is upon us, and the rest of the world is culture flipping in droves. When the McDonalds' flag is flying, you know that the yanks have conquered!

    The Minutemen is a good idea, but it's only this century that they've become a real world player, and I think that counts as a true golden age. Not that the revolution is a small deal...
     
  5. Mîtiu Ioan

    Mîtiu Ioan Deity

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    I like the F-15.

    Really - in both sense. This a UU which is almost useless for the AI but may be tricky if used wisely by a good player.

    Regrads
     
  6. MrBiggBoy

    MrBiggBoy High Admiral

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    i think a better UU would be stealth bomber or maybe a special marine or paratrooper.
     
  7. Knight-Dragon

    Knight-Dragon Unhidden Dragon Retired Moderator

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    Only one problem I have with the F-15; it comes too late. By which time, I have won, more or less, and merely 'wrapping up'. :)
     
  8. joycem10

    joycem10 Deity

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    im considering a new UU for the americans. my idea would be a tank based upon the M4 Sherman. It would have the same stats as a regular tank but would cost 25% less shields to build. this would still accurately reflect a late industrial early modern golden age.

    i find this much more historically accurate as well. although the M4 was not the match of the german tiger, panther or pzkw IV (although it matched up best against the pzkw IV and that is open to debate) america was able to field it in overwhelming numbers. the 25% discount would reflect the american industrial edge in the late industrial modern era.
     
  9. Cerryl

    Cerryl Warlord

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    Bombing in general sucks, from catapults to stealths, so I don't think there's much to get excited about with the American UU.
     
  10. Richard III

    Richard III Duke of Gloucester

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    I have to admit I've played a few dozen games to their conclusion and I haven't even SEEN one.
     
  11. Mîtiu Ioan

    Mîtiu Ioan Deity

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    How did you fight in latest war without bombing units ??
    I agree that catapult sucks but later artilery is extremely usefull !!

    Regards
     
  12. cracker

    cracker Gil Favor's Sidekick

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    I voted no but definitely do not support the idea of the Delta Force Unit as a UU.

    Having the F-15 as a UU represents one of the best examples of a design decision by someone who does not play the game.

    The only times the F-15 comes into play is if you disable diplo, space race, and culture victory options and diliberately play on a lower difficulty level to make the game last as long as possible.

    The F-15 comes too late for most "trying to win" strategies because I have either already won the game or already been trounced by that point in time.

    Also, having a UU that depends of the really lame CIV3 aerial combat system to generate a Golden Age is almost as bad as making a bombard unit the UU for a civ and then disabling the unit so it can never kill anyone else.

    When I get a GA for the Americans it is wonder based.

    The only UU in the game that is truly almost as useless than the F-15 is the Man-O-war.
     
  13. Cerryl

    Cerryl Warlord

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    I use bombing to pillage square improvements if I can afford it, but I will build any multi movement attack unit before a bombing unit.



     
  14. Jaybe

    Jaybe civus fanaticus Supporter

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    And if you are subject to any war weariness, you will suffer the consequences.

    War weariness is aggravated by losing units (according to current 'theory'). Bombardment units are well worth the production/maintenance costs, reducing the number of units you lose because your ground units are attacking weakened defenders.

    In an offensive war, when you bomb terrain improvements you will just have to rebuild them yourself when you have taken the area. BTW, I do that myself, sometimes.
     
  15. TheEvilCheater

    TheEvilCheater Chieftain

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    U dont use artillery man your crazy. Before the battle hit u can knock out the opponents roads and resources. Well im going to make a new uu for the americans. I like the sherman tank idea but i wonder if theres a way to make a unit like the privateers? I was thinking of adding mercenaires to the game.
     
  16. punkbass2000

    punkbass2000 Des An artiste

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    I would argue that the US has not achieved a culture domination as much as a corporate one, assuming that you can consider corporations to be a part of the American state.
     
  17. Cerryl

    Cerryl Warlord

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    True, but I never fight wars in a represenative Govt type if I can help it. Wars that are declared on you are easier to fight if you have to.

    But in 200+ games, I find no use in bombing units with the exception of naval bombardment, it suits me just fine.

     
  18. tenpenny

    tenpenny Chieftain

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    I like the F-15, and I do feel it is representative of US history. It would be more perfect if the Americans could have two units, however, the F-15 and a historically accurate super carrier to ferry them around. Today's Nimitz class carriers carry 85 aircraft - that's far more than they paltry 4 of Civ III's carriers. Granted, the Nimitz class carriers don't carry F-15's in real life, but that's an innacuracy I think could be forgiven.

    The only other units I've thought of for America were a nuke that you could use and still have everyone like you or a boomer - a virtually undetectable nuclear sub that could carry a good number of ICBMs and would scare (deter) the hell out of the enemy to the point they wouldn't dream of attacking you.

    As for bombardment - I couldn't play without it. I normally end up with 60-100 artillery units and 20-30 bombers on a standard map.
     
  19. Mr Spice

    Mr Spice Emperor

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    I have never used the F-15 since I never played the Americans and i have also never encountered it since I always kill the Americans long before modern ages. But perhaps I should give it a try, might be fun to play US sometimes. :)
     
  20. JohnnyReb

    JohnnyReb Warlord

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    People, people! I cannot believe the most obvious choice hasn't been mentioned yet! The U.S.M.C. - that's right, the :ar15: Marines. The Few, The Proud, The Marines. If you're not from the USA I can understand, but for any natives it really should be obvious. Legendary, there is no other word.

    Now, the stats, that's got me puzzled. My suggestion would never be approved, but it would be to give them a 50% bonus when making amphib. assaults. But oh well, I guess I could go with 9/6/1.
     

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