Ren
Communist Nazi
What I mean is, have we westerners reached our peak (genetically, probab;y not technologically though but possibly) ?
Are we going downhill?
- Thread starter Ren
- Start date
Simon Darkshade
Mysterious City of Gold
No, it still awaits the ascent to ultimate power of its greatest ever leader, one referred to in ancient texts as The Dark and Shaded One. 
Ren
Communist Nazi
Now who could that be...
The Dark and Shaded One....just a legend....like Prester John, the Cthulhu pantheon or Keyser Soze. But there have been dire rumblings from the Terra Australis of late, and who knows which nameless gods have been clasped to the aboriginal bosom?
A good question though. It's been my opinion that we may, despite all appearances, be living in a golden age that future generations will look back on with regret. The global population is booming, the threat of terrorism is rife, countries like the UK may be running out of space or close to it, what about oil reserves?, etc. etc. On the other hand, people have cars, international travel is easy, there is a lot of personal freedom, easy access to information, and so on. Does this mean, I ask myself, that we are now balancing on a pin, with great personal liberty but with a great drop in front of us as a result of our current profligacy? Will global warming be the death of us, for example? Will the oil wells dry up, leaving us to burn car tires for warmth? I have no idea.
So I definitely think it is possible (but not definite by any stretch of the imagination) that we may only be able to go downhill from here.
A good question though. It's been my opinion that we may, despite all appearances, be living in a golden age that future generations will look back on with regret. The global population is booming, the threat of terrorism is rife, countries like the UK may be running out of space or close to it, what about oil reserves?, etc. etc. On the other hand, people have cars, international travel is easy, there is a lot of personal freedom, easy access to information, and so on. Does this mean, I ask myself, that we are now balancing on a pin, with great personal liberty but with a great drop in front of us as a result of our current profligacy? Will global warming be the death of us, for example? Will the oil wells dry up, leaving us to burn car tires for warmth? I have no idea.
So I definitely think it is possible (but not definite by any stretch of the imagination) that we may only be able to go downhill from here.
duke o' york
It don't mean a thing....
Do your posts from last June really count as ancient texts though Simon? 
I am uncertain as to what could constitute the pinnacle of human endeavour. One person could claim that in the world of sculpture nothing has been created since that is better than Michelangelo's David and therefore this is the peak which sculpture has reached. Or that Pele's goal against Fluminese in 1965 was the greatest ever and cannot be surpassed. World records are being broken all the time, but once the margins which one can shave off a record become smaller and smaller then will we stop and say "That's it - this race is perfect!" or will be strive to beat other records? What about the finest example of battefield use of longbows - in the battle of Lens in 1533 - or other things that now seem dated. The use of bows and arrows in warfare may be obsolete, but this ought not detract from the skills of those who used them simply because they are no longer used. Everyone will have their own opinion as to what is the best example in each different field and which of these fields ought to be foremost in calculating human endeavour so this is a non-question. It is entirely subjective and very little could be agreed on at all.
I am uncertain as to what could constitute the pinnacle of human endeavour. One person could claim that in the world of sculpture nothing has been created since that is better than Michelangelo's David and therefore this is the peak which sculpture has reached. Or that Pele's goal against Fluminese in 1965 was the greatest ever and cannot be surpassed. World records are being broken all the time, but once the margins which one can shave off a record become smaller and smaller then will we stop and say "That's it - this race is perfect!" or will be strive to beat other records? What about the finest example of battefield use of longbows - in the battle of Lens in 1533 - or other things that now seem dated. The use of bows and arrows in warfare may be obsolete, but this ought not detract from the skills of those who used them simply because they are no longer used. Everyone will have their own opinion as to what is the best example in each different field and which of these fields ought to be foremost in calculating human endeavour so this is a non-question. It is entirely subjective and very little could be agreed on at all.
CurtSibling
ENEMY ACE™
The great era is yet to come...
The era when ENEMY ACE rules this world and ushers
in a new era of human evolution and development!
His name will live forever in the annals of civ...oops! wrong power trip!
On the serous side, I think we should be thinking of the whole
world instead of east and west geopolitics...humanity will come
into it's own when we break free of the confines of this world.
Colonising space will hopefully put an end to our delusions
and small-minded ignorance about ourselves as a race..
....or maybe I WILL rule the world!
The era when ENEMY ACE rules this world and ushers
in a new era of human evolution and development!
His name will live forever in the annals of civ...oops! wrong power trip!
On the serous side, I think we should be thinking of the whole
world instead of east and west geopolitics...humanity will come
into it's own when we break free of the confines of this world.
Colonising space will hopefully put an end to our delusions
and small-minded ignorance about ourselves as a race..
....or maybe I WILL rule the world!
Maj
Emperor
It sure as hell isn't going uphill. I can tell you that much.
knowltok2
Deity
I think we may be at a crossroads in possibilities. Our technology will either save us or damn us. I tend to be optimistic about this and think that it will save us, but the case is there to make for those who think we are already damned.
The question is, can we use our current technology to transform itself and our society into self-sustaining models? Both are going to need changed, and population preasures will likely be the driver.
The question is, can we use our current technology to transform itself and our society into self-sustaining models? Both are going to need changed, and population preasures will likely be the driver.
Magnus
Diplocat
I cannot say whether it will go up or down....
but I CAN Guarantee it will be very interesting.
but I CAN Guarantee it will be very interesting.
The Balrog
***Not Perm Banned***
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2001
- Messages
- 713
Originally posted by CurtSibling
The great era is yet to come...
The era when ENEMY ACE rules this world and ushers
in a new era of human evolution and development!
His name will live forever in the annals of civ...oops! wrong power trip!
On the serous side, I think we should be thinking of the whole
world instead of east and west geopolitics...humanity will come
into it's own when we break free of the confines of this world.
Colonising space will hopefully put an end to our delusions
and small-minded ignorance about ourselves as a race..
....or maybe I WILL rule the world!
You forgot your TM after ENEMY ACE!!
Ren
Communist Nazi
You're going downhill, Balrog 
Which brings to mind that ancient curse:
May you live in interesting times.
Are we going downhill? I think you've been watching too much Olympic skiing.
I think we will go down hill in some areas, but that humans will continue to survive and progress. For example, we may destroy this planet and its environment, but we will probably be able to move on to another planet and continue developing.
I think we will go down hill in some areas, but that humans will continue to survive and progress. For example, we may destroy this planet and its environment, but we will probably be able to move on to another planet and continue developing.
TrailblazingScot
I was kittenOFchaos
We have yet to achieve true decadence...until then we will never match the Roman Civilisation 
BlueMonday
Can I Kick It?
From God Bless You, Mr. Rosewater by Kurt Vonnegut:
"I should like to speak of the Emperor Octavian, of Ceasar Augustus, as he came to be known. This great humanitarian, and he was a humanitarian in the profoundest sense of the word, took command of the Roman Empire in a degenerate period strikingly like our own. Harlotry, divorce, alcoholism, liberalism, homosexuality, pornography, abortion, venality, murder, labor racketeering, juvenile delinquency, cowardice, atheism, extortion, slander, and theft were the height of fashion. Rome was a paradise for gangsters, perverts, and the lazy working man, just as America is now. As in America now, forces of law and order were openly attacked by mobs, children were disobediant, had no respect for their parents or their country, and no decent woman was safe on any street, even at high noon! And cunning, sharp-trading, bribing foreigners were in the ascendency everywhere. And ground under the the heels of the big city money-changers were the honest farmers, the backbone of the Roman Army and the Roman soul.
"What could be done? Well there were soft-headed liberals then as there are bubble-headed liberals now, and they said what liberals always say after thay have led a great nation to such a lawless, self-indulgent, polygot condition: 'Things have never been better! Look at all the freedom! Look at all the quality! Look how sexual hypocrisy has been driven from the scene! Oh boy! People used to get all knotted up inside when they thought about rape or fornication. Now they can do both with glee!'
"And what did the terrible, black spirited, non-fun-loving conservatives of those happy days have to say? Well, there weren't many of them left. They were dying off in ridiculed old age. And their children had been turned against them by the liberals, by the purveyors of synthetic sunshine and moonshine, by the some-thing-for-nothing political strip teasers, by the people who loved everybody, including the barabarians, by people who loved the barbarbains so much they wanted to open all the gates, have all the soldiers lay their weapons down, and let the barbarians come in!
"That was the Rome that Caesar augustus came home to, after defeating those two sex maniacs, Antony and Cleopatra, in the great sea battle of Actium. And don't think I have re-create the things he thought when he surveyed the Rome he was said to rule. Let us take a moment of silence, and let each other think what he will of the stews of today."
There was a moment of silence, too, about thirty seconds that seemd to some like a thousand years.
"And what methods did Caesar Augustus use to put this disorderly house in order? He did what we are so often told we must never, ever do, what we are told will never, ever work: he wrote morals into law, and he enforced those unenforceable laws with a police force that was cruel and unsmiling. He made it illegal for a Roman to behave like a pig. Do you hear me? It became illegal! And Romans who were caught acting like pigs were strung up by thier thumbs, thrown down wells, fed to lioins, and given other experiences that might impress them with the desirability of being more decent and reliable than they were. did it work? You bet you boots it did! Pigs miraculously disappeared! And what do we call what followed this now-unthinkable oppresion? Nothing more or less, freinds and neighbors, than 'The Golden Age of Rome.'
"Am I suggesting that we follow this gory example? Of course I am. Scarcely a day has passed during which I have not said in one way or another: 'Let us force Americans to be as good as they should be." Am I in favor of feeding labor crooks to lions? Well to give those who get such satisfaction from imagining that I am covered with primordial scales a little twinge of pleasure, let me say, 'Yes. Absolutely. This afternoon, if it can be arranged.' To dissapoint my critics, let me add that I am only fooling. I am not entertained by cruel and unusual punishments, not in the least. I am fascinated by the fact that a carrot and a stick can make a donkey go, an that this Space Age discovery may have some application in the world of human beings."
And so on. The Senator said that the carrot and the stick had been built into the Free Enterprise System, as concieved by the Founding Fathers, but that the do-gooders, who thought people shouldn't ever have to struggle for anything, had buggered the logic of the system beyond all recogniton.
In summation: he said, "I see two alternatives before us. We can write morals into law, and enforce those morals harshly, or we can return to a true Free Enterprise System, which has the sink-or-swim justice of Caesar Augustus built into it. I emphatically favor the latter alternative. We must be hard, for we must become again a nation of swimmers, with the sinkers quietly disposing of themselves. I have spoken of another hard time in ancient history. In case you have forgotten the name of it, I shall refresh you memories: 'The Golden Age of Rome,' freinds and neighbors, "The Golden Age of Rome.'"
"I should like to speak of the Emperor Octavian, of Ceasar Augustus, as he came to be known. This great humanitarian, and he was a humanitarian in the profoundest sense of the word, took command of the Roman Empire in a degenerate period strikingly like our own. Harlotry, divorce, alcoholism, liberalism, homosexuality, pornography, abortion, venality, murder, labor racketeering, juvenile delinquency, cowardice, atheism, extortion, slander, and theft were the height of fashion. Rome was a paradise for gangsters, perverts, and the lazy working man, just as America is now. As in America now, forces of law and order were openly attacked by mobs, children were disobediant, had no respect for their parents or their country, and no decent woman was safe on any street, even at high noon! And cunning, sharp-trading, bribing foreigners were in the ascendency everywhere. And ground under the the heels of the big city money-changers were the honest farmers, the backbone of the Roman Army and the Roman soul.
"What could be done? Well there were soft-headed liberals then as there are bubble-headed liberals now, and they said what liberals always say after thay have led a great nation to such a lawless, self-indulgent, polygot condition: 'Things have never been better! Look at all the freedom! Look at all the quality! Look how sexual hypocrisy has been driven from the scene! Oh boy! People used to get all knotted up inside when they thought about rape or fornication. Now they can do both with glee!'
"And what did the terrible, black spirited, non-fun-loving conservatives of those happy days have to say? Well, there weren't many of them left. They were dying off in ridiculed old age. And their children had been turned against them by the liberals, by the purveyors of synthetic sunshine and moonshine, by the some-thing-for-nothing political strip teasers, by the people who loved everybody, including the barabarians, by people who loved the barbarbains so much they wanted to open all the gates, have all the soldiers lay their weapons down, and let the barbarians come in!
"That was the Rome that Caesar augustus came home to, after defeating those two sex maniacs, Antony and Cleopatra, in the great sea battle of Actium. And don't think I have re-create the things he thought when he surveyed the Rome he was said to rule. Let us take a moment of silence, and let each other think what he will of the stews of today."
There was a moment of silence, too, about thirty seconds that seemd to some like a thousand years.
"And what methods did Caesar Augustus use to put this disorderly house in order? He did what we are so often told we must never, ever do, what we are told will never, ever work: he wrote morals into law, and he enforced those unenforceable laws with a police force that was cruel and unsmiling. He made it illegal for a Roman to behave like a pig. Do you hear me? It became illegal! And Romans who were caught acting like pigs were strung up by thier thumbs, thrown down wells, fed to lioins, and given other experiences that might impress them with the desirability of being more decent and reliable than they were. did it work? You bet you boots it did! Pigs miraculously disappeared! And what do we call what followed this now-unthinkable oppresion? Nothing more or less, freinds and neighbors, than 'The Golden Age of Rome.'
"Am I suggesting that we follow this gory example? Of course I am. Scarcely a day has passed during which I have not said in one way or another: 'Let us force Americans to be as good as they should be." Am I in favor of feeding labor crooks to lions? Well to give those who get such satisfaction from imagining that I am covered with primordial scales a little twinge of pleasure, let me say, 'Yes. Absolutely. This afternoon, if it can be arranged.' To dissapoint my critics, let me add that I am only fooling. I am not entertained by cruel and unusual punishments, not in the least. I am fascinated by the fact that a carrot and a stick can make a donkey go, an that this Space Age discovery may have some application in the world of human beings."
And so on. The Senator said that the carrot and the stick had been built into the Free Enterprise System, as concieved by the Founding Fathers, but that the do-gooders, who thought people shouldn't ever have to struggle for anything, had buggered the logic of the system beyond all recogniton.
In summation: he said, "I see two alternatives before us. We can write morals into law, and enforce those morals harshly, or we can return to a true Free Enterprise System, which has the sink-or-swim justice of Caesar Augustus built into it. I emphatically favor the latter alternative. We must be hard, for we must become again a nation of swimmers, with the sinkers quietly disposing of themselves. I have spoken of another hard time in ancient history. In case you have forgotten the name of it, I shall refresh you memories: 'The Golden Age of Rome,' freinds and neighbors, "The Golden Age of Rome.'"
darkChild
Holder of the Ildatch
thats one hell of a post, dude...
at least one of us is staying on the topic of the thread.
Has western civilization reached it's peak?
"Beep"... Syntax error. Illegal apostrophe. Suggest correction:
Has western civilization reached its peak?
Are we going downhill?
"Beep"... Semantic confusion. Cultural ambiguity. Choose between:
1. going downhill = getting worse, deteriorating;
2. going downhill = getting easier from now on.
"Beep"... Session ended.
"Beep"... Syntax error. Illegal apostrophe. Suggest correction:Has western civilization reached its peak?
Are we going downhill?
"Beep"... Semantic confusion. Cultural ambiguity. Choose between:1. going downhill = getting worse, deteriorating;
2. going downhill = getting easier from now on.
"Beep"... Session ended.
CurtSibling
ENEMY ACE™
That was a Shareware version!
Here's the real thing!
ENEMY ACE
KABOOM!
Atom bombs all over the world from russia and pakistan and it all ends this moment...
And what does it matter now how great we were? How much technolog we have? How much money we have?
The fool, The wise, The rich and the poor, they all die sooner or later. period.
Atom bombs all over the world from russia and pakistan and it all ends this moment...
And what does it matter now how great we were? How much technolog we have? How much money we have?
The fool, The wise, The rich and the poor, they all die sooner or later. period.
